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Old 05-28-12, 08:32 AM   #1
BigBlueToe
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Off topic: clipless/platform pedals info?

I think my 21-year-old son would enjoy clipless pedals on his Allez road bike, but he doesn't want to be tied to always wearing bike shoes. He often rides to places where he wants to be wearing regular shoes. So I've been considering buying him some pedals that are platform on one side and Shimano mountain clipless (PD?) on the other.

I have a question about them. When they are at rest, which side is up? I ask this because when I had Look Keos on my road bike they rested at a steep angle, and it was always a hassle to get them oriented so I could clip in. I replaced them with mountain pedals that are double sided so I never have to do any futzing to get them ready to clip in - I just step down and I'm in.

I'm hoping the combination clipless/platform will rest with the clipped side up. Can anyone offer information?
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Old 05-28-12, 08:37 AM   #2
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The pedals do not have a center of gravity that puts one side up. The position of the pedal, when not driven, is random.

I pedal up to crusing speed and then clip in.
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Old 05-28-12, 08:40 AM   #3
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I use these: http://www.nashbar.com/bikes/Product...60_-1___202530 - Shimano PDM324 Multi-Purpose Mountain Bike Pedals, and I really like them. I've got them on all my bicycles now.

And yes, the resting position of the pedal is random. But it's not an issue. I clip my left foot in before taking off, and I flip the other pedal to the platform side most of the time. But if I end up with the clip side, that's OK too. I'm pedalling, and it's just a quick flip at my leisure to get the right side.
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Old 05-28-12, 10:07 AM   #4
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I've got a pair of Shimano M530s on my touring bike, and for me the clip-in side is almost always up. I don't know if it's just because I've ridden it so much and almost always used that side, but I never have an issue clipping in - the proper side is always up for me. When I go look at it, at rest, the platform side is down. I'm not sure if that's the weighting of the pedals, or just that it's so worn in that it rotates back to that side...
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Old 05-28-12, 11:05 AM   #5
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Pedals are very quick to swap-out, with a few tools..
Shimano/Welgo do the platform /spud combo.

There are toe-clip like dummy cleats too, + the Winwood Deckster
which is an aluminum plate, that you screw your spare spud cleats into
to make 1 side of the double sided pedal a platform..

big surface pedals like CB Mallet work OK with street shoes ,
particularly spongy trainers, as the cleat bars are then just a little lump
under foot in the center of the pedal.

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Old 05-28-12, 02:56 PM   #6
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I have these http://bike.shimano.com/publish/cont..._mountain.html

And the pedals almost always stop vertically with the platform facing forward so if I sweep my foot front to back it almost always hits the platform and back to front means I hit the clipless side. I could just be lucky and have a freak pair but I rarely have to look down to get my foot where I want it.
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Old 05-30-12, 03:41 AM   #7
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Another possible option is something like the Shimano M424 SPD pedal which is double sided. The design is such that it can be ridden clipless or clipped in.



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Old 05-31-12, 07:34 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by BigBlueToe View Post
I'm hoping the combination clipless/platform will rest with the clipped side up. Can anyone offer information?
I have been riding the Shimano PD-M324 on my Trek 520 touring bike for my daily commute for the last 2 months. I am very happy with them. The last part of my ride, after changing, is in street cloths and shoes.

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Old 05-31-12, 08:32 AM   #9
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FWIW I found the one-sided type to be a little bit of a PITA. YMMV.

Separately, I'm also getting increasingly skeptical of the benefits of attaching one's foot to the pedal in the first place. Research done by Andy Pruitt and others have pretty clearly demonstrated that you do not, in fact, put any additional power to the drive train on the upstroke; even top pros don't do that. All that happens is that you are lifting your leg (or as Pruitt puts it, "getting your leg out of the way") -- and I'm not sure you need to be attached to the pedal to accomplish that.

I.e. I have yet to see any objective evidence that clipless offers enough benefits to justify the price tag. (Note: afaik Pruitt does support clipless, but it's not clear to me why, or a quantification of the benefits.)

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Old 05-31-12, 01:11 PM   #10
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the Ergon contour pedal is great, that is what I use on my daily ride.
dont miss the other stuff at all

and I have spud shoes and pedals too

the concave shape centers your foot, and even feels better
when the knees are closer together, which is also a better pedal technique.
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Old 05-31-12, 07:33 PM   #11
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ditto Machko, cheap too
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Old 05-31-12, 10:50 PM   #12
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I'm a little skeptical of this whole enterprise.

If someone likes foot retention and wants to wear regular shoes, toe clips and straps are the solution. But there are no clips-on-one-side-clipless-on-the-other pedals.

But if someone is used to riding "free" on platform pedals and doesn't seem interested in foot retention of the clipped or clipless variety, I'm not sure that buying them clipless pedals will lead to them being used.
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Old 06-01-12, 05:46 AM   #13
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I bought the Shimano M324 4 years ago because like your son, i figured i'd want to ride sometimes with clipless, sometimes platform. 4 years later i've only ridden the platform side maybe 2 times - i find my mountain bike shoes more than adequate for walking around town.

these pedals are a gateway drug.
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Old 06-01-12, 07:46 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by alhedges View Post
I'm a little skeptical of this whole enterprise.

