bikenh

ABSOLUTELY! My trip plans this summer were planned beautifully. Right before I left for the trip I found out my trip quite possibly was going to be cut quite short. Instead of a 6000+ mile trip I might only be doing a...1700 mile trip. Didn't know for sure which it was going to be until I got the first half of the trip over. Problem was getting the first half of the trip over yet alone the second half of the trip. Between a train wreck a week or so earlier that had NY5 closed that I had to reroute around to flooded road that forced more rerouting to running into these stinking sign "Bicycles Prohibited" I just couldn't win on the trip at all. All the plans I made were totally useless. Sometimes you just have to get out the door and take on whatever comes your way.

I do have to agree with mdilthey that I'm bit sick of the cry babies that think this is a perfect world, and everyone should be perfect. I suggest the next time a cry baby wants to put someone down that has run into problems that should be banned from the forum or maybe on any future posts they make asking questions everyone just refuses to reply back to them.

Good luck mdilthey and stay safe. Sorry I can't give any CO info I've only been in CO once and that was back in 1998 and that was in a car not on a bike. Hopefully I may be out that way next summer...than again...maybe I should say hopefully I won't be out that way next summer...UGH! I hope something destroys my stupid plans for next summer.

Papa Tom

The initial few posts seemed suspicious to me, as mdilthey seemed to have plenty of time to collect and write out his thoughts for a guy who was lost and needed to get somewhere fast. But I think maybe he just panicked when he got lost, and suddenly, water and daylight became these big monsters for a brief window of time. How many times have any of you been out there imagining that you were lost and headed for a merciless death only to turn a corner and run into a McDonald's franchise and a massive shopping mall?

cyccommute 

November along the Colorado Front Range is never all that bad. We can get snow but it's not all that common and it's less common as you go further south. Even in the mountains, the low valleys are snow free for most of November and a large part of December. It's been that way since I was a kid and since my parents were kids. If mdilthey wanted to do the same trip in March, I'd label him a damned fool but not in early November...for the most part.

As for finding water along the Front Range, it depends on where you are and what kind of information you might have. mdilthey was most likely following Monument Creek and Fountain Creek. There's not a lot of information on where anything is in Colorado Springs along those paths and access is somewhat limited. He could get off the path and try to find a grocery store or a business but that might have gotten him more lost than he was. Then he's lost, out of water and in the dark. That's not a great combination. A smart phone makes those kinds of detours easier but I don't know if he has one.

From Colorado Springs south, water is much harder to find. There's places to find it in Fountain but from there to Pueblo, no dice. The Pinon station is closed and the CDOT rest areas have no potable water...or any water now for that matter...and never have had. South of Pueblo, you can find some gas stations at Colorado City (about 20 miles south). But then there's the long lonely stretch to Walsenberg, then a longer one to Trinidad. You might find something in Aguilar but you might not. Aguilar, Walsenberg and even Trinidad aren't even 1 horse towns because someone already rode the horse out of town looking for greener pastures.

mdilthey

A decidedly on-mark summary, better than I could have said myself. I was on the trail way further than I wanted to be, and with a growing sense of dread at the road ahead that had been building for a week. The "normal" new tourist issues of hunger, cold, inability to sleep outside, or tiredness didn't plague me in the slightest, but not being able to see anything is universal and definitely bugged me. The water part, with the 20/20 vision of hindsight, seems silly.

If you want to laugh, I woke up and my bottle was frozen solid. My last weather report was from Denver at lower elevations, where the temperature was in the mid to high 30's. Whoops.


Once I got the situation under control (doing what I know best; camping), I decided to try to wrest back the situation from panic and make a post here. I was always capable of figuring something out. This isn't my first rodeo. However, I had some idea that if I didn't find a "better" way then I was going to call it, and change locations. I am glad I said something because I found all the information I needed to make the best decision.

