Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Touring Have a dream to ride a bike across your state, across the country, or around the world? Self-contained or fully supported? Trade ideas, adventures, and more in our bicycle touring forum.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 06-05-09, 12:18 AM   #1
BengeBoy 
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
BengeBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Seattle, Washington, USA
Bikes: 2014 Pivot Mach 5.7 MTB, 2009 Chris Boedeker custom, 1988 Tommasini Prestige, 2007 Bill Davidson custom; 1988 Specialized Stumpjumper
Posts: 6,941
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
New SRAM groupset - 2x10 wide-range MTB drivetrain w/touring applications

If I'm reading the stories correctly, this new high-end SRAM XX groupset would make a killer 2x10 drivetrain for touring bike applications.

Though released as a MTB groupset, it is compatible with SRAM's 10-speed road shifters.

With an available 11-36 rear cassette, you can get a double-chainring drivetrain with a low gear around 19 inches and a high of about 96 gear inches, or with the largest chainring combination a low of 21 gear inches, high of 111.

http://www.bikeradar.com/news/articl...groupset-21756

Very light, very $$.

Last edited by BengeBoy; 06-05-09 at 12:32 AM.
BengeBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 12:44 AM   #2
plodderslusk
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Norway
Bikes:
Posts: 1,379
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
I have been very sceptical to ten speed (old and grumpy mostly), but having used a CX bike with 10s 105 through winter with no problems I am a convert. This XX setup seems like a great idea, there will probably come less expensive versions later.
plodderslusk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 12:51 AM   #3
rodar y rodar
weirdo
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Reno, NV
Bikes:
Posts: 1,962
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
The cranks and rings sound very interresting- I like the idea of wide range doubles, though for a touring bike I can live just fine with a $100 triple. Did you notice they clain something to the efect of "all bolts use a `standard` T-25 wrench, eliminating the need to carry weird stuff". Okay, I paraphrazed the weird stuff part, but it still sounds like they`re smoking crack if they think using Torx headed bolts simplifies things. I`d take a set of those cranks anyway- even if I had to carry a Torx with it for some strange reason.
rodar y rodar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 12:56 AM   #4
plodderslusk
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Norway
Bikes:
Posts: 1,379
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
I am puzzled by this torx thing too. Maybe it is because aluminum bolts will last longer with torx than hex ? (old and grumpy, very sceptical to alloy crank bolts, hex or torx )
plodderslusk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 01:13 AM   #5
rodar y rodar
weirdo
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Reno, NV
Bikes:
Posts: 1,962
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I imagine the Torx do last longer, but it`s such a simple matter to replace an allen with a worn out head. Then again, I guess you could always go around and swap all the torx screws for allens before taking the bike out on the road.
rodar y rodar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 06:18 AM   #6
Barrettscv 
Have bike, will travel
 
Barrettscv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Edwardsville, Illinois
Bikes: Colnago Nuova Mexico, Eddy Merckx Corsa Extra, Pinarello Gavia, Schwinn Paramount, Motobecane Grand Record, Peugeot PX10, Serotta Nova X, Simoncini Cyclocross Special, Origin8 monstercross, Pedal Force CG2 and CX2
Posts: 10,409
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 14 Post(s)
I wonder if you can use the very interesting 10 speed cassette & derailleur with a Cyclocross type compact double crank & chainrings, derailleur & brifters. They both have the 10 speed road chain in common.
__________________
When I ride my bike I feel free and happy and strong. I'm liberated from the usual nonsense of day to day life. Solid, dependable, silent, my bike is my horse, my fighter jet, my island, my friend. Together we will conquer that hill and thereafter the world.