If someone likes foot retention and wants to wear regular shoes, toe clips and straps are the solution. But there are no clips-on-one-side-clipless-on-the-other pedals.
Actually, I think you can fix toeclips to a shimano pd-m324. Seems like a daft thing to do and I haven't tried it, but the pedal seems to have all the right connections for it.
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But if someone is used to riding "free" on platform pedals and doesn't seem interested in foot retention of the clipped or clipless variety, I'm not sure that buying them clipless pedals will lead to them being used.
The idea is that you don't have to put on specific shoes just to go cycling, but can clip in if you have your cycling shoes on. That's what the platform/clipless combo pedals are for. They're for people who prefer to be clipped in but also want to wear normal shoes every now and then.
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Old 06-01-12, 08:27 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by Bacciagalupe View Post
FWIW I found the one-sided type to be a little bit of a PITA. YMMV.

Separately, I'm also getting increasingly skeptical of the benefits of attaching one's foot to the pedal in the first place. Research done by Andy Pruitt and others have pretty clearly demonstrated that you do not, in fact, put any additional power to the drive train on the upstroke; even top pros don't do that. All that happens is that you are lifting your leg (or as Pruitt puts it, "getting your leg out of the way") -- and I'm not sure you need to be attached to the pedal to accomplish that.

I.e. I have yet to see any objective evidence that clipless offers enough benefits to justify the price tag. (Note: afaik Pruitt does support clipless, but it's not clear to me why, or a quantification of the benefits.)
This is heresy talk on the BF - get back in the cave. Scientific research and analysis is forbidden, yo.
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Old 06-01-12, 08:43 AM   #16
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I have some of the Perfromance Campus pedals on several bikes. They work nicely, and are inexpensive, but nothing fancy. There is no default side that faces up. Also sold as Nashbar Rodeo pedals and made by Wellgo who also sells them under their own name.

I traded someone recently for a pair of Shimano pedals similar to those 424's shown earlier. Didn't realize they were designed that way for dual usage. Cool.
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Old 06-01-12, 02:41 PM   #17
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My wife and I converted our touring bikes from Look pedals to Shimano 324's. We just completed a 700 mile tour with them and they worked OK. They are better than Looks for starting on steep hills, and for riding around camp with my running shoes on. I also like the durability of the SPD cleats. However, my shins look pretty beat up. The 324 pedal cage has a lot of sharp edges, which tend to "grab" me when manhandling my bike onto a train, bus, or up curbs. I'm still not convinced that I'll stay with the 324, but my wife really likes them. I think the release on the Look pedal is smoother. The clip seems to hang down more often than not, but it is not a big problem. Ideally, it would be good if it positioned itself consistently. Then it would just be a mater of getting used to them

I think they would do what you want them to do.

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Old 06-02-12, 11:48 AM   #18
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I'm a little skeptical of this whole enterprise.

If someone likes foot retention and wants to wear regular shoes, toe clips and straps are the solution. ...
A poor solution, I would respectfully submit. They are harder to get into, harder to get out of and less efficient than SPDs. They always hang under the pedal and will drag on the road if you try to ride without turning them over and fitting your feet into them. Low cost is their sole advantage, and without dangerously cinching down the straps, they're hardly any better than straight platforms. Pinned BMX pedals are probably a better alternative than cages, but I still prefer the SPD/platform combos for their combination of efficiency and versatility.
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Old 06-03-12, 09:32 PM   #19
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A poor solution, I would respectfully submit. They are harder to get into, harder to get out of and less efficient than SPDs.
I much prefer clips and straps to SPDs, which I used for 6 years. I don't really buy the efficiency argument at all - and there's not good evidence for it, as far as that goes. But I do prefer some sort of foot retention so my feet stay on the pedals.
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They always hang under the pedal and will drag on the road if you try to ride without turning them over and fitting your feet into them.
Yes, if you have them, you have to use them.
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Low cost is their sole advantage, and without dangerously cinching down the straps, they're hardly any better than straight platforms.
That's not my experience. YMMV.
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Pinned BMX pedals are probably a better alternative than cages, but I still prefer the SPD/platform combos for their combination of efficiency and versatility.
Pinned BMX might be a good idea.

But it really comes down to what the OP's kid prefers. If he currently uses clips and straps because he can wear regular shoes, a half platform/half SPD solution will be inferior because riding on the platform side will be worse than clips and straps. Half spd/half clips won't work because the straps will drag, as you mentioned. So half spd/half platforms won't work if the kid already uses toeclips. Solution = do nothing.

If the kid doesn't use any foot retention, platform/spds will work...although it may not be worthwhile if the kid doesn't want retention. And it doesn't look like the platform on the pictured SPD/platform would work as well as a typical rattrap pedal. Which means that the kid's biking experience is worse when he's using his regular shoes. Unless the kid really does want clipless but is worried about the street shoe issue, I think the best plan still = do nothing, since getting pedals that are better for how the parent wants the kids to ride but worse for how the kid wants to ride doesn't seem like a good plan.
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