BigBlueToe

I'm considering another project - building up an old Nishiki touring frame I got at a garage sale. I was toying with the idea of using downtube shifters, but I love indexed shifting so much I don't want to go back to friction. Are there downtube shifters available with indexing, at least for the rear derailleur, that would work with Shimano derailleurs? If not, then how about Campagnolo?

I would do bar-ends. I like them. I don't really want brifters, mostly due to the expense. I'm trying to keep the cost of this project down. I just wondered if downtube indexed shifters were a possibility.

Thanks!

jaypee

Yep, you can still get them from Shimano.

[edit]

Looks like they only still make them in the Dura Ace line. Regardless, that's what I'm running with my XT drivetrain and it works fine.

mrhedges

YES. the original shifters on my trek 400 were indexed downtube shifters. The bike is from the late 80s and I think this was common then. They were "shimano Light Action" shifters and could be switched between indexed and friction. having used both down tube and bar ends i prefer bar ends though. You could probably find a set of down tube for next to nothing if you look around. People over at C&V could probably help you more, they never throw anything away.

otherwise a new set of shimano 8 speed bar ends runs about 50 bones.

what kind of Nishiki? What year? I do love them old bicycles. i used to have a nishiki cresta.

BikerBoom

Triathletes use them on their time trial bars. These are not cheap at $80 but maybe you can find them used on Ebay.

https://www.nashbar.com/profile.cfm?sku=3042

staehpj1

Yes how many speed cluster are you thinking of? I have a set of 105 7 speed shifters that might work for you. I really don't want to sell them, but if you can't find anything else let me know. You can probably find some on ebay.

Personally, I like Brifters best, then downtube, and then bar ends as a last resort.

chrispe

Index down tube shifters were made for bikes with 6,7,8,9, and 10 speeds. The 6 for sure and I think the 7 speed ones could be used with freewheels instead of the cassette freehub system, but 7 could also be used with that. 6 and 7 are spaced 126mm in the back which is most likely what your nishiki is, and are cheaper, but are older and may be harder to find things for. If you find a shimano freewheel made for these you could probably just put that on the current wheels that are on there. Also these were sold in a variety of models ranging from dura-ace to some fairly cheap ones. On the other hand you may need to cold set your frame if you want to use the 8 9 and 10 speed systems which are spaced 130mm and the shifters by themselves are probably in the 50-80$ range on ebay, but you will also need new wheels and a cassette.

oldride

I have downtube shifters on one of my bikes and STI on 2 other bikes. I like both but the DT are still great to use. Very positve and acurate shifting. Indexed rear and friction front. The rear can be set to friction by turning the knob.

Does the bike have DT brazed-on bosses?
https://www.jensonusa.com/store/produ...ed+Levers.aspx

BigBlueToe

Thanks everyone for the responses. That's the kind of information I was hoping for.

I'm not sure what kind of Nishiki it is. It had Suntour components on it with a triple crankset. There are lowrider brazeons on the forks. I was cruising garage sales looking for anything. I saw a set of old panniers on the Nishiki. I thought I should buy the panniers for my wife, in case she ever got a hankering to try going on a bike tour with me - maybe an overnight. I told the guy I'd give him $20 for the panniers. He said it was a deal if I'd take the bike too. I couldn't pass that up.

It's a little too small for me. I'm 6'4" and I think it would be about right for someone who's around 6' even. I hate to see it sitting idle. I've got a few spare parts around that could work, but I'd have to supplement them with Ebay finds, and probably some new items. My older brother (who's 6'1") expressed a bit of interest. I think he had a bike with downtube shifters back in the day, so that's why I was thinking of going that route. (I now prefer barends myself.) I thought it was at least worth checking into.

If I get further along with the project, maybe I'll post some pictures. It's not a high priority right now though. I'm putting together an Allez for myself at the moment, and just started refurbishing my son's old Rockhopper with 24" wheels. We've got some nieces and nephews coming along who will fit on it.

wrk101

I have indexed Shimano 105, Shimano 600, and Shimano Exage DT shifters; one set on a 1988 Schwinn Tempo, the second on a 1990 Giant, and the third on a 1993 Peugeot (two of the bikes were cheap thrift store finds). I also had a set of Suntour indexed DT shifters (rear only) on a 87 Trek (flip bike). Actually, I picked up the shifters (NOS) off ebay, as someone had converted the Trek to thumb shifters and flat bars.