That's the way it's playing out. Sorry if the initial post misguided anyone, but I felt the majority of it was on-point and I don't feel like going on an editing spree to save face. It might just teach some new tourist what to expect.

jamawani 

Back in the old days -
(When cell phones still had pull-out antennas but were, thankfully, smaller than bricks)
I got snowed on real bad in northern New Mexico in October.
The forecast had only called for a few rain showers - but they goofed.
I had to get up all night to brush snow off of my tent -
(Like most people in this situation, I thought at first that the rain had stopped)
And it ended up with 8 to 10 inches of wet snow.
Can't remember how I got back to Raton - but I recall some riding.
I suspect some kind soul had pity on me.

It's not gonna get any warmer until spring.

jamawani 

Stanley Milgram would have a field day with you.
Might I presume that you would hold the position of Grand Pooh-Bah?

bransom

Hey, Max. If you've got a smart phone or tablet, grab the Weather Channel app for a few bucks. The forecasting seems as good as NOAA's, it's got a "give me the weather where I'm standing right now" feature, it shows all the wx advisories and warnings, gives hourly forecasts for the day, and has pretty up-to-date radar imagery. I've found it to be really handy when out for a long ride.

bikenh

You gotta remember he is in the mountains. Admittedly he is also somewhere pretty close to I25. That still can be hogwash though. Cell phone reception around the mountain is better than it use to be but I can be right in my own house and not have a connection with a cell phone tower that is less than 2.5 miles from me. I'm in the shadow of the cell tower so sometimes I get lucky and have a signal and sometimes I don't. The bigger the mountains that bigger the problems can be.

bransom

No, I understand about the mountains but figured since he was able to post here.. And if he has to shadow an interstate, he should have hopefully at least sporadic service.

boattail71

Great thread started by mdilthey. His adventure is interesting. That he asks for advice from others with experience in southern Colorado is commendable and smart. Why Steve and jamawani feel the need to be negative - I can guess but I'm trying to be as positive as I can. Most of us appreciate md's plight; keep it up md and keep us informed.

Agree with what md said:

" I don't think there's a question about where you were going. it's the elitist, "That's not how I would have done it" stance that places a bar for entry to any novice tourist on the forum, and I won't apologize for condemning it."

fietsbob

seek an Amtrak station perhaps?

I toured in other countries, not above using Rails..

Ex: took in enough Poland riding, east from a Ferry Slip, About a week, '91,
not much going on in the tourisim biz just after the wall came down..

and took a side trip to Warsaw on the train, then end of the day took another one,
next morning from Jelena Gora, rode south to Prague. Drank CZ Beer ..

maybe as a musician I'm OK with Improvisation.. some are into meticulous planning.

Probably have a tidier house Too..

mje

Amtrak stations are few and far between here. The closest Amtrak stations to the poster are Denver, Trinidad, and La Junta off to the east.

Machka 

From our travels through southern USA, I suspect you're going to encounter a lot more in the way of "really tough areas of town" ... when you encounter towns at all.

Do you not have 30mph sustained winds with 60+ gusts where you live? They're quite common just about everywhere I've lived and travelled. And yes, you've chosen to tour in a part of the world with lots and lots of wind!

Do you have a collection of paper maps to refer to? If not, see if you can get to a Tourist Information centre. You might also try to find a bicycle or sports shop ... they may have cycling maps for sale.


It sounds like you're having a bit of an adventure. Where are you going next?

And just out of curiosity ... why did you choose to tour in that part of the US, and particularly, at this time of year?

axolotl

Machka asks a completely reasonable question, and not all that different from what Steve B asked. I suspect that many of us who read the initial post in this thread have wondered the same thing. However, when asked, mdilthey lashed out with absurd language about a "witch hunt", "save the lecture", "poison", "elitist", "lipstick on a pig", and other ridiculous statements.

Dudelsack 

Yes, but Machka asked with grace and tact.

axolotl

Steve B asked politely AND after giving helpful information which had been requested. IMO, mdilthey lashed out in a juvenile and inexcusable manner. His attitude and language were utterly absurd.

Steve B.

