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Old 05-24-06, 11:04 PM   #1
goggles
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Tied and soldered spokes

Is there an advantage to doing this? Are track racers still tying and soldering? Out of curiosity can someone give a methodology for doing this? Any specific type and guage of metal wire or solder? Is it also possible to just tie the spokes without soldering?

If you do both, how does this affect truing the wheel in the future? Lots of questions!

Thanks
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Old 05-24-06, 11:20 PM   #2
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Suggest you do a search across the forum. You'll get many pings. This subject has been covered in intense detail.
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Old 05-25-06, 04:23 AM   #3
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Heres some good advice oh how to tie & solder I got from CafeRacer (burried in a thread about the Fuji Track Pro).

Theres a lot of info on t&s in the SingleSpeed/FixedGear forum on bikeforums.net; will have to search a little to find out.

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Originally Posted by CafeRacer
I used a good strenth safety wire that would wrap up tight. Leave about an inch or so sticking out and tightly wrap and buch together the loops. I did 5 loops. On the last loop twist it with the extra one inch you left. Then with plyers tighten it all together by twisting as close to the wraped part. Be carfull you dont break it. You will break a few. Neatly cut the extra off and fold the "knot" against the wraps.

As for the soldering I used a good flux and alot of it. Be sure to get it in between the spokes and loops. I used "electronicss" guage solder. It melts faster than the flux burns off. I also used a low heat torch instead of a iron. You dont need much either. Just enough to "absorb" into the wire and hold it together. Plus if you have alot hanging off it looks like junk.

When your done, let it cool and then do a really good job with soap and water cleaning the spokes and ties off. They will look burnt at first but it cleans up nicly.
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Old 05-25-06, 09:40 PM   #4
Mike T.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goggles
Is there an advantage to doing this? Are track racers still tying and soldering?
Careful! You're opening up a can o' worms! The "it's useless" crowd get downright snarly about it. The "I do it" crowd (me included) basically say "Do it if it pleases you". At worst it adds a few small grams.

Quote:
Out of curiosity can someone give a methodology for doing this? Any specific type and guage of metal wire or solder?
Sure, it's at the end of my Wheels FAQ.

Quote:
Is it also possible to just tie the spokes without soldering?
Not that I'm aware of.

Quote:
If you do both, how does this affect truing the wheel in the future?
Not at all. The solder doesn't stick to the spokes. It just sticks to the wire. If I flex my spokes I can feel them move within the tie.

I don't voice much of an opinion whether T&S is of any use for radially stiffening a wheel. I don't have the means to test its effectiveness or lack of. I do think it stiffens my wheels for g-force loading on our 50 degree bankings though. I don't have a test for that either but if you experienced 50kph on our tight radius steep track there's a good chance you'd T&S your wheels too - most of our riders have.
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Old 05-26-06, 06:33 AM   #5
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Going in a straight line fast or slow I cant feel the differance. The major differance is when your sprinting up to speed. Say for instance....throwing down all available horsepower to get around Keith Thorinsan It limits how much the wheel can flex out side to side. Espessialy if your using traditional style tubular rims.

The other benifit to it is saftey related almost. In a Keirin several of us bunched up after somone locked a wheel in front and the sound of spokes hitting axle nuts was pretty obvious. Even though I had 4 or 5 in the front wheel that were horribly bent they stayed in the wheel instead of flying around. They even had tention in them. If they hadnt been tied they would have been rubbing my fork / somones leg and I probably wouldnt have been able to ride off the track. Too bad it doesnt help a pedal to the shin at all

J
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Old 05-26-06, 10:39 PM   #6
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Hmmm, since radial spokes a now fairly common on fast front wheels and the non-drive side of rear wheels that have spokes I wonder how you'll tie and solder those spokes. And I've spent an hour trying, but I just can't figure out how to tie and solder any of my disk wheels.
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Old 05-27-06, 11:52 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WarrenG
Hmmm, since radial spokes a now fairly common on fast front wheels and the non-drive side of rear wheels that have spokes I wonder how you'll tie and solder those spokes. And I've spent an hour trying, but I just can't figure out how to tie and solder any of my disk wheels.
Silly man, you need to drill them out first.
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Old 05-28-06, 09:46 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goggles
Is it also possible to just tie the spokes without soldering?
If you don't feel comfortable with soldering, you can just glue the tie wires with epoxy or similar.

- L.
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Old 06-05-06, 06:16 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WarrenG
Hmmm, since radial spokes a now fairly common on fast front wheels and the non-drive side of rear wheels that have spokes I wonder how you'll tie and solder those spokes. And I've spent an hour trying, but I just can't figure out how to tie and solder any of my disk wheels.

Not all of us can afford disc wheels But it sure feels good to win against somone's who's on em.
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