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  1. #51
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    The RAAM riders go everyday for 8-10 days straight, day and night and they don't bonk. Some of them do a liquid diet and eat nothing. They get their entire nutrition through liquids.

    The biggest set of fatigue you will find yourself getting is mental fatigue. Watch the mind and how you are responding to things. That will tell you what to expect to come out of the body. When the mind starts to tire, for whatever reason, you will find the body will start to tire. Granted, this is also coming from the standpoint that you are in shape to begin with. Just remember the most important factor of life...the mind controls the body...not the other way around.

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikenh View Post
    The RAAM riders go everyday for 8-10 days straight, day and night and they don't bonk. Some of them do a liquid diet and eat nothing. They get their entire nutrition through liquids.
    I'll stick with a diet of natural foods. Bleh...liquid diet.

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walter S View Post
    That probably depends on how long your rides are, how hot are you talking about, etc. I can only speak from experience. I typically ride about 80 miles per day average and spend 6-8 hours doing it. I have no problem maintaining my weight with an effort like that. I don't eat junk food, candy, etc. I'm eating what I normally do - complex carbs, protein, vegetables, fruit, nuts. I do eat more that normal, but not really much more. Although my normal (non-touring life) includes commuting by bicycle (40 miles RT), recreation on the weekends, shopping, etc. all by bicycle.
    Perhaps your body is well adapted considering your non-touring days is 40 miles. I think a long tour kind of forces you to deviate from any planned or preferred diet. I see it all the time on youtube any way as you are limited to what is around you. I see vegans eating meat because they have to.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by JEdward View Post
    Perhaps your body is well adapted considering your non-touring days is 40 miles. I think a long tour kind of forces you to deviate from any planned or preferred diet. I see it all the time on youtube any way as you are limited to what is around you. I see vegans eating meat because they have to.
    Really? I can't imagine. I'm a vegan myself. Wouldn't consider it. I can always find some beans or some rice, if not soy milk, etc.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walter S View Post
    I don't have a hard time getting enough calories. The more fit I get, the more efficient it seems. My weight stays pretty steady. I eat oatmeal cooked in soy milk with some dried fruit for breakfast. For lunch I typically get a foot long tuna or veggie sandwich at subway

    Quote Originally Posted by Walter S View Post
    Really? I can't imagine. I'm a vegan myself. Wouldn't consider it. I can always find some beans or some rice, if not soy milk, etc.
    Interesting definition of vegan.
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  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by raybo View Post
    Interesting definition of vegan.
    Vegan comes the closest. Most people would not quite get "fishetarian". I have fish about once a week.

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by raybo View Post
    Interesting definition of vegan.
    the guy was so hungry he ate a hamburger and pointed out he was vegan. Type in the guy who cycled the Americas in a youtube search, it's in one of those episodes I think.

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walter S View Post
    Vegan comes the closest. Most people would not quite get "fishetarian". I have fish about once a week.
    fishetarian = pescatarian

    A very healthy friend of my eats that way too, as do I -->"mostly". I consider myself an omnivore that way I have plenty of options
    Last edited by BigAura; 04-04-14 at 10:05 PM.

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walter S View Post
    Vegan comes the closest. Most people would not quite get "fishetarian". I have fish about once a week.
    Semi-vegetarian

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    You guys should check out this series, "The man who cycled the world" if you haven't already:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-YUy...aYZM7eQd9g7_ow

    I find myself picking up a lot of tips. This guy is a bit extreme though, going 100 miles every 22 days for the first leg...but all the issues that he has, kind of gives me a heads up on what to expect. He was using over 6000 calories a day.

  11. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walter S View Post
    Really? I can't imagine. I'm a vegan myself. Wouldn't consider it. I can always find some beans or some rice, if not soy milk, etc.
    Gee, you better study up on the effect of soy in the body. It's not good for you no matter how you are getting it. Study the facts and don't be surprised if you find yourself avoiding it in the future.

  12. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikenh View Post
    Gee, you better study up on the effect of soy in the body. It's not good for you no matter how you are getting it. Study the facts and don't be surprised if you find yourself avoiding it in the future.
    It's been a staple since the earliest days of human history in some parts of the world. And probably my primary source of protein on a daily basis for over 40 years. Webmd has nothing but good stuff to say about it.

    I think I'm gonna live.