Last edited by Barrettscv; 06-05-09 at 06:38 AM.
Barrettscv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 06:51 AM   #7
reptilezs
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: boston, ma
Bikes:
Posts: 2,852
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodar y rodar View Post
The cranks and rings sound very interresting- I like the idea of wide range doubles, though for a touring bike I can live just fine with a $100 triple. Did you notice they clain something to the efect of "all bolts use a `standard` T-25 wrench, eliminating the need to carry weird stuff". Okay, I paraphrazed the weird stuff part, but it still sounds like they`re smoking crack if they think using Torx headed bolts simplifies things. I`d take a set of those cranks anyway- even if I had to carry a Torx with it for some strange reason.
the t25 torx is common in the mtb crowd because that is what is used to attach the disc rotors on to the hubs.
reptilezs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 07:13 AM   #8
staehpj1 
Senior Member
 
staehpj1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Bikes:
Posts: 8,838
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Sounds like a great setup, but too expensive to suit me. Cheaper versions will likely follow if it gets acceptance in the market.
staehpj1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 09:01 AM   #9
BengeBoy 
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
BengeBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Seattle, Washington, USA
Bikes: 2014 Pivot Mach 5.7 MTB, 2009 Chris Boedeker custom, 1988 Tommasini Prestige, 2007 Bill Davidson custom; 1988 Specialized Stumpjumper
Posts: 6,941
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by staehpj1 View Post
Sounds like a great setup, but too expensive to suit me. Cheaper versions will likely follow if it gets acceptance in the market.

The price of the cassette alone is stunning to me - $ 328. I think Shimano XTR cassettes are in the same range.

I do like the idea of a wide range double....I have been test-riding pote ntial commuting/light touring bikes and have ridden a couple of cross bikes with 2 x 9 gearing -- something like a 48/34 compact crank in the front and a 11-32 cassette in the back. You get a narrower chainline than on a MTB triple, you lose about half a pound of weight, and shifting overall is simpler than with a triple. That's getting down in the range where you could consider loaded touring....with this XX set-up you could go even lower.

Last edited by BengeBoy; 06-05-09 at 12:09 PM.
BengeBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 09:23 AM   #10
kuan
Twincities MN
 
kuan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Salsa, Cannondale, Surly.
Bikes:
Posts: 2,527
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I think an 8 speed built "like a tank" would be more durable. But who's counting? Some of you guys go 20k miles on a single chain
__________________
www.marrow.org
kuan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 09:35 AM   #11
truman
It's true, man.
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: North Texas
Bikes: Cannondale T1000, Inbred SS 29er, Supercaliber 29er, Crescent Mark XX, Burley Rumba Tandem
Posts: 2,726
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
The T25 Torx head is already prevalent among mountain bikers for use on 6 bolt disk brake rotors. Granted, disks haven't really caught on among tourers, but that would explain their point of it being pretty common, anyway.

Nice looking group. I like Sram a lot, but my friend's 1337 Sram Red group sure does make a lot of noise.


whoops, somebody beat me to the Torx.
truman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 10:30 AM   #12
Bekologist
totally louche
 
Bekologist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: A land that time forgot
Bikes: the ever shifting stable loaded with comfortable road bikes and city and winter bikes
Posts: 18,025
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
that cassette will come in handy for people wanting to set up a 10 speed shimano equipped road bike with mountain gearing.

XX 11-32 10 speed cassette on a shimano 10 speed drivetrain with a long cage road derailleur might do the trick, otherwise switch to a shadow XTR would do it just fine I'd bet.
Bekologist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 11:05 AM   #13
nun
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Bikes: Rivendell Quickbeam, Rivendell Rambouillet, Rivendell Atlantis, Circle A town bike, De Rosa Neo Primato, Cervelo RS
Posts: 3,272
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
This is almost old news. I've been using a 42/26 double with an 11/34 9 speed cassette for a few years. The 42/26 is done using the middle and inner rings of a sugino 110/74 triple. I get 103" to 21" with this set up.

Also as the SRAM is a MTB setup the front derailleur set up will have to be tweeked to clear the chainstays on most touring bikes.
nun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 11:40 AM   #14
positron
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Bikes:
Posts: 1,273
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
meh,

Id much rather have rohloff with a boone titanium cog and chainring for the price.

