Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Touring Have a dream to ride a bike across your state, across the country, or around the world? Self-contained or fully supported? Trade ideas, adventures, and more in our bicycle touring forum.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 07-06-10, 08:26 PM   #1
rothenfield1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
rothenfield1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Montereyish
Bikes:
Posts: 2,330
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Sport(Light) Touring bike build questions

It started with a desire to build a fully loaded touring rig. I posted a thread asking for suggestions on the build of a Soma Saga and the responses were great. But, in the end, I decided that I should build something more practical. A bike capable of carrying a 30 lbs load plus my 185 lbs for weekend excursions.

I donít want to go into every nitty-gritty build detail, but there are 3 areas I do have questions about.

The frame: Iím considering a cross bike such as the Surly Cross Check or Soma Double Cross. But with short chainstays and higher BB, they both seem prone to handling issues when loaded on the rear only as well as heel clearance issues. It seems that even with a light load, moving some of the load up front would be prudent. Or, is that not necessary?

Wheelset: Both bikes can accommodate 130 or 135 hubs. I have a set of 36H Mavic Open Pro rims. Would building them with XT hubs be overkill? Would 105 or Ultegra hubs be more appropriate?
Or; I have a 32H Mavic CXP22 with Specialized hubs wheelset that I could Ďborrowí from another bike. But 32H and unknown spokes seem iffy to me?

Crankset: A MTB crank with 44T outer ring, again, seems overkill to me for a light tourer. I think a 48/36/26 would be a good combo with a 11-32 cassette. But, there doesnít seem to be many mid-range trekking triples out there. I see Sugino and some MTBs with 46T a lot. Anyone have any other crank options that would make sense for light touring?

Thanks in advance.
rothenfield1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-10, 08:30 PM   #2
10 Wheels
Galveston County Texas
 
10 Wheels's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: In The Wind
Bikes: 2010 Expedition, 03 GTO
Posts: 30,104
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 394 Post(s)
I have a 50/39/30. Rode from NY to LA.
__________________
[SIZE=1][B]What I like about Texas[/B]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PGukLuXzH1E

Set F1re To The Ra1n ( NY Night Rain Ride)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7jfcWEkSrI
10 Wheels is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-10, 08:53 PM   #3
rothenfield1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
rothenfield1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Montereyish
Bikes:
Posts: 2,330
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by 10 Wheels View Post
I have a 50/39/30. Rode from NY to LA.
That might be the way to go. A quick Google search showed lots of nice options. Thanks!
rothenfield1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-06-10, 08:58 PM   #4
LeeG
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 4,703
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
the Cross-Check has long horizontal dropouts so if you put the rear wheel near the back of the drop outs it's close to 17.5", not 16.7" for chainstay length.

At first I thought rear load only would result in bad handling but I was wrong although I'd be inclined to move some of that 30lbs forward into the frame or on the front end and not use big panniers.

I've put on an Axiom Streamliner DLX rear rack but using ss straps instead of their clunky mounts to connect to the seat stays. With Ortliebs two smaller panniers I have heel clearance for my size 11 ft. The narrow Axiom rack is SOLID. With fenders the regular seat stay struts would interfere but with ss straps it fits fine. Seriously it's as solid if not more than a Tubus Cargo that costs over twice as much.

I originally set the bike up with single Surly 38t ss chainring and chainguard with a 11-28 cassette for in town and 11-34 for that cross country trip I missed out on. Now it's got a 30t inner, 44 middle w. chainguard and 12-32 cassette.

On the front end I've got a small Nitto type front rack that I could strap a small duffle or compression bag on.

I don't see any problem putting a low rider front rack and panniers on if you wanted to go with two sets of small panniers.

The wheels are Velocity Synergy with OC rear wheel. 32 spoke front and 36spoke OC rear.

Last edited by LeeG; 07-06-10 at 09:03 PM.
LeeG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-10, 03:14 AM   #5
martianone
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Northern VT
Bikes: recumbent & upright
Posts: 1,911
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 10 Post(s)
Consider a Soma Smoothie ES ?
Mine is set up for light touring with 105 level components, 2x9 drive train.
A Mavic CXP23 wheelset, generic crankset from another project with 26 and 40 chainrings with 11-34 cassette; bar end shifters. Cane creek long reach brakes and salmon kool stop pad with cross top brake levers. Schwalbe marathon tires. Over a 1000 km so far, ride is good, handling nice [even lightly loaded - 10 kg] - leaving friday for a 650 km ride, going to use a saddle bag.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg P1010255.jpg (107.9 KB, 56 views)
martianone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-10, 07:13 AM   #6
Garthr
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: where
Bikes: Franklin Frames Custom, Rivendell Bombadil
Posts: 1,289
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by rothenfield1 View Post
Crankset: A MTB crank with 44T outer ring, again, seems overkill to me for a light tourer. I think a 48/36/26 would be a good combo with a 11-32 cassette. But, there doesnít seem to be many mid-range trekking triples out there. I see Sugino and some MTBs with 46T a lot. Anyone have any other crank options that would make sense for light touring?
.
Velo Orange sells the XD triple with 48/36/26 rings.

