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Old 01-26-11, 09:32 AM   #1
irpheus
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Advice for a healthy water bottle 750 ml & 1 liter?

Hi Tourers,

I'm looking for a water bottle that doesn't give off substances to the water within.

I've found the "cleanbottle":

http://www.cleanbottle.com

which may fulfill my needs as it appears to not give off substances to the water. It also appears to be manufactured under environmentally sound conditions but is a little low in capacity ....

Any of you know if the Nalgene products have similar qualities or maybe another bottle, preferably 1 liter (camelbak maybe):

http://camelbak.com/Sports-Recreatio...Bottle-1L.aspx

that fits into a normal bike bottle cage?

Thanks for reading

Jesper

P.S.: I live in Denmark so should be available nearby ...
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Old 01-26-11, 12:03 PM   #2
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Not bike specific or the most rugged of bottles, but I use the 1L Smartwater bottles, it's the tall skinny one in the link below.

http://www.bottledwaterstore.com/smartwater.htm

$1.50 will get you a bottle (and a liter of water). If you worry about germs you can easily buy a new one, but I've been using mine for a couple of years and the water tastes great out of them
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Old 01-26-11, 12:07 PM   #3
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By substances, do you mean mold and other nasty things from the result of using sports drinks, or do you mean chemicals given off from the plastic itself? My guess is the latter. If so, I did some googling awhile back into the whole BPA thing and came under the impression that BPA doesn't effect most bicycling water bottles. I don't know that definitively, so I always rinse out my bottles and put in fresh water right before my ride.
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Old 01-26-11, 12:30 PM   #4
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I use a pair of Kleen Kanteen stainless 27 oz. (~800 ml) bottles with optional stainless flat caps (I stop to drink. I'm on vacation!) and the associated bottle cages for bikes.

They have good durability and they clean well. I like them.
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Old 01-26-11, 05:11 PM   #5
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+1 Kleen Kanteens
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Old 01-26-11, 05:24 PM   #6
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Sigg.. SJS in (GB), has their water bottle cages for custom fit..
there are Zefal (F) lined aluminum bottles too ,
well engineered cap for a flow of air into the bottle when the bottle cannot be squeezed , is valuable.

Liter bottles are bigger Diameter original Profile Nylon cages stretch to fit.
they will take a set, after a while so smaller bottles less snug, there after...
but .75L Sigg sports bottles are a decent fit.

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Old 01-26-11, 05:51 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by nun View Post
Not bike specific or the most rugged of bottles, but I use the 1L Smartwater bottles, it's the tall skinny one in the link below.

http://www.bottledwaterstore.com/smartwater.htm

$1.50 will get you a bottle (and a liter of water). If you worry about germs you can easily buy a new one, but I've been using mine for a couple of years and the water tastes great out of them
I hope you don't mean you've been using the same bottles for a couple of years. Those bottles are disposable and made of cheap plastic that will indeed leach chemicals into the water.
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Old 01-26-11, 08:01 PM   #8
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+1 anything stainless, like the Kanteens. Stainless will nuke your water in the sun, but it's as icky-free as you can get

edit: food grade stainless, like the Kanteens. Cheaper bottles may not be food grade.
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Old 01-27-11, 05:09 AM   #9
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I like and use these: http://www.rivbike.com/products/show...mortals/31-457
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Old 01-27-11, 05:53 AM   #10
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I highly recommend the Kleen Kanteens as well, I use the 27oz for biking and the 40oz for work. The bottles clean up nicely and leave no residue, even with tea, coffee, or juice placed inside. I can't say the same thing about the Nalgeen bottles though, as they don't clean up as nicely, even in the dishwasher.
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Old 01-27-11, 09:27 AM   #11
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I like normal bike water bottles (24 oz.) When the big BPA scare hit last year I did some research. Everything I found said that the type of plastic used in bike water bottles was BPA free. Thank goodness. I kept using them. I also rinse mine and refill before every ride, and every month or so I run them through the dishwasher, then rinse well before refilling. I haven't died y......
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Old 01-27-11, 09:52 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irpheus View Post
Hi Tourers,

I'm looking for a water bottle that doesn't give off substances to the water within.

I've found the "cleanbottle":

http://www.cleanbottle.com

which may fulfill my needs as it appears to not give off substances to the water. It also appears to be manufactured under environmentally sound conditions but is a little low in capacity ....

Any of you know if the Nalgene products have similar qualities or maybe another bottle, preferably 1 liter (camelbak maybe):

http://camelbak.com/Sports-Recreatio...Bottle-1L.aspx

that fits into a normal bike bottle cage?

Thanks for reading

Jesper

P.S.: I live in Denmark so should be available nearby ...
Quite frankly, those bottles look like more trouble than they are worth. I'll address the BPA issue later. From a use standpoint, you don't want a water-tight container to have two openings. The fewer sources of leaks the better. Yes, cleaning a bottle that you can take the bottom off of is convenient but convenience isn't the name of the game...holding water is.