But I guess it would be great for the uber competetive cat-1 tourers out there...
positron is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 12:00 PM   #15
john bono
Senior Member
 
john bono's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 732
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I'm not feeling the love for this groupset. One of my beefs with my current touring setup with I think an 11- 32 rear is that there are a number of times I'd like to be in between two gears, which isn't as much of an issue with my road bike. With an 11-36 setup and only a double chainring, those gaps are only going to be worse.
john bono is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 12:09 PM   #16
rodar y rodar
weirdo
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Reno, NV
Bikes:
Posts: 1,962
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by nun View Post
This is almost old news. I've been using a 42/26 double with an 11/34 9 speed cassette for a few years. The 42/26 is done using the middle and inner rings of a sugino 110/74 triple. I get 103" to 21" with this set up.
I read a thread about that setup recently (maybe it was yours) and it sounded prety good, but isn`t it pretty much only feasible with friction FD? Honestly, I don`t much care for STI, so I didn`t pay much attention to that aspect of it.
rodar y rodar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 01:22 PM   #17
nun
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Bikes: Rivendell Quickbeam, Rivendell Rambouillet, Rivendell Atlantis, Circle A town bike, De Rosa Neo Primato, Cervelo RS
Posts: 3,272
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by rodar y rodar View Post
I read a thread about that setup recently (maybe it was yours) and it sounded prety good, but isn`t it pretty much only feasible with friction FD? Honestly, I don`t much care for STI, so I didn`t pay much attention to that aspect of it.
Yes friction FD is best so you can trim the FD as you move across the cassette. Doing this I can use all
9 rear cogs with both of my front rings, even though I don't do that because of the bad chain line
nun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-05-09, 03:07 PM   #18
The Smokester
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: N. California
Bikes:
Posts: 1,410
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bekologist View Post
that cassette will come in handy for people wanting to set up a 10 speed shimano equipped road bike with mountain gearing.

XX 11-32 10 speed cassette on a shimano 10 speed drivetrain with a long cage road derailleur might do the trick, otherwise switch to a shadow XTR would do it just fine I'd bet.
I have a 12-30 10-speed cassette from IRD on my 50/34 compact crankified road bike using an XTR Shadow. It works but the rear shifting tends to hang in the second and third lowest gear which is somewhat annoying. So, of course, I am now intrigued by the possibility that SRAM might do better.

BTW, the ratio of 1.5 that SRAM is using on these XX front rings is very large so that a switch from the big front ring to the small will also entail a lot of corresponding gear changing on the rear. 'Course, with such a wide range on the rear this might not happen very often.
The Smokester is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-09, 12:16 AM   #19
Chris_W
Gear Combo Guru
 
Chris_W's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Switzerland
Bikes: Spec' Tarmac (road), Ridley Fenix (commuter & fast tourer), Salsa Mamasita (MTB), CoMo Speedster (tandem), Surly Big Dummy (cargo), Airnimal (folder)
Posts: 2,241
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I already run pretty much this setup on my touring/commuting bike. Up front, I have a 105 triple road crankset with chainrings of 26 teeth, 42 teeth, then a chainguard. Out back, I have an 11-28 10-speed cassette. However, I really hated the 19-22 tooth jump between cassette cogs when I went touring a couple of weekends ago, so I'm probably going to switch it for a custom combo using a 12-25 10-speed cassette, removing the 16 tooth, and adding a single 28 tooth ring at the top end taken from a Deore 9-speed 11-32 cassette.

Anyway, my point is that there is nothing stopping you from achieving this kind of gear combo already, at a price that is much cheaper than the XX gear will be. And I agree with the post above that using a cassette that has 11-32 or wider causes the gaps between gears to be too large - it would fine for mountain biking, but not for touring.
Chris_W is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-09, 02:04 AM   #20
rodar y rodar
weirdo
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Reno, NV
Bikes:
Posts: 1,962
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I guess what`s acceptable for gaps depends a lot on what you`re used to. I have identical 11-32 8 speed cassettes on two bikes and I don`t mind the gaps at all.