  13. #63
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    I wouldn't base an entire diet around soy, by any means, but in moderation I'm thinking it's fine. If you're looking for a dairy milk substitute try almond milk: lower cal (not good so much for touring though), nutritional, and tastes good too.
    Last edited by BigAura; 04-05-14 at 09:42 AM.

  14. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walter S View Post
    It's been a staple since the earliest days of human history in some parts of the world. And probably my primary source of protein on a daily basis for over 40 years. Webmd has nothing but good stuff to say about it.

    I think I'm gonna live.
    From what I've heard soy causes an increase in estrogen levels, even in men. Women are finding themselves getting breast cancer more and more all the time and men are becoming less and less of men all the time as well. Why are men behaving this way is it because of the estrogen level increase thanks to soy. Better do some more research Walter.

    Just like global warming is gonna kill you, soy won't do a darn thing to you. I guess it depends on who you talk to as to what is going to occur. Like I said you better do some more research and always remember to ask a simple question of any website you visit...what is there agenda...who are their sponsors? Watch any research studies you take a look at...again who sponsored the study...what is there agenda.

  15. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigAura View Post
    I wouldn't base an entire diet around soy, by any means, but in moderation I'm thinking it's fine. If you're looking for a dairy milk substitute try almond milk: lower cal, nutritional, and tastes good too.
    I eat soy every day. I also eat beans, rice, lentils, etc. I would hardly say my diet is "based" around it. More than anything else my diet is based around fresh vegetables, fruit, nuts, oats. I think protein is over done in general. Partly because the meat industry has a strong lobbying influence on what the FDA says about that.

    Edit: good point on almond milk. I have some from time to time.
    Last edited by Walter S; 04-05-14 at 10:02 AM.

  16. #66
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikenh View Post
    From what I've heard soy causes an increase in estrogen levels, even in men. Women are finding themselves getting breast cancer more and more all the time and men are becoming less and less of men all the time as well. Why are men behaving this way is it because of the estrogen level increase thanks to soy. Better do some more research Walter.
    Let me get this right. You "heard" something about soy and then advice someone to do more research? Two quick google searches shows that you have absolutely no, none, zero, zippo, nada idea what you are talking about. Maybe you need to "do some more research."

    From cancer.org:

    In general, studies in Asian women have found a lower risk of breast cancer with eating more soy, whereas studies in the U.S. have tended to not find any association between how much soy a woman consumes and her risk of breast cancer. Indeed, a recent study combined data from 14 epidemiologic studies on this topic and found that in Asian countries, women who ate the most (compared to the least) soy isoflavones had a 24% lower risk of developing breast cancer, while there was no association in Western countries such as the U.S. (Entire article: The Bottom Line on Soy and Breast Cancer Risk)

    From cancer.gov:

    Although soy is a standard part of many Asian diets, it is less common in Western diets. Therefore, feasibility studies were undertaken to investigate whether Western participants would adhere to soy-supplementation interventions. In one study, healthy men were randomly assigned to consume a high-soy (two daily soy servings) or low-soy (usual diet) diet for 3 months. Following a 1-month washout period, the men crossed over to the other treatment. Reductions approaching statistical significance were seen in PSA levels following the high-soy diet. These findings suggest that this type of soy intervention study is feasible (i.e., the participants complied with dietary instructions) and that soy may be a potential chemopreventive agent. (Entire article: Prostate Cancer, Nutrition, and Dietary Supplements (PDQ) - National Cancer Institute)
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  17. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikenh View Post
    From what I've heard soy causes an increase in estrogen levels, even in men. Women are finding themselves getting breast cancer more and more all the time and men are becoming less and less of men all the time as well. Why are men behaving this way is it because of the estrogen level increase thanks to soy. Better do some more research Walter.
    Get a grip dude. My man parts are healthy if not damn frisky. I'll continue to base my nutritional practices on multiple correlated studies over the last 30 years instead of isolated comments from some guy on BF that can't reference such information.

  18. #68
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikenh View Post
    The RAAM riders go everyday for 8-10 days straight, day and night and they don't bonk. Some of them do a liquid diet and eat nothing. They get their entire nutrition through liquids.

