andrew.waye

I hummed and hawed about buying a bike last year, but decided to put it off. Just checking again half a year later to see if anyone can provide any insight that will clinch the deal for me now that I have it narrowed down to these two... I find them both equally comfortable.

https://www.bikeforums.net/archive/in.../t-903455.html

The 2012 Sherpa 30 is going for $1100 right now. Better tubing (but maybe not as tough in the event of falling over?; better rims or are they very comparable?), but seems under-specced elsewhere compared to the National.

https://www.cyclepower.ca/sherpa3022.htm

The MEC National is $1350. Like the idea of brifters, since I see myself using this for rainy day group road rides and maybe even cyclocross. I've heard that the brifters are getting to be pretty robust, so no, I do not see them as a disadvantage compared to friction for touring purposes. The touring I see myself doing will be in Canada, US, and France, where access to parts/shops shouldn't be limited.

https://www.mec.ca/product/5030-652/m...10+50002+50208

I know the LHT is the gold standard for touring, but the price and specs are not right. I'm in Canada and the LHT get a couple hundred added the price right off the bat due to duties paid by the shops for getting the frame into the country (this is from the shop owners in town who sell the LHTs).

I'd argue the specs aren't right for the Sherpa either, but at $1100 we're starting to look very interesting. At $1100, you get a lot more bike a comparable price of most of the entry to mid level touring bikes (Jamis, Fuji, etc).

Another point to consider for the Sherpa -- I have an unused 10sp 105 group (53 - 39) that I can toss onto the bike for when I'm not touring on it.

Both bikes come with relatively high granny gears on the crank, but I'm a strong enough rider that I can't imagine needing lower.

bradtx

andrew.waye, Either are perfectly fine bikes, but I do have an unreasonable preference for Rocky Mountain bikes. Whichever one has the most pros and fewest cons WRT touring and non touring duties on your preference list is the one to choose.

Brad

fietsbob

before you will have a reliable touring bike if you buy a used bike ,

you have to know if everything important is in good condition.

and the brand painted on the frame tubes does nothing for learning that.

you have to overhaul the bike and look.


By the way. all the component parts on a bike can be changed ,
except things that need a frame fitting there to mount it.

like Disc Brakes do.. so it may not come exactly as you wish but
it certainly is possible to change those parts to make it more like you want..

I know nothing about canadian brands ,

just that they are perhaps made in Asia too.. business decisions..

enigmaT120

mmm, Rocky Mountain. When I was shopping in 2012, they weren't selling the Sherpa down here so I never even got a look at one.

andrew.waye

The trip myself and the bike would go on (hopefully!!). Fly down to San Fran in late April, back in Ottawa by August.

https://goo.gl/maps/MTb48 --- route very approximate

clasher

I'd go with the rocky mountain myself.... with the SLX in the rear you should be able to put a 12-36 cassette on the rear no problem and it'll work better than the tiagra long cage RD on the mec bike. If the Rocky is 9 speed (or even 8) you've got the advantage of cheaper chains and casettes too. If you want you can pop an 11-28 cassette for road rides and not worry about swapping out the front crank, I mean 50-11 is a pretty tall gear for me and any riding I'd do on an empty touring bike. Just from a cursory look I'd say the Rocky would be a sprightlier ride unloaded but who knows, I've never ridden either and don't claim to be an expert.

Bezalel

Just about any prebuilt bike with brifters will be this way. Brifters require a road FD so they also use a matching crankset.

andrew.waye

How about the Kona Sutra...? More expensive, but disc brakes. Still cheaper than the LHT, and comes with racks and fenders. Short chainstays, but my feet aren't huge or anything. Geometry is less like the LHT and more like the Sherpa.... The MEC has the closest geometry to the LHT.

https://www.konaworld.com/sutra.cfm

bradtx

The added expense is also covering the racks, fenders and to some extent the brakes. Chain stays are an issue with large and jumbo sized panniers. Four medium sized panniers may not be a problem and will balance the load.

Brad

cvskates

I looked at the MEC national, too, and really liked it. But then I stumbled across a Sutra on consignment at my LBS and went with it. Super happy with it.

bradtx

andrew.waye, I forgot to mention earlier the Raleigh Sojourn.