They also have SIX new cranksets due in August. The Grand Cru 110 double is shown first, the triple doesn't have a photo yet.
http://velo-orange.blogspot.com/2010...bcd-crank.html
http://velo-orange.blogspot.com/2010...cranksets.html





http://velo-orange.blogspot.com/2010...nk-update.html


They're all listed here..... this is the dealers web site, but it show what WILL be available.
http://www.voimports.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=29

Last edited by Garthr; 07-07-10 at 07:17 AM.
Garthr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-10, 07:24 AM   #7
truman
It's true, man.
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: North Texas
Bikes: Cannondale T1000, Inbred SS 29er, Supercaliber 29er, Crescent Mark XX, Burley Rumba Tandem
Posts: 2,726
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
The XT M771 goes, 48, 36, 26. I have it on my Vaya for light touring.
truman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-10, 08:42 AM   #8
sstorkel
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Bikes: Cervelo RS, Specialized Stumpjumper FSR Pro, Schwinn Typhoon, Nashbar touring, custom steel MTB
Posts: 5,427
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by 10 Wheels View Post
I have a 50/39/30. Rode from NY to LA.
I rode from SF to LA with 22lbs of gear and was quite happy I'd replaced my 50/39/30 with a 48/38/26! I could have done the ride with my road triple, but the trekking crank made long hills seem just a bit easier. I've got a standard 12-27 cassette, though...
sstorkel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-10, 10:59 AM   #9
Bacciagalupe
Professional Fuss-Budget
 
Bacciagalupe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Bikes:
Posts: 6,438
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Cross bikes work fine for touring; people have toured successfully on them for decades. Unless you have massive feet or huge panniers pushed as far forward as possible, I doubt you'll have heel strike issues.

In terms of handling, just keep the weight low and it'll be fine. You could even get something like the Topeak Super Tourist rack, which lowers the panniers a little bit.
Bacciagalupe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-10, 11:19 AM   #10
BengeBoy 
Senior Member
 
BengeBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Seattle, Washington, USA
Bikes: 2014 Pivot Mach 5.7 MTB, 2009 Chris Boedeker custom, 1988 Tommasini Prestige, 2007 Bill Davidson custom; 1988 Specialized Stumpjumper
Posts: 6,941
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I went through this process a year ago and ended up with a Shimano 105 triple (50-39-30) with NOS Shimano 105 9 speed brifters and a 9 speed rear cassette (11-34). While normally I like lower gearing on a touring bike, this is working well for light loads and some pretty stiff climbing.

If I were doing this today, I would have a 10-speed system - Shimano 105 triple, Shimano 105 10-speed brifters, and a new SRAM Apex 10-speed rear cassettee (12-36), with an Apex rear derailleur.
BengeBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-10, 11:30 AM   #11
sstorkel
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Bikes: Cervelo RS, Specialized Stumpjumper FSR Pro, Schwinn Typhoon, Nashbar touring, custom steel MTB
Posts: 5,427
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BengeBoy View Post
If I were doing this today, I would have a 10-speed system - Shimano 105 triple, Shimano 105 10-speed brifters, and a new SRAM Apex 10-speed rear cassettee (12-36), with an Apex rear derailleur.
Unfortunately, that setup won't work. SRAM rear derailleurs are only compatible with SRAM shift levers due to the 1:1 actuation...

Edit: In addition the Apex RD is limited to a max of 32-teeth on the cassette. Not surprisingly the only Apex cassette on SRAM's site seems to be an 11-32. If you want 12-36 you'll probably need a pricey XX rear derailleur and cassette.

