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  1. #1
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    Surly LHT Chainring

    Hey all,

    Looks like it's time to replace my chainrings on my Surly LHT as the teeth are grinding down and one missing. Currently running the stock Andel RSC6, 26/36/48t square taper interface. Can anyone recommend a solid set of chainrings to replace my current ones. I was thinking of just getting a new set of cranks but nothing is wrong with my arms. All help greatly appreciated.

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    coprolite fietsbob's Avatar
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    7075t6 alloy is used to machine the more expensive but longer wearing alloy rings (many brands).. TA of France is one.

    Sugino uses a softer aluminum but they are cheaper..

    the surly stainless steel is even longer wearing a friction left lever will shift the old style full height teeth ..


    you may want the shifting pins & ramps , I manage without them

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    Quote Originally Posted by fietsbob View Post
    7075t6 alloy is used to machine the more expensive but longer wearing alloy rings (many brands).. TA of France is one.

    Sugino uses a softer aluminum but they are cheaper..

    the surly stainless steel is even longer wearing a friction left lever will shift the old style full height teeth ..


    you may want the shifting pins & ramps , I manage without them
    Great thanks! Any if i'm not mistaken that's 110 bcd for these parts?

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    coprolite fietsbob's Avatar
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    yea I'd suppose so .. 110 bcd Outer 2.. granny a 74bcd 24t the smallest.

    Measure and confirm http://sheldonbrown.com/harris/chainrings.html
    Last edited by fietsbob; 02-03-15 at 01:35 PM.

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    Senior Member Doug64's Avatar
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    The Sugino XD 600 are nice cranks with the same size rings you have now.

    Sometimes it is almost as expensive to replace chainrings as it is to get a new crankset. I have two sets of new crank arms in my parts box, because I could buy the whole crankset cheaper than individual rings for a Shimano 442/443 crankset. These were stock on Cannondale touring bikes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug64 View Post
    The Sugino XD 600 are nice cranks with the same size rings you have now.

    Sometimes it is almost as expensive to replace chainrings as it is to get a new crankset. I have two sets of new crank arms in my parts box, because I could buy the whole crankset cheaper than individual rings for a Shimano 442/443 crankset. These were stock on Cannondale touring bikes.
    Those Sugino XD 600's are indeed nice. And yes, the chainrings will amount to just about the same if not more. Any other suggestions for crank selections before I go ahead with the XD 600's?

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    Senior Member headloss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by biketocamp View Post
    Those Sugino XD 600's are indeed nice. And yes, the chainrings will amount to just about the same if not more. Any other suggestions for crank selections before I go ahead with the XD 600's?
    If you are going the triple crank route, XD 600 is one of the only good options.

    If you go the chain ring option, the Stronglight Dural line is cheap from UK vendors, they don't last as long but the cheaper rings have given me an opportunity to play around with different sizes.

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    Quote Originally Posted by headloss View Post
    If you are going the triple crank route, XD 600 is one of the only good options.

    If you go the chain ring option, the Stronglight Dural line is cheap from UK vendors, they don't last as long but the cheaper rings have given me an opportunity to play around with different sizes.
    RIght on thank! Would it be an issue if I went from a triple to a double on my setup?

  9. #9
    Mad bike riding scientist cyccommute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by biketocamp View Post
    Hey all,

    Looks like it's time to replace my chainrings on my Surly LHT as the teeth are grinding down and one missing. Currently running the stock Andel RSC6, 26/36/48t square taper interface. Can anyone recommend a solid set of chainrings to replace my current ones. I was thinking of just getting a new set of cranks but nothing is wrong with my arms. All help greatly appreciated.
    Don't be so quick to jump to the conclusion that your chainrings are worn or that you have a tooth missing. Chainrings can last for 10,000 miles or more (sometime much more) before they need replacement. The Andel looks like it has pinned and ramped teeth. Some of those teeth will look flatter than others but that is what they should look like. Pictures of your crank would be helpful.

    Worn teeth will look like the ring in this post. That is known as "shark finning" since the teeth look like a shark fin. The second picture shows how some of the teeth are shorter than others. Don't replace your chainrings unnecessarily
    Stuart Black
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyccommute View Post
    Don't be so quick to jump to the conclusion that your chainrings are worn or that you have a tooth missing. Chainrings can last for 10,000 miles or more (sometime much more) before they need replacement. The Andel looks like it has pinned and ramped teeth. Some of those teeth will look flatter than others but that is what they should look like. Pictures of your crank would be helpful.

    Worn teeth will look like the ring in this post. That is known as "shark finning" since the teeth look like a shark fin. The second picture shows how some of the teeth are shorter than others. Don't replace your chainrings unnecessarily
    Thanks! The bike has close to 10,000 miles I'd say. The teeth are totally worn on the 48t and bent with a broken one on the 36t. My chain keeps slipping and flying off as well. I inspected the front and rear derailleur's which seem to be fine. I ready replaced the cassette a couple weeks a go.