That new group in question is certainly expensive and nothing will ever be the right solution for everybody, but it does present some new ideas, at least as far as off the shelf mass produced options go- I`m happy to see it even though most of it wouldn`t do me any good personally.
rodar y rodar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-09, 07:17 AM   #21
Garthr
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: where
Bikes: Franklin Frames Custom, Rivendell Bombadil
Posts: 1,289
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
The Sram groupset doesn't sound like the Ultimate anything...... but a hose-job of the pocket book.

I guess I'm a dinosaur in the very myopic world of so-called "modern" cycling. If you really want small gear steps for touring .. . the ultimate is half-step plus granny. But it's fallen out of favor with the mega clusters. It's still doable though. Classic HS+G is 5,6 and even 7 speeds, but 8 is doable. Use a 12-32 cassette, 24-44-48 rings. Use a gear chart and you'll see the sweetness of it. I know .. . . many people complain they have to use their left hand ! Oh the murder! You really don't have to use it as much as you think, you use it when you need to fine tune a gear that's a little to high or low.

It's also best with at least a friction left shifters(dt, barcon or thumbshifters), so it's not for the auto-brifters.

Give it a thought Think outside the Index-Auto Box .
Garthr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-06-09, 11:32 AM   #22
Speedo
Senior Member
 
Speedo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Boston Area
Bikes: Univega Gran Turismo, Guerciotti, Bridgestone MB2, Bike Friday New World Tourist, Serotta Ti
Posts: 1,998
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Garthr View Post
the ultimate is half-step plus granny.
Mmmmm. Half-step with granny. Mmmmm.

I gave up on my half-step with granny when I had trouble finding a front derailleur with plates that would allow two chainrings that close together in tooth count.

Speedo
Speedo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-09, 07:03 AM   #23
Garthr
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: where
Bikes: Franklin Frames Custom, Rivendell Bombadil
Posts: 1,289
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedo View Post
Mmmmm. Half-step with granny. Mmmmm.

I gave up on my half-step with granny when I had trouble finding a front derailleur with plates that would allow two chainrings that close together in tooth count.

Speedo

I've used a 9 speed Shimano 105 double (fd-5600) since 2000. Works like a charm
An Ultegra 9 speed works as well.
The Tiagra and Sora 8 speed ones, while I've not tried them, I'm pretty sure they work too by looking at the cages.

Older Suntour(Lite is a good one) and Shimano(600EX, 105, DA, Ultegra etc.) doubles work fine too. It's likely the old Campy NR/SR works too, I've got them, but never bothered to try them.

What doesn't work though, are the latest 10 speed models, as they do not allow the cages to be moved far enough anymore.

Ebay or a shop that stocks close out and unsold "older" (ha ha) parts is where to get 'em these days.

There's lots of FD's out there from the last 30 years. It's suprising the number of NOS or lightly parts found on ebay. I bought a set of vintage 80's Deore FD/RD for about $30 shipped. The FD was new, the RD next to new.

So . . . they're out there Speedo.
Garthr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-09, 07:47 AM   #24
Bekologist
totally louche
 
Bekologist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: A land that time forgot
Bikes: the ever shifting stable loaded with comfortable road bikes and city and winter bikes
Posts: 18,025
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
5600 double will shift a half step plus granny crank? are you sure?
Bekologist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-07-09, 09:43 AM   #25
Garthr
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: where
Bikes: Franklin Frames Custom, Rivendell Bombadil
Posts: 1,289
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bekologist View Post
5600 double will shift a half step plus granny crank? are you sure?
I wish I was..... I get the numbers mixed up. I use the 9 speed 5500. I think the 5600 is a 10 speed model, which does not work for HS.
Garthr is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:07 AM.