[QUOTE=boattail71;16250705]Great thread started by mdilthey. His adventure is interesting. That he asks for advice from others with experience in southern Colorado is commendable and smart. Why Steve and jamawani feel the need to be negative - I can guess but I'm trying to be as positive as I can. Most of us appreciate md's plight; keep it up md and keep us informed.

Agree with what md said:

" I don't think there's a question about where you were going. it's the elitist, "That's not how I would have done it" stance that places a bar for entry to any novice tourist on the forum, and I won't apologize for condemning it."[/QUOTE

I was the initial response. I did not in any shape or form reply in an elitist manner or with anything other then attempting to be helpful. The OP was written at 8:30 at night from somewhere in Colorado Springs and in this initial post as well as the follow up posts from mdithery it developed that he was lost with no real idea as to how to get south to New Mexico much less out of Colorado Springs, was nearly out of water, at night and quite frankly had a desperate tone to the posts.

That struck me (as well as few others) as odd that someone could get to that point in a tour, seemingly having done little useful planning as to the routes to be taken and the conditions concerning daylight, weather, water sources, etc.... thus my follow up post. His third post stated "My trouble is the lack of bikeable roads headed south i'm just unfamiliar with the area and was looking for advice from someone who's done S. Colorado before".

Does it not seem odd that someone would find themselves in that situation ? and would then be hoping that a post on the internet would be seen and replied too ?. Thus my incredulous question as to how this all came about. It's an entirely reasonable question as far as I'm concerned, especially if it leads to additional information that might have us recommend abandoning the trip due to the potential for riding into bad weather while out in the middle of nowhere, a real possibility in the west and remember he stated "I wrongfully assumed colorado would be like the Northeast".

My questions were not elitist, they were asking "how friggin stupid are you ?". Which was answered in the tone of the replies.

bikenh

You only learn through your mistakes, and you only make mistakes if you try to do something that you aren't an expert about. The simple problem is mdilthey has experience with both winter camping and bike touring. Yes, he is in an area he where he doesn't have much experience. He is running into situations that he isn't use to. Are you going to tell me that you haven't did the same thing in the past. If you haven't then you are a stupid idiot that has learnt anything because you haven't did anything to give yourself a chance to learn.

You also have to remember...let's compare ages. How old is mdilthey...by looking at his wordpress blog I would say he is probably mid to late 20s. How old are the rest of you? Steve, jamawani how old are you guys. As you get older and you have more life experience which helps to to form better judgment on what to do and what not to do. At the same time your likelihood to take chances are far less because you have a lot more life experience than say a late 20ager.

I fess I tend to be the exact way of mdilthey while at the same time being a lot like him. I typically over plan versus under plan and come to find out my idea of what to expect is completely hogwash. I remember when I moved to NH back in the fall of 2000. I was expecting snow to be on the ground pretty much from mid-October on. Boy, was I ever in for a rude awakening. My concept of what to expect was totally wrong. Heck, most of the time I don't have snow on the ground for the whole winter until early December. The amount of snowfall I was expecting I have only seen once...the first winter I was up here. Since then I haven't seen anything like what I expected.

I'm 40 years old and I know right now the plans I'm thinking of for next year are off the deep end. Not so much for the ride I'm looking at doing, rather for the way I'm looking at doing it. Instead of doing a 7500 mile unsupported trip at a casual 100 mile a day pace I'm looking at something much more aggressive, like 200-200+ miles a day unsupported(day and night unsupported...no hotels, warm showers, anything but sleeping in a tent). Yeah, us young pups think differently than you old farts. We are more aggressive because we don't have the life experience you older farts have. We learn through our life experiences by the chances we take and the mistake we make. Mdilthey should be congratulated for trying instead of being put down for taking on the challenge he is dealing with right now. At least he is trying. If he is anything like me, he'll make it happen. He only needs a bit guidance through some of the learning experiences that he is trying to give himself. One other big benefit for everyone on the forum is through his experiences we can learn to make better decisions on what to do/not do and what to expect. If his trip went off totally without any problems would any one on the forum have learnt anything from him?