Also, you may get used to the friction shifters. Two out of my three regular rides are friction DT shifter bikes (84 Lotus and 82 Univega, both Suntour by the way). After primarily riding a brifter bike, I am getting comfortable with friction. Those Suntour components on your Nishiki are probably pretty nice!

BigBlueToe

I'm old enough to have been an avid rider before index shifting was invented. My old 10-speed (a Raleigh Gran Prix) that I rode more more than a decade and thousands of miles had Simplex derailleurs and downtube, friction shifters. I had no problem with them, and liked the ability to move both levers at once with both hands, like when I crested a hill and started down - I'd do a quick, one-handed shift from low to high.

On that bike you had to move the levers a little ways past where the derailleur was centered on the gear to get the chain to shift, then you'd back off to get it centered. Getting things right involved adjustments and looking down to see that the derailleur was centered on the gear. I got good enough that I could usually get things right by feel and by listening, but I still usually looked down to check.

When I got my first index-shifting bike, I thought it was wonderful! No more of that shifting a little past then backing off. The only looking down was to check which gear I was in. However, I understand that part of the reason this is possible is because of the ramps built into the gears. They give the chain a little "boost" to help it shift. Those old gears were straight cut.

I'm wondering if the ramps would allow friction shifters today to shift without having to shift past and back off.

Still, though I'm comfortable with friction shifting, I still fail to see why it would be preferable to indexed. Anyone?

staehpj1

I like indexed, but friction is more flexible when replacing components. The newer drive trains do work better than your old grand prix and I suspect that you would find that yes "the ramps would allow friction shifters today to shift without having to shift past and back off."

mrhedges

its main advantage (friction shifting) is its simplicity. any friction shifters will work with any derailed combo. It makes it easy if you are putting together a bike on the cheap.

moleman76

for the low-cost approach, eBay is definitely your friend. With a bit of patience you can find Shimano 105 or better indexed shifters for 6, 7, 8 or more cogs on the rear.
You can probably find bar-ends, but they will likely cost more.

Do read the eBay ad copy carefully...not every seller knows what they are selling.

And, the shifters want to match the freewheel brand (or at least the freewheel brand's spacing).

Non-indexed classique Suntour barends will set you back about $40 or more, plus you need the cable housing stops for the downtube. Indexed 7-speed 105 shifters (actually, usually only the right (rear) shifter is indexed, so that you can fine-tune the positioning of the front derailleur to eliminate chain rubbing on the derailleur cage up front) may only cost $10 or $15. Most of the indexed downtube shifter have an adjustment so you can de-select indexing if you like.

wrk101

Its not so much an advantage, it is more about a cost/benefit analysis of converting to indexed. When a vintage bike comes with nice friction components in good operating condition, it can be difficult to justify the cost of converting. Granted, I would not remove indexed components to switch a bike to friction mode.

There also is a certain simplicity to riding a 25 year old bike, with all of its original components, as it was designed to be ridden. But that is purely a personal choice and one I cannot justify for others. Here's my $16 ride.

seeker333

https://www.velo-orange.com/diacosish.html

brandenjs

I found a 1982 Peugeot P8 for my 12 year old son this past summer. It came with stem mounted friction shifters, I had a set of Shimano 400EX clamp-on indexed DT shifters and the derailleurs to match. I knew he would get frustrated with the friction so these made a great improvement and he is able to pay more attention to the road instead of getting the gear he wants. I can ride anything as long as it is tuned correctly. I've got them all...

Enthusiast

I swapped out a 5-speed wheelset for a 9-speed wheelset on a bike with an early 70s Campy Nuovo Record Gruppo with bar-end shifters and found that the shifting improved markedly. I adjusted the limit screws a bit and everything worked well. I've also used that same 9-speed wheelset on a different bike with early 90s 7-speed 105 gruppo with downtube shifters. I just had to switch the 'light-action' rear shifter from indexed to friction to get it to play nice.

That said, I'm a big fan of indexed shifting and use it whenever I can afford it.

tarwheel 

Dura Ace downtube shifters are indexed and can be set to run friction mode as well. I love my DA downtube shifters and use them in index mode.