  11. #11
    Clark W. Griswold
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    Another +1 for the XD600. I am thinking about getting that one for my new Co-Motion Cascadia when it comes (just sent in the last forums yesterday). Though I am also considering the Velo Orange Grand Cru Fluted Triple because of their quality, looks and a slightly lower gearing. I am probably going to go with the XD600 because I can more easily get that in my shop but things might change.

    In case you wanted to check it out:
    http://store.velo-orange.com/index.php/components/cranksets/cranks/grand-cru-110-fluted-triple-crankset-24x34x48t.html

    The LHT/DT Andel Cranks are 110/74 BCD, I don't think that had ever changed but maybe in the future they might consider it.
    Quote Originally Posted by jhess74 View Post
    just flip it over to fixed and forget about brakes. check out the documentary "premium rush" for more info.

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    Senior Member robert schlatte's Avatar
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    I had a sugino on my touring bike. However, after reading on these forums about advantages with Hollowtech II technology, I just switched out my crankset for a Deore M590 (48-36-26 version) which I picked up for $65 from Chain Reaction Cycles in the UK. My bet is that would be much cheaper than changing all you chainrings.

    Deore cranks.jpgDeore crankset 2.jpg

  13. #13
    Mad bike riding scientist cyccommute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by robert schlatte View Post
    I had a sugino on my touring bike. However, after reading on these forums about advantages with Hollowtech II technology, I just switched out my crankset for a Deore M590 (48-36-26 version) which I picked up for $65 from Chain Reaction Cycles in the UK. My bet is that would be much cheaper than changing all you chainrings.
    +1 Installation and removal is far easier than any square taper crank. It also has a 109/64 BCD which allows for an inner gear as low as 20 teeth. There are also lots of Shimano square taper cranks out there with the same BCD for around $40.
    Stuart Black
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    Senior Member headloss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by biketocamp View Post
    RIght on thank! Would it be an issue if I went from a triple to a double on my setup?
    Sure. It's not unheard of to use the middle ring as the "big ring" and throw a 110mm chain guard on the outside instead of a ring. Chainline wouldn't be optimal but it wouldn't shift any different than having three rings on the same crank. Likewise, you could keep the middle and outer ring and drop the granny, but I don't see the point in doing that (just keep the ring even if you don't use it).

    Just keep in mind any requirements for your front derailleur if using different ring sizes. What model is the FD? Some of them require specific minimum tooth count differences between rings... you currently have 48-36=12t so you may run into problems if you want to run a 48/38 (10t difference) for example.
    Last edited by headloss; 02-04-15 at 08:11 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by robert schlatte View Post
    I had a sugino on my touring bike. However, after reading on these forums about advantages with Hollowtech II technology, I just switched out my crankset for a Deore M590 (48-36-26 version) which I picked up for $65 from Chain Reaction Cycles in the UK. My bet is that would be much cheaper than changing all you chainrings.

    Deore cranks.jpgDeore crankset 2.jpg
    The Deore M590 are solid cranks. Looks like they have a GXP bottom bracket. Thoughts on that vs the square taper. My bottom bracket is 68 x 118mm on the trucker. Do you notice anything with the chain line being different.

  16. #16
    Mad bike riding scientist cyccommute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by biketocamp View Post
    The Deore M590 are solid cranks. Looks like they have a GXP bottom bracket. Thoughts on that vs the square taper. My bottom bracket is 68 x 118mm on the trucker. Do you notice anything with the chain line being different.
    Technically they use a Shimano bottom bracket. GXP is a Sram product and needs an adapter to work with Shimano's bottom bracket.

    From the stand point of functionality, there is little difference. I have several external bottom bracket cranks and the bearings are just as robust as any other cartridge bearing bottom bracket I've used. I've never had one go bad on me but I've never had any cartridge bearing bottom bracket go bad in, roughly, 25 years of use.

    The external BB is much easier to install and adjust than square tapers, however. You don't need a different length spindle to adjust the chainline. You use spacers on the cups to move the crank inboard or outboard to get the chainline correct. The spindle of the crank is a fixed length.

    I actually find it much easier to adjust chainline than a conventional bottom bracket. The chainline of a mountain bike crank is a little wider than a road crank. If you are using STI shifter and/or a road front derailer, you need to move the crank inboard to get the front derailer to shift to the outer ring smoothy. You add spacers to the nondrive side and remove them from the drive side to get the chainline right. It's trivial to remove the crank and bearing cups, move spacers, and reinstall.