I can see a couple of failure modes that would result in you have no water...a bad thing...vs icky water. If you don't put the bottom on tightly enough, your water will leak out. If you happen to catch the bottom on the lip of a cage, you could pull the bottom off. If you drop the bottle off the bike, the bottom could pop off or break. All of these leave you thirsty

Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBlueToe View Post
I like normal bike water bottles (24 oz.) When the big BPA scare hit last year I did some research. Everything I found said that the type of plastic used in bike water bottles was BPA free. Thank goodness. I kept using them. I also rinse mine and refill before every ride, and every month or so I run them through the dishwasher, then rinse well before refilling. I haven't died y......
Bisphenol A (BPA) is a monomer that is used to make polycarbonate plastics and as a plasticizer. But polycarbonate plastics are rigid plastics that aren't used in very many bicycle applications. We want bottles that are made of a softer plastic that can be squeezed to get the water out more quickly (the steel bottles have the same problem). The softer plastics of choice are vinyl (not any more), high density polyethylene (HDPE) or polypropylene (PP). HDPE and PP are both used extensively and they are what zeppinger suggest from Rivendell. Neither is particularly toxic nor does it impart anything to the water because they are both water insoluble.

Rivendell's spiel is wrong, by the way. Nalgene makes all kinds of plastics. Nalgene makes lots of polycarbonates but they also are one of the larger manufacturers of HDPE and PP containers. A 'Nalgene' container doesn't necessarily mean one made from polycarbonate as Rivendell would have you believe.

Bottom line? Buy HDPE and PP bottles and use them. Check the resin code (the little triangle on the bottom of the bottle). If it is a 2, 4 or 5, drink up
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Old 01-27-11, 10:09 AM   #13
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I like Camelbak bottles. The bite valve allows you to take a drink without contorting your head back.
The plastic they use isn't supposed to kill you too quickly either.

Marc
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Old 01-27-11, 11:11 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by cyccommute View Post
Bisphenol A (BPA) is a monomer that is used to make polycarbonate plastics and as a plasticizer. But polycarbonate plastics are rigid plastics that aren't used in very many bicycle applications. We want bottles that are made of a softer plastic that can be squeezed to get the water out more quickly (the steel bottles have the same problem). The softer plastics of choice are vinyl (not any more), high density polyethylene (HDPE) or polypropylene (PP). HDPE and PP are both used extensively and they are what zeppinger suggest from Rivendell. Neither is particularly toxic nor does it impart anything to the water because they are both water insoluble.

Rivendell's spiel is wrong, by the way. Nalgene makes all kinds of plastics. Nalgene makes lots of polycarbonates but they also are one of the larger manufacturers of HDPE and PP containers. A 'Nalgene' container doesn't necessarily mean one made from polycarbonate as Rivendell would have you believe.

Bottom line? Buy HDPE and PP bottles and use them. Check the resin code (the little triangle on the bottom of the bottle). If it is a 2, 4 or 5, drink up
Thanks for the info!
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Old 01-27-11, 01:33 PM   #15
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Bottom line? Buy HDPE and PP bottles and use them. Check the resin code (the little triangle on the bottom of the bottle). If it is a 2, 4 or 5, drink up...
Right. Next you're gonna tell me my bike needs chainstays longer than 430mm...

J/K, I agree completely on both points. I imagine bicyclists as a group are actually at greater risk from the toxins and carcinogens spewed from motor vehicles, to which we are exposed at high concentration (at stoplights).

I think the whole Al bottle fad is simply a successful marketing ploy to sell bottles made cheaply in China with much higher margin. We can still make plastic bottles cheap here in USA, but not as much $ to the sellers.
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Old 01-27-11, 02:02 PM   #16
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Right. Next you're gonna tell me my bike needs chainstays longer than 430mm...
A logical fallacy and completely pointless. Unless, of course, you are trying to demonstrate what kind of horse's ass you are.

If you have some information that says that HDPE and PP bottles contain BPA, by all means, share.
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Old 01-27-11, 03:05 PM   #17
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Old 01-27-11, 08:11 PM   #18
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Is your water source as clean as the bottle that you plan to use?
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Old 01-28-11, 09:33 AM   #19
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Maybe it's just me, but I don't like Camelbak water bottles for biking. I bought two. I found that the way you suck water on them wasn't convenient when I was breathing hard on a bike. I went back to "standard" bike water bottles. However, I do like how the Camelbak bottles don't leak when you tip them over. I bring one on tours (in the under-downtube cage) and use it as a water bottle in my tent at night. I often have dry mouth and need a little drink. If the Gatorade bottle falls over in the dark (it happens) I don't wake up with a puddle in my tent.

I also reject stainless steel on my bike, because you can't squeeze them. I want a quick shot of water when I'm riding, so squeezing it into my mouth seems best. I have a nice, monogrammed L.L. Bean stainless steel water bottle I use on hikes, but for biking give me the old standards!
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Old 01-28-11, 12:16 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by BigBlueToe View Post
Maybe it's just me, but I don't like Camelbak water bottles for biking. I bought two. I found that the way you suck water on them wasn't convenient when I was breathing hard on a bike. I went back to "standard" bike water bottles. However, I do like how the Camelbak bottles don't leak when you tip them over. I bring one on tours (in the under-downtube cage) and use it as a water bottle in my tent at night. I often have dry mouth and need a little drink. If the Gatorade bottle falls over in the dark (it happens) I don't wake up with a puddle in my tent.