Brad

Bezalel

Are you willing to tour on a bike you haven't trained on? You can get an LHT in SF and you won't have to fly with it. When returning to Canada you can use a personal exemption to reduce your taxes.

andrew.waye

I did think of that... I took a look at a few of the shops down there, but didn't see any good prices on a LHT.

kenman

The LHT is the gold standard for touring bikes? Quite the contrary. The Surly LHT comes with a frame which uses standard double butted 4130 cromoly tubes and straight guage stays. The LHT is a standard generic Chinese production which is in my experience, usually not well finished (production quality is low). You would be much better served with a Rocky Mountain. Rocky Mountain quality is very consistent and uses higher end tubing which is lighter and stronger. If you are looking for the gold standard, then you are talking about a Marinoni Turismo or Turismo Extreme touring bike which is hand built and made to measure in Montreal with the highest end tube sets available (Columbus Zona) for a bike like that. It is made slowly and carefully and the alignment is perfect. A Turismo with 105 or Campy Veloce will start about $2300.

andrew.waye

Touché! Maybe I used the term "gold standard" rather liberally there...

Yes, I would certainly rank anything built by Marinoni among the best, and have looked at the Turismo, but it is out of my price range. Yes, the tubing is higher quality on the Sherpa 30, but it's thinner, and while having a higher tensile strength, I would expect for touring applications, where the bike will end up in the checked luggage on a plane, I might want tubing that will take impacts a little better than the relatively thin-walled Reynolds 725. Anyways, I've read as much to that effect...

Kenman, any opinions about the geometry comparison between the two (MEC National has LHT-like geometry, Sherpa 30 has Kona Sutra-like geometry)? They are two very differently shaped frames... Looks like the MEC is closer to the Marinoni as well, geometry-wise.

fietsbob

A build in an assembly factory is of parts coming from a Component factory for each part. .

once it's in your local shop's hands , ask about changing things you want different
than those various factories installed as a matter of efficiency.

kenman

I would stay away from the MEC products as well if you are a serious cyclist. Rocky is a bike company. Marinoni is a bike company. MEC is not. MEC buys frames off the rack in China. As far as geometry goes, you really have to ride them. Geometry will depend on your body configuration. You can buy a Marinoni with the geometry they state on their site or you can actually change it a little if you want but that is very rarely necessary unless you have a very different body conguration. I think a better description of the LHT would be the Lead Standard of bicycles, well suited for weight resistance exercises. The reason they can make Zona tubing thinner is cause it is stronger and more durable than 4130 tubing or Reynolds 520 tubing.

egear

I'd go with the Fuji. The Sherpa's fork is cut to low for long distance touring. The Fuji is clearly purpose built and the same price. Also I had a Fuji Tour bike for years and the thing worked great. Take a good long ride on both. Pushing panniers on the Sherpa will be much harder in my opinion.

kenman

Very true. The Fuji is very well priced and bomb proof and the the fork steerer is cut quite high. The Rocky is cut lower but with higher end tubing and if you have no physiological issues the fork steerer is cute more than high enough.. The Marinoni is higher end again and you can have the fork steerer any height you want but it costs a lot more.

andrew.waye

Yeah, right now the shop has the Fuji and Sherpa 30 for the same price. Between the two, the Sherpa is the better bike for me (no problems with positioning on bike... I ride a pretty aggressive geometry on my road bike). The Fuji the components felt a bit cheap/flimsy as well... specced lower than the Sherpa (Deore vs SLX) but for the same price.

Wilfred Laurier

more expensive tubing with thinner walls may be lighter with similar strength
but will generally be less stiff
which could cause issues with excessive flex or poor handling
if you are carrying a heavy load
or riding on very rough roads

cyccommute 

The finish on the LHTs I've seen are as good as most other bikes. They may be made in China but then most bikes are made there. It's not like the LHT is on the same quality level as a Walmart bike either.

After looking at the Marinoni Turismo, I'd hardly call it a "gold standard" touring bike. It doesn't even qualify as a loaded touring bike to begin with. With a 16.9" (43.0cm) chain stay, it has more in common with a race frame than a touring frame. It would be a good randonneur bike or credit card touring bike but not a loaded touring bike. With that short a chain stay, you'd clip the rear bags even with small feet. And the price of an off the peg frame is over twice that of an LHT. The Extreme would be a better loaded touring bike but it still has short stays and is even more expensive.

Finally, 105 and Veloce are hardly good touring groups.

andrew.waye

the marinoni is custom built, so i presume you could ask for longer chainstays without any issue...

kenman

You are right Andrew. As I said before, the Marinonis are hand built and made to measure. So if you have a certain preference towards a certain geometry for a particular style of touring, you get Marinoni to build it that way. In terms of craftmanship, they certainly are the Gold Standard. The Marinonis come as framesets, not as bikes, so you can choose from any parts kit you like. Of course they cost more. They are better.

andrew.waye

if i had a job, i'd go for the marinoni! but i don't, so i think it's the rocky mountain who is in the lead at the moment. will be picking it up in a couple weeks. when i'm not touring, i have a 10sp 105 group sitting in my closet that i can slap on it for road riding on rainy days. i expect the sherpa will be a lot more bike for road type riding as well once i get back from my tour.