Last edited by sstorkel; 07-07-10 at 11:35 AM.
sstorkel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-07-10, 12:41 PM   #12
truman
It's true, man.
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: North Texas
Bikes: Cannondale T1000, Inbred SS 29er, Supercaliber 29er, Crescent Mark XX, Burley Rumba Tandem
Posts: 2,726
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Plus two chains to link together. My Sram 970 was long enough for a 48t ring and a 34t low gear, but you'd need another link or two to go any bigger.
truman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-10, 01:17 AM   #13
BengeBoy 
Senior Member
 
BengeBoy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Seattle, Washington, USA
Bikes: 2014 Pivot Mach 5.7 MTB, 2009 Chris Boedeker custom, 1988 Tommasini Prestige, 2007 Bill Davidson custom; 1988 Specialized Stumpjumper
Posts: 6,941
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by sstorkel View Post
Unfortunately, that setup won't work. SRAM rear derailleurs are only compatible with SRAM shift levers due to the 1:1 actuation...

Edit: In addition the Apex RD is limited to a max of 32-teeth on the cassette. Not surprisingly the only Apex cassette on SRAM's site seems to be an 11-32. If you want 12-36 you'll probably need a pricey XX rear derailleur and cassette.

oops - you're right. I was typing , not thinking.

In any case, I *would* today try the SRAM set-up w/10 speed SRAM brifters. You're right; the apex's largest rear cog is 32.

Last edited by BengeBoy; 07-09-10 at 10:36 AM.
BengeBoy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-10, 09:04 AM   #14
sstorkel
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Bikes: Cervelo RS, Specialized Stumpjumper FSR Pro, Schwinn Typhoon, Nashbar touring, custom steel MTB
Posts: 5,427
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by BengeBoy View Post
In any case, I *would* today try the SRAM set-up w/10 speed SRAM brifters. You're right; the apex's largest rear cog is 32.
I might try it myself! I've got SRAM Red on my road bike and love the DoubleTap shifting. Apex with a compact double (50/34) crank and 11-32 cassette gives gearing that ranges from 28-122 inches. My current touring setup (48-38-26 crank + 12-27 cassette) goes from 26 to 108 inches, which isn't that different...
sstorkel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-10, 09:42 AM   #15
The Smokester
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: N. California
Bikes:
Posts: 1,410
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by rothenfield1 View Post
It started with a desire to build a fully loaded touring rig. I posted a thread asking for suggestions on the build of a Soma Saga and the responses were great. But, in the end, I decided that I should build something more practical. A bike capable of carrying a 30 lbs load plus my 185 lbs for weekend excursions...
I wonder if the desire for a 30 lb load and a Sport(Light) may be exclusive? I have a Gunnar Sport which is capable of carrying a rack and panniers and is great for weekend credit card tours. However, it is spec'd with a load limit of 20lb for the rear rack.
The Smokester is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-10, 09:54 AM   #16
rogerstg
Fred-ish
 
rogerstg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Rhode Island
Bikes:
Posts: 1,800
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by rothenfield1 View Post
A bike capable of carrying a 30 lbs load plus my 185 lbs for weekend excursions.
What about this? Have you toured on it yet?



FWIW, I'd consider 30# of gear (plus bags/panniers) to be fully loaded warm-weather domestic touring.

Last edited by rogerstg; 07-08-10 at 10:00 AM.
rogerstg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-10, 10:23 AM   #17
rothenfield1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
rothenfield1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Montereyish
Bikes:
Posts: 2,330
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Wow! What a beautiful looking bike. Where ever did you find such a wonderful photo?

No, very unfortunately, I haven't been able to yet. I absolutely love that bike. I've been on some long day rides with about 10 lbs. of stuff. It was this bike that turned me from being a vintage road bike nut into wanting to build the best modern touring bike I could afford. When I was a youngin', I road my 10 spd Schwinn Continental all over the backroads of Southern Indiana. Then we moved and I never road again until about 5 years ago when I rediscovered the thrill and freedom of riding again. I've lost 60 lbs. and my favorite past-time is torquing on bikes. Now, times are tough, and as an independent contractor, I don't get vacations so my dream of riding Hwy 1 down the West Coast is not going to happen any time soon. I still feel a need to build a modern touring bike. For some reason I couldn't get inspired by the Saga. But, I do have an image in mind of what this bike could be.
http://www.somafab.com/doublecross_one.html
rothenfield1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-10, 10:26 AM   #18
staehpj1 
Senior Member
 
staehpj1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Tallahassee, FL
Bikes:
Posts: 8,895
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 21 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by rogerstg View Post
FWIW, I'd consider 30# of gear (plus bags/panniers) to be fully loaded warm-weather domestic touring.
Yeah, I was thinking the same thing when I read "light touring" in the original post. To me 30 pounds of gear including bags and panniers is just regular loaded touring.