I also reject stainless steel on my bike, because you can't squeeze them. I want a quick shot of water when I'm riding, so squeezing it into my mouth seems best. I have a nice, monogrammed L.L. Bean stainless steel water bottle I use on hikes, but for biking give me the old standards!
Plus, regular water bottles are inexpensive, usually pretty rugged, and easy to come by. The easiest solution if one wants some gatorade is to just drink out of the gatorade bottle and use the water bottles for water only. That's what I do.
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Old 01-28-11, 12:46 PM   #21
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I used to like the Polar bottles, because they would keep my water relatively cool on hot days. However I don't like the plastic taste that always seems to happen with plastic bottles - even the ones that claim it won't happen (like Polar). I also don't like drinking hot water, so the Kleen Kanteens don't work too well for me - they heat up pretty quickly in the sun, being single skin metal. I have found a solution that works for me, but it's not without its own complications: Insulated stainless steel, specifically the ones by Pure Hydration, seen here on my Americano:

http://www.crazyguyonabike.com/forum...ested=0#167916

The complications are that these bottles are wider than normal, so you need special cages - the Topeak Modula work fine. Also, because of the width, you may need to move one of the cage mounts up a little, otherwise the bottles foul each other on most bikes. And finally, of course you can't squeeze a stainless steel bottle, so you need to stop and take off the cap and drink. This last might be a problem on a race, but on tour I really don't mind that much, and having cool, taste free water is worth it to me. And these bottles really do work - we went on a road trip recently to Arizona, and these bottles were left in the car in the sun for a couple of hours. Afterwards the outside of the bottles were hot to the touch, but amazingly the water inside was still nice and cool. Really impressive.

As for getting the taste-free water in the first place: Any carbon water filter should remove any strong chlorine taste, otherwise I buy bottled water when on the road - I know it's not ecological, but the water is more likely to be ok, and it's usually already cold from being in the fridge. I then transfer it into my bottles. I know, I'm going to hell.

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Old 01-28-11, 01:37 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigBlueToe View Post
Maybe it's just me, but I don't like Camelbak water bottles for biking. I bought two. I found that the way you suck water on them wasn't convenient when I was breathing hard on a bike. I went back to "standard" bike water bottles. However, I do like how the Camelbak bottles don't leak when you tip them over. I bring one on tours (in the under-downtube cage) and use it as a water bottle in my tent at night. I often have dry mouth and need a little drink. If the Gatorade bottle falls over in the dark (it happens) I don't wake up with a puddle in my tent.

I also reject stainless steel on my bike, because you can't squeeze them. I want a quick shot of water when I'm riding, so squeezing it into my mouth seems best. I have a nice, monogrammed L.L. Bean stainless steel water bottle I use on hikes, but for biking give me the old standards!
The Camelbak bottles are polypropylene while many other bottles are high density polyethylene. PP is a bit stiffer than HDPE so it's a little harder to squeeze...which is what you are doing when you suck water out of them. That's why the Camelbak bottles are more expensive too. HDPE is cheaper than PP as a polymer. PP is more inert to more things (chemicals, solvents, sunlight) and it's slightly tougher.
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Old 01-30-11, 10:29 PM   #23
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I like normal bike water bottles (24 oz.) When the big BPA scare hit last year I did some research. Everything I found said that the type of plastic used in bike water bottles was BPA free. Thank goodness. I kept using them. I also rinse mine and refill before every ride, and every month or so I run them through the dishwasher, then rinse well before refilling. I haven't died y......
mind you, there is that little anomaly of a certain odd coloured appendage....

in the end, I use regular old bike bottles too, change out the water and use one of those squiggley bristle thingees to clean them well on the inside--yes its kinda gross in the hot sun when water gets hot too and sometimes plasticy tasting, but I often had a 1 liter nalgene wrapped in an insulating soft case (for cross country skiing too) in my pannier. I guess there are , as mentioned, insulated ones nowadays that are better, but I do like getting a good gulp by squeezing when I need it and/or have been too lazy cheap to buy fancy ones (plus, in my family, stuff goes missing from others family members using them or forgetting them somewhere, so am hesitant to buy nice ones...they will just disappear)
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Old 01-31-11, 04:10 PM   #24
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I just use the bottle water comes in,liver and kidneys are still working fine and I have no extra arms or legs yet.

I've been drinking out of one kind of plastic bottle or another for 30+ years.If something bad is going to happen to me,it better hurry up!

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Old 01-31-11, 04:46 PM   #25
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Check the resin code (the little triangle on the bottom of the bottle). If it is a 2, 4 or 5, drink up
So, if the number within the little triangle reads 2, 4 or 5, then all is well?
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