    The biggest set of fatigue you will find yourself getting is mental fatigue. Watch the mind and how you are responding to things. That will tell you what to expect to come out of the body. When the mind starts to tire, for whatever reason, you will find the body will start to tire. Granted, this is also coming from the standpoint that you are in shape to begin with. Just remember the most important factor of life...the mind controls the body...not the other way around.
    What I recall about reading the history of the RAAM is that their average XC speed was in the 12 mph range, though it went up to 13+ mph (not sure about modern version of RAAM as those speeds aren't really comparable as historically the riders went on and on and on....). That still means nearly 300+? miles a day initially. What's that? 12,000-15,000 calories? Whoa. Just staying hydrated would be a challenge...which explains a liquid diet.
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  19. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikenh View Post
    Gee, you better study up on the effect of soy in the body. It's not good for you no matter how you are getting it. Study the facts and don't be surprised if you find yourself avoiding it in the future.
    bikenh,

    Your posts indicate that you are ignorant of most things nutrition. Do yourself a favor and get yourself straight before you mess yourself (and potentially others) up.

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikenh View Post
    From what I've heard soy causes an increase in estrogen levels, even in men. Women are finding themselves getting breast cancer more and more all the time and men are becoming less and less of men all the time as well. Why are men behaving this way is it because of the estrogen level increase thanks to soy. Better do some more research Walter.
    Men are turning into girly men because the feminization of our culture, not because they eat too much of anything (oh, except maybe Ritalin when they were children).

  21. #71
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    I agree with the people that say the fasted energy boost comes from consuming simple sugars. That does NOT mean that's "good for you". It's much better to plan ahead and eat right the day before. I believe the best energy source comes from the complex carbohydrates you consumed 24-36 hour before.

    Thats why long distance runners have talked for years about "packing carbs". Like eating a big plate of spaghetti for lunch, to prep for a race the following morning.

    There's some disagreement about that timing. And whole wheat breaks down slower than most pasta. I don't think about all that. I just eat a nutritious, balanced diet every day. I haven't bonked big time in a decade or more.

    I think finding that you need sugar now, may indicate you didn't eat right the day before.

  22. #72
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cyclesafe View Post
    bikenh,

    Your posts indicate that you are ignorant of most things nutrition. Do yourself a favor and get yourself straight before you mess yourself (and potentially others) up.
    "In 2009 the American Academy of Environmental Medicine called for a moratorium of GM foods, safety testing and labeling. Their review of the available literature at the time noted that animals show serious health risks associated with GM food consumption including infertility, immune dysregulation, accelerated aging, dysregulation of genes associated with cholesterol synthesis, insulin regulation, cell signaling, and protein formation, and changes in the liver, kidney, spleen and gastrointestinal system."(rest of the article from a former Pro GMO Scientist can be read at Former Pro-GMO Scientist Speaks Out On The Real Dangers of Genetically Engineered Food | Food Revolution Network)

    You need to remember the studies from overseas are showing more and more problems with GMO foods. The two biggest GMO foods are corn and soy. You can't hardly find any corn or soy anymore that is natural. All those GMO chemicals go right into your body when you eat foods that comes from GMO seeds. Several countries still won't important corn or soybeans from the United States because they don't want the GMO foods in their country. I think that says a lot about the safety of GMO foods...soy being one of them. Good old fashioned soy, probably is quite safe, but try to find any non-GMO soy seed out there, here in the Unites States.

    Like I said do your research. Research everything not just one thing. Soy in general might be safe but what about when you add those three letters in before it. GMO is BIG whether you like it or not and it pretty much effects all processed foods you eat anymore.

    I'll agree the fruits/veggies/complex carbs are the best method.

    The reason I eat the way I do is for simplicity and it accomplishes everything I'm trying to accomplish. I'm not trying to ride 50-75 miles a day when I go on a trip/tour. I'm generally riding 120 miles a day and sometimes as much as 170 miles in a day. I need to be on the bike not in the store shopping, not in the restaurant waiting for someone to come and serve me. That kinda limits what I eat throughout the day. I need it to be fast, easy to get ahold of. I pretty much only stop at gas stations throughout the day so I can go to the bathroom, fill up the water bottles and grab a snack. Otherwise I keep moving. Gas stations don't offer much of a variety. In the evenings I want to grab supper and get online to check email, check the weather and plan out the route for the next day. Normally I finish the day around 6-7PM. Most libraries and most(here in new England) mom and pops restaurants(most around here are breakfast/lunch joints) are closed by then so forget about stopping there. Also why only accomplish one task when you can do two things at once. Hence why I go to McDeath for supper. I watch what I eat so I'm getting the carbs and the sodium. Since I don't have a sense of taste or smell I never salt anything. If all food came without salt I would get no salt at all in my diet. Salt does nothing for me in terms of changing the taste so I don't put salt on anything. That's why around home I get no salt all day until supper time. I eat oatmeal for breakfast and a couple bananas for lunch. Both, according to the nutrition labels on the oatmeal I eat and what I seen online for the 'nutrition label' for bananas, they both contain no salt. All my salt comes at suppertime. I try to avoid that problem when on tripping/touring. I go for the high sodium in the morning and evening to help with the water retention. It works great for me and I haven't had any kind of dehydration issues when I've been on a trip and I haven't had any kind of trouble keeping up the speed, unless I run into being forced into rerouting due to road construction/flooding/train derailments/etc.