BTW: The Sugino XD600 comes with 48/36/26 chainrings and with an 11-32 cassette I like it just fine for touring. I did replace the 26 with a 24 though.
staehpj1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-08-10, 03:11 PM   #19
rogerstg
Fred-ish
 
rogerstg's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Rhode Island
Bikes:
Posts: 1,800
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by rothenfield1 View Post
I still feel a need to build a modern touring bike. For some reason I couldn't get inspired by the Saga. But, I do have an image in mind of what this bike could be.
http://www.somafab.com/doublecross_one.html
Unless you have specific needs to be addressed, like more heel clearance or custom geometery due to irregular body measurements, you'll be hard pressed to find a new frame that gives a better ride. FWIW, I'd consider modernizing the drive train (but keep the BioPace) and other components as you feel necessary. That's what I did.
rogerstg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-10, 12:21 AM   #20
rothenfield1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
rothenfield1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Montereyish
Bikes:
Posts: 2,330
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I've decide not to change a thing on that bike. Besides the saddle, tires, bar tape and pedals; it's all original. In the vintage bike world, that means a lot. I thought about modernizing the bike, with barcons at least, but felt conflicted about changing what seemed to work so well. I started rebuilding lugged steel bikes a couple of years age, but getting my head around what it would take to build a modern touring bike has been a real challenge. I donít think there is any other type of cycling that puts more demands on a bike then what I see some of you doing carrying ungodly amounts of gear on every type of terrain in every condition around the world. It had me excited about trying to build such a bike until I had to face the reality that I wasnít going to be able to take a multi-week trip any time soon. So, I decided to build the best weekend warrior bike I could. Yes, I have the bike to do it now. But Iíd still like to try this and thereís a lot that Iím still learning about bikes.

For example; Iíd like to use the 36H Open Pro rims, but Iíve read mixed reviews about their durability for light touring. Would going with 135 MTB hub with a strong spoke make that much difference over a road hub like a 105 or Ultegra, or should I just start looking for a touring rim?

As far as the 30 lbs carry weight, Iím a fairly experienced backpacker and I know I could carry less, but for the purpose of this build, I wanted that weight range.
rothenfield1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-10, 09:33 AM   #21
LeeG
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Bikes:
Posts: 4,703
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
oh heck you've already got a nice bike. I don't think you'll get an appreciably lighter bike. My Cross-check with rack and fenders isn't a light bike. Your 30lbs makes the biggest difference. You might consider a minimal front rack to carry a compressed stuff sack. I've got an old Suntour bar con on the right bar end with the front derailleur shifter on the down tube.
LeeG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-10, 05:28 PM   #22
Bekologist
totally louche
 
Bekologist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: A land that time forgot
Bikes: the ever shifting stable loaded with comfortable road bikes and city and winter bikes
Posts: 18,025
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
shimano shadow rear derrailleurs go to 36.
Bekologist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-10, 08:00 PM   #23
rothenfield1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
rothenfield1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Montereyish
Bikes:
Posts: 2,330
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Well, Iím not sure if this project is going to ever get off the ground or not. Iíve been trying to sell my vintage Italian bike for several weeks now. I have someone who wants to take a look Monday. Weíll see.

In the mean time, Iíve been trying to figure if I can use some of the parts I already have to save money. One is the 36H Open Pro rims that I have almost convinced myself will work although Iím unsure about what hubs to use. My gut tells me to use 130 road hubs such as 105s instead of a 135 MTB. I also have an Ultegra 6500 long cage RD but am concerned about how large a rear cog it can handle. I read a post saying that 30T was doable, but most say 27T is the limit. With a 26/36/48 crank, what is my limit?
rothenfield1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-10-10, 11:12 PM   #24
sstorkel
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Bikes: Cervelo RS, Specialized Stumpjumper FSR Pro, Schwinn Typhoon, Nashbar touring, custom steel MTB
Posts: 5,427
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 5 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by rothenfield1 View Post
I also have an Ultegra 6500 long cage RD but am concerned about how large a rear cog it can handle. I read a post saying that 30T was doable, but most say 27T is the limit.
27T is the official limit from Shimano. In practice, many people find that 30T works fine.
sstorkel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-12-10, 07:41 PM   #25
rothenfield1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
rothenfield1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Montereyish
Bikes:
Posts: 2,330
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I may need to post this on the Mech. Forum but, I'm looking to use a Sugino DX 600 triple crank 26-36-48 with a 9spd 12-30 cassette on a 130mm hub. I've read that Sugino suggests a 113 BB for road hubs, but how do you determine what the chain line will be before actually having the parts?
rothenfield1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:15 PM.