Doug64

I believe that a pannier full of stuff sacks and zip lock bags is not an efficient way to pack. It is like a bag full of marbles--a lot of air space. I find that I can get more clothes in less space by rolling clothing, and using my panniers as a large stuff sack. However, some items like puff jackets or bulky clothes can be handled better with a sil-nylon compression sack.

My wife rode across the US using front panniers on her rear rack. She did carry her camping gear on top of the rack, but this would not be a problem for the OP. Without camping gear, she could have managed very neatly with the 2 small front panniers and a bar bag.

I also think that the OP's packing list should fit in a pair of front panniers. However, I don't know the bulk of some of the items,e.g.,rain gear, pants, etc.; so my opinion might be off base. I guess another approach would be to not worry about reserving space for food you probably won't need. I have not cycled in Italy, but have spent 3 months cycling through several other European countries, and did not see where maintaining a vegetarian regime would have posed significant problems. Again, that is only my perspective, and It may be entirely wrong.

Take the camping gear off the top of the rack, and it is a light compact load. She had everything need to sustain her for 2 1/2 months, and I think her packing list included more clothes than the OP's.

staehpj1

On the scrunching of clothes... I have experimented a good bit with that and I have not had the bag of marbles problem. I had the best results with small silnylon stuff sacks with or without roll down tops, usually some of each.

First I get the clothes jammed into the little bags very tightly. For some items rolling works better for some stuffing works best. On the rolld own top bags, I then try to get it even tighter as I roll down the tops.

I find that with practice I get better and better at jamming more into less space, so don't give up after one try unless satisfied with the result.

Next I pack them into the pannier. I think this through as kind of a jigsaw puzzle and really jam them tightly. They have enough give and flexibility that you can really pack them tight if you want/need to. The only problem I have had with this step was when I tried to pack them too tight into a Ultrasil dry bag instead of a pannier and ripped the dry bag. It was a pretty flimsy dry bag though. Again don't give up after one try it gets easier to get more in with practice. After you think it is full you can usually jam another stuff sack down beside the others.

I try to find small stuff sacks or roll top bags in colors so I can color code what is in what bag. Taller skinnier ones often seem to work best. I use a combination of slinylon stuff sacks I bought from REI (sea2summit ultrasil I think) and some roll top bags from walmart that came in a set of 3. Sizes from 2.5 to 5 liters or so are nice and I like to have a variety of sizes and colors.

indyfabz

Where exactly? I was at a camp in Borso del Grappa, outside of Bassano del Grappa, in 2013. It snowed a couple of nights on Monte Grappa. That was in late May. A guy I know owns a cycling "camp" in Borso. The last few springs have been abnormally cold and wet. 2013 was the coldest, wettest spring is something like 70 years. Last year wasn't much better. In either '13 or '14 they cancelled a Dolomites stage of the Giro due to snow.

raybo

Not the best of news.

My plan is to fly into Malpensa (Milan's Airport), stay near there, and ride out the next day up toward the lakes. Then, along the southern part of the lakes east to Vicenza, north through Bassano del Grappa and into then head into the hills and going back west to Malpensa along the northern side of the lakes and through the 1200 meter pass at Aprica. If I can, I'd like to do an up and back to Bormio (but no higher), but that would depend on the weather.

While there are lots of interesting roads that top out at 2000 meters, I haven't included any of them on my route to avoid potential weather problems. Should things be warm and clear, I might try to crest one of them, though I have driven through some of them and they look very difficult.

I am basing most of my route on the Italy Cycling Guide site. Here is a map of the routes suggested on that site.

I'd be interested in any and all information you might have about riding in this area.

raybo

I have succeeded in cramming everything in the front panniers. It is a tight fit and I have to do a fair amount of squeezing, but it all fits in with a bit of "food" room to spare. However, I have begun wondering if it is worth it just to save 1 inch? The weight savings of using the front versus rear Ortliebs is 11 ounces, close to the weight of a frame bag.

Note that I am new to low-rider racks and will have to get used to riding them. It isn't clear to me that riding with the front Ortliebs is appreciably safer than using the rear ones. If I get accustomed to riding with the rear ones up front, then why do all the cramming just to save 1 inch and 11 ounces?

For now, I'm going to ride with the front bags and see how I like it.

Tourist in MSN

Different bikes handle differently with a front load, only you can decide if you want to move some of that weight further back or not.

indyfabz

Got to run to a dinner party. Not sure what else I can add as we stayed in one place and did day rides, but I will say that if you end up in Bassano do not miss the free WWI museum located underneath a bar/cafe located at one of the corners of the famous old bridge in town. The collection of artifacts from the war is amazing. It even has a recreation of a trench with a canary to indicate poison gas. There is also a Bianchi with "S&S couplers" that was used by soldiers. Right near there is the Polti grappa museum where you can do some tastings.

TuscanCyclist

Check out this website:




Cycle Toscana. Discover Tuscany by bicycle, stress free


It focuses on cycle touring in Tuscany but has also many useful information for a ride elsewhere in Italy.


Here you can find updated infos in English on bike rentals, accomodations, cycle routes,... in Tuscany and in Italy (all available from a single web source, without loosing your mind across tons of websites, most of the times in Italian).


Unfortunately, English isn't spoken so often among Italians and this website can be extremely helpful.


Hope it helps and enyoj the ride


Cheers

Rob_E

I have my "essential" camping gear in two, Ortleib, back roller panniers that I carry on my front rack. Then I usually end up with stuff on the rear rack, too, because I'm a pack rat. It works. I prefer the handling of the bike when I have more weight up front, but I think I might prefer it even more if it were more balanced. Maybe 4 front rollers instead of 2 back rollers.

Difference is that I'm using an Old Man Mountain front platform rack, and the bags ride relatively high up, so I can't speak to the clearance issues. But I do agree that front rollers up front with maybe a saddle bag might be a better solution, if it would work for you.

But if the back rollers in the front are working, then you have your answer. I like having extra space. My problem is that, having extra space, I then look for ways to fill it. If you find that there are no handling or clearance issues with your current set up, and you can resist the urge to over pack, then I guess you're in good shape.