    Do I need the sugar during the day...probably not. I grab it for precautionary measures since I am generally riding a highly pressured trip/tour. If I was riding 50-75 miles a day I wouldn't eat any of it as their would be no reason to eat any of it. Since I'm doing high mileage I like to take precautionary to make sure I don't need it. Generally wherever I'm going I have a set date I have to be there no matter what. Both the past two years I've ended up being forced into leaving much later than planned and as a result I've had to make up the time on the road by riding higher miles each day. I can't take it easy, I have to get in the miles each day since my arrival time hasn't changed. I don't dare take the risk of running out of energy and having to take an easy day or I'll have to make up those miles as well. Yeah, it sucks but that's the way things have always been turning out. I always seem to end up getting forced into leaving for the trip later than planned and I just have to ride more miles than originally planned as a result since my arrival time is still the same.

    Sleep deprivation can do all kinds of crazy things to the body, including slowing it down. I don't think the RAAM boys are running into bonking as much as they are riding into sleep deprivation and they just can't keep the body moving as the only thing their body wants to do is shut down and go to sleep. Try spending the next three days off the bike/not doing anything too terribly active but fully awake 24 hours, around the clock, and then go out and ride you bike and see how your speed compares to when you have been getting a good nights sleep each night. I bet you'll find your speed will drop quite a bit as well compared to when your fully awake.

    To go back to JEdward's original question. A lot of guys, when you read their write ups, either in newspapers after their trip or on an online blog all end up taking around a day off each week during a cross country trip, both to rest and resupply. From what I've seen I would say that is probably right on the money, especially if you're not use to the riggers of riding each day and riding each day for the number of miles you are putting in each day. The day off gives you the chance to eat and consume more calories than you use for that one day. You have to remember if you consume 3000 calories a day and burn 4000 calories it will take you 3 days to lose one pound. By doing the one day off in seven would keep you from losing too much weight and seeing that much of an effect on the ride as a whole.

    The reasons people drop out can be from any of a number of things...not meeting their expectations, running out time, running out of money, getting hurt, etc. Just because someone doesn't finish a cross country trip doesn't mean they ran of energy. Like I said before, the mind is the biggest enemy/friend you'll have on any long distance trip. It can make you and it can break you. Everything comes down to how you react to situations, do you let them get to you or do you go out and overcome them.

    Like I've said before and most everyone else has said...hydration is far more of a worry than running out of calories. Unless you are already borderline anorexic you don't have much to worry about when it comes to running out of calories. For most Americans in this day and age you probably need to lose weight rather than maintain or gain weight. For most people, losing a few pounds can only do the body good.

  23. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikenh View Post
    It's kinda like I said above...the more you ride the more food you're going to need or going to end up craving in the long run. The only way you can truly get the food is to eat the junk food and go for the carbs/sugars. They are where the energy is located. The energy doesn't come from fat and the calories or energy don't come from fruits and veggies either.
    The energy doesn't come from fat? Please explain. I thought the body started burning fat once the carbs and sugar were used up?

  24. #74
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    Energy, it can be drawn from stored fat , but will pull it from carbohydrates first ..

    Nutella on a Baguette slice or so at the bottom of the hill

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    [QUOTE=bikenh;16644592All those GMO chemicals go right into your body when you eat foods that comes from GMO seeds.[/QUOTE]

    Any credibility you might have had has been blown out of the water by this statement. There are no GMO chemicals. There is merely a change in the order of naturally occurring nucleotides within the plant's genome. The Luddites didn't like mechanical looms either.
    Last edited by Cyclesafe; 04-05-14 at 07:43 PM.

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