Yes, I'm thinking of the stupid idea for next year and I'm sure hoping I don't even attempt the dumb idea.

bikenh

You have to remember in one simple respect CO isn't like the northeast...from a planning perspective. If you haven't did much travelling out west or did your research in the laws of the road...literally, you won't realize that you are allowed to ride on the interstates. Here in the east you aren't. Their are very few places here in the east where you can ride on the interstate. Heck, I even know of a few two lane roads where bikes are prohibited. Since I know the regulations regarding the building of the interstates I know they really can't keep you of the interstates out west because of the lack of alternative routes. Heck in research for the ride I'm looking at next year I realized how difficult the ride is for routing through WY/UT/CO. Given the strict 'rules' I have put in place their is pretty much only one route that I can use thanks the to lack of non-interstate roads through the area.

When you get use to riding in one part of the country, like the highly populated eastern part of the US you get use to roads leading you somewhere versus roads leading you pretty much nowhere, like out west. When you have limited knowledge you can't ask intelligent questions to get you the answer that you need ahead of time. Sometimes it just take getting yourself into the environment to ever be able to ask the questions that you should have asked ahead of time.

You don't know what you don't know.

cyccommute 

mdilthey is from Massachusetts. 30 mph sustained winds would blow down whole forests. 60 mph guts would blow away whole towns. The only reason that they don't do that here in Colorado is because we get that kind of wind on a very regular basis. Anything that can blow away has already blown away. Because the winds do little damage (usually), they don't get reported and the rest of us don't think about them. Eastern forest may get winds above the trees but people seldom experience hurricane force winds at ground level.

There's another problem that people in the east don't experience. Because of Colorado's topography, we get storms that pile up on the west side of the mountains, then they rush down the slopes of the Rockies out on to the plains. They gain speed as the air moves down slope. We don't usually think of air as a flowable fluid but its fluidity gets demonstrated here every fall...just about this time of year. And we have no trees out on the plains to break up the winds. We can even get the jet stream scouring down to ground level. That can be 100mph + winds.

On visitor centers, most of them are geared towards cars. That's typical all over the US. A question about getting from point A to point B in a car is easily answered. A question about getting from point A to point B by bicycle isn't.

Even the location a visitor center is usually car centric. Colorado Springs has one about 1/4 of a mile from the bike path mdilthey was riding on. The problem is that there are no signs on the path telling you where to go to get to that visitor center. There are signs on I-25 for the drivers and even off I-25 but without knowing where the visitor center is, you can't really find it by bicycle. If you live in Colorado Springs, you probably know where the center is but you don't need it.

You also have to understand that the path he was riding is mostly separated from the rest of the transportation grid. We like to be separated and the path is a wonderful place to ride but being disconnected has its disadvantages.

boomhauer

You said a mouthfull there....

I used to live there (no more).

People will help you!!!

Put on your smiley face and say "help me" !!!

I could never get over why northeasterners are afraid of other people. They are so reserved.

I have had so much good luck on tours because of the kindness of others.

"People only want the best for me" is the attitude I have always taken when riding into the vast desert or in **** ghetto of Stockton, CA.

Never had a problem when there was a smile on my face.

the sci guy 

I can't believe a thread asking for help because he was alone and lost turned into people *****ing at him. some of you people suck. props to cyccommute for actually being a stand up guy and helping.

pretty sure whatever you're criticizing about and yelling at him for are things he's already figured out for next time.

Shifty

Problem solving use to be a individual sport that made cycling character building. It seems now that people just log on to a forum and cry for help. Excellent research and advanced planning can never be replaced by a laptop computer while cowering in a McDonalds along the road. If the the OP was "wasted" after riding from Denver to Colorado Springs (which can never be described as a urban jungle), how the hell was he planning get over Raton Pass and beyond. This is the worst post EVER on Bike Forums.

mtn.cyclist

I think mdlithey's big issue for now is staying warm. If you make it down to Walsenburg (maybe 40 miles south of Pueblo) you can find a hotel. Maybe a little warmer there but I am expecting single digit temps tonight.

alan s 

+1

The OP is probably warm and safe back in Denver by now.