    A mountain bike crank with a square taper BB has be moved inboard as well but it's not nearly as trivial. You have to get a new BB of the proper length, remove the crank bolts, press the crank off the spindle, remove the BB, replace the BB, reinstall the crank bolts, and press the crank onto the spindle. Then you have to go back to the bike shop and get the proper BB and repeat. If your shop has to special order the parts, you might be waiting for a while to get the BB and you may have to eat it if it doesn't fit...depends on the shops special order policy.
    Stuart Black
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  17. #17
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    Cyccommute, Interesting comment about longevity of outboard BB. I built up our LHT's a year ago Fall and my BB,Shimano, and I got about 8,000 miles out of it before it needed to be replaced. I wonder if I had a bad one?

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    Senior Member robert schlatte's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by biketocamp View Post
    The Deore M590 are solid cranks. Looks like they have a GXP bottom bracket. Thoughts on that vs the square taper. My bottom bracket is 68 x 118mm on the trucker. Do you notice anything with the chain line being different.
    The bb that comes with the Deore crankset is Shimano BB-51. I think it is fairly basic but I'll use it until it wears out. As far as chainline for a 68mm bb shell, they tell you to put two 2.5mm spaces on the drive side and one on the non-drive. This puts the drive side a little farther out than the 113mm square taper I was running before. Like Cycommute says, if you want the drive side crank more inboard just remove one or both of the spacers and put them on the non drive side. I tend to be in my big chain ring most of the time so I may move one of the spacers over. I have not yet ridden the bike and I am looking forward to it. In truth, I was absolutely happy with the square taper sugino crank but I was curious about the Hollowtech II stuff. Supposedly, the larger diameter spindle (24mm) makes for a slightly stiffer feel. We'll see. As far as bearing life, I don't ride this bike in the snow or off road in the mud, etc., so I'm not too concerned with a lot of contaminants. Eventually, I'd like to upgrade to a better BB and then either buy or make a tool to pull/ press new bearings into the cups. Question for others, what is a good external BB replacement for touring, etc.?

  19. #19
    Mad bike riding scientist cyccommute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tandem Tom View Post
    Cyccommute, Interesting comment about longevity of outboard BB. I built up our LHT's a year ago Fall and my BB,Shimano, and I got about 8,000 miles out of it before it needed to be replaced. I wonder if I had a bad one?
    Perhaps. The bottom bracket isn't all that expensive, however. You could always go with Chris King which is more expensive but has a 5 year warranty and comes in lots of nifty colors.
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  20. #20
    Senior Member Doug64's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cyccommute View Post

    A mountain bike crank with a square taper BB has be moved inboard as well but it's not nearly as trivial. You have to get a new BB of the proper length, remove the crank bolts, press the crank off the spindle, remove the BB, replace the BB, reinstall the crank bolts, and press the crank onto the spindle. Then you have to go back to the bike shop and get the proper BB and repeat. If your shop has to special order the parts, you might be waiting for a while to get the BB and you may have to eat it if it doesn't fit...depends on the shops special order policy.
    I don't have strong feelings either way, although I prefer the square taper.

    An easy way to determine corrrect BB spindle length when converting from a road to mtn crankset is to install the mtn crank on your present BB, measure the chainline, subtract 45 mm from that number, multiply by two, and subtract that from the existing BB braket's length. It almost took me longer to type this than it does to do the actual measurements.

  21. #21
    Mad bike riding scientist cyccommute's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doug64 View Post
    I don't have strong feelings either way, although I prefer the square taper.

    An easy way to determine corrrect BB spindle length when converting from a road to mtn crankset is to install the mtn crank on your present BB, measure the chainline, subtract 45 mm from that number, multiply by two, and subtract that from the existing BB braket's length. It almost took me longer to type this than it does to do the actual measurements.
    You still need a new BB and you have to remove and replace the old one. You only need a spacer for external bottom brackets.
    Stuart Black
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  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by biketocamp View Post
    Thanks! The bike has close to 10,000 miles I'd say. The teeth are totally worn on the 48t and bent with a broken one on the 36t. My chain keeps slipping and flying off as well. I inspected the front and rear derailleur's which seem to be fine. I ready replaced the cassette a couple weeks a go.
    Got any pictures?
    Quote Originally Posted by chandltp View Post
    There's no such thing as too far.. just lack of time
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    coprolite fietsbob's Avatar
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    Re 14 post a Middle of a triple is centered like a 1X so itt works like a 1X with a granny bail out..

    dropping the granny for a compact double Id suggest a shorter BB to Move the remaining pair In ti be splitting the chainline. between them ...



    Yea Bike Factories only Buy Complete cranksets, so the crank companies make a lot of them.. millions.
    and so the whole thing is often less than Buying the 3 individual chainrings.

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