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  1. #1
    Ol' Reliable formerbrit's Avatar
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    Powertap track wheel

    http://www.wheelbuilder.com/store/wh...-powertap.html

    The Wheelbuilder designed Track PowerTap is now available for sale. The same engineer who designed the Saris CycleOps MTB PowerTap designed this conversion for fixed gear racing and training. Wheelbuilder’s Track hub provides reliable wireless power data with CycleOps’ +/- 1.5% PowerTap accuracy.

    “…given that on the track the difference between winning and losing is often extremely small, it can be argued that track cyclists may benefit from use of a powermeter to an even greater extent than road (or off-road) cyclists.”
    - Andrew Coggan, Ph.D.

    The Track PowerTap has a 17mm axle and is designed for use with White Industries’ splined cogs, available in 1/8" or 3/32" widths with 14-19T. Splined cogs are available at a discount when purchased with a new Track PowerTap or Track PowerTap conversion. The hub attaches to dropouts via high strength 8mm socket head cap screw axle bolts.

    All Track PowerTap hubs are available as a complete system or as “hub-only.” PowerTap systems include all CycleOps electronic accessories: yellow CPU receiver, coded HR monitor and USB data download cradle. Hub-only systems do not include CycleOps electronic accessories for the benefit of riders who already own a wireless PowerTap system. These athletes can use the same electronic accessories with multiple PowerTap hubs.

    Wheelbuilder offers new Track PowerTap hubs, or we can convert your current hub. The track conversion is available for all wireless versions of the PowerTap and is a permanent alteration. The Track hub has the same warranty as all other PowerTap products and a track conversion does not void your existing warranty.

    Also refer to the Track PowerTap section of the Wheelbuilder FAQ page.

    Technical specifications:
    • Designed by Wheelbuilder.com
    • Weight: 402g Pro+; 460g SL+
    • Axle Width: 120mm track standard
    • Axle diameter: 17mm
    • Cogs: White Industries splined cogs, available in 1/8" or 3/32"; 14-19T
    • Axle Bolts: uses high strength 8mm socket head cap screws
    • Compatibility: All Wireless 2.4 GHz and ANT+ PT models


    Due to the level of attention that goes into every wheel, Wheelbuilder's wheels will outperform every other hand built wheel. Each wheel's tension is balanced for optimal performance, giving you the strongest wheel possible. Perfection matters to me and that's why I recommend Wheelbuilder wheels.
    Jamie Staff MBE,
    World Champion
    Olympic Gold Medalist

    Details


    Product Weight (g) 402g (SL+); 460g (Pro+)
    Price: $1,649.00








    Looks pretty nice. I've wanted to have power on a track bike for a while. Not many can afford an SRM and if they do they usually pick the road bike for it.
    "I have started many stories about bicycle racing but have never written one that is as good as the races are both on the indoor and outdoor tracks and on the roads."
    -Ernest Hemingway, A Moveable Feast

  2. #2
    Veteran Racer TejanoTrackie's Avatar
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    The sprocket range (14-19 tooth) makes no sense for track use, nor does the availability of 3/32 cogs. The trend today is to use smaller chainrings and smaller cogs. I can't imagine not having at least a 13T available and some powerful elite riders even train with a 12T.

  3. #3
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    Heads up - for those interested in this hub. Note this is from the UK and I am not sure how US Customs work. Here in Australia anything from OS under AU$1,000 is tax free...

    Bob from http://www.cyclepowermeters.com/ posted a few days ago in the following topic - http://www.timetriallingforum.co.uk/...howtopic=67696 that they are selling these hubs for 50% off at the moment.

    "50% off Powertap SL+ Track hubs - only 580 while stocks last
    20,24,28 and 32 hole available."

    This isn't listed as such online, you have to call

    "give me a call on 01788 556860 for that price."

    Note I have no affiliation withe the above site and already have power on my bikes, but just thought it may interest some here.
    http://climbinglama.blogspot.com.au

  4. #4
    No matches Flatballer's Avatar
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    Personally I'm waiting for one of the pedal based systems to finally come out. Then the PT on my road bike is getting sold and I'll just swap my pedals around.
    It's a bike race, not a tea party. - GirlAnachronism

  5. #5
    VeloSIRraptor
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    Quote Originally Posted by TejanoTrackie View Post
    The sprocket range (14-19 tooth) makes no sense for track use, nor does the availability of 3/32 cogs. The trend today is to use smaller chainrings and smaller cogs. I can't imagine not having at least a 13T available and some powerful elite riders even train with a 12T.
    I know this comment is old - but since the thread got resurrected, I'll at least give this one reply for those reading it for the first time.

    -There are racers at all levels (including WC levels) that race on 3/32" gear.
    -Powertaps are for training - discs are for racing... anyone who needs a 13t won't be riding on a spoked wheel anyway.
    -I personally see racers with nat'l champs stripes & uci stripes riding PT wheels at our track on a regular basis... this tool is just fine for the job.

    Sure, an SRM or a Quarq is potentially better suited to track use - but a PT is just dandy for 98% of all track racers.

    I personally have a Quarq, and it works just fine.
    Quote Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
    If it comes down to a field sprint, you probably won't win, so don't let it.

  6. #6
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    If they can release an accurate system (be it the Brim Brothers cleat system, Garmin Vector or recently released Polar Look) the pedal system does appear to be the most flexible option.

    Must say for all three possible options, I wouldn't be selling my wired SRM's (all bought second hand and working flawlesly) and signing up for Version 1.0, with all the possible repercussions of realistically being a beta tester.
    http://climbinglama.blogspot.com.au

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hida Yanra View Post
    I personally have a Quarq, and it works just fine.
    Compact Quarq and adapter plate? Talk was of a Track version using a Rotor crank a while back but can't find any details in the product list...
    http://climbinglama.blogspot.com.au

  8. #8
    VeloSIRraptor
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dalai View Post
    Compact Quarq and adapter plate? Talk was of a Track version using a Rotor crank a while back but can't find any details in the product list...
    There are a few of those at my track that are working very well, but no, I've opted for 130bcd track rings.
    Over on FGF you can dig up the details of the guys w/ the adapter plates - machined in Australia, top notch stuff really.
    Quote Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
    If it comes down to a field sprint, you probably won't win, so don't let it.

  9. #9
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    Didn't think about 130BCD track chainrings... How do you find the chain line? Also have you checked if there is a noticeable difference in the slope after swapping chainrings?
    http://climbinglama.blogspot.com.au

  10. #10
    Elitist carleton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flatballer View Post
    Personally I'm waiting for one of the pedal based systems to finally come out. Then the PT on my road bike is getting sold and I'll just swap my pedals around.
    I would imagine that the holdup in that they aren't passing testing. Which means that they will be really buggy for the first generation that does finally hit the streets.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hida Yanra View Post
    I know this comment is old - but since the thread got resurrected, I'll at least give this one reply for those reading it for the first time.

    -There are racers at all levels (including WC levels) that race on 3/32" gear.
    -Powertaps are for training - discs are for racing... anyone who needs a 13t won't be riding on a spoked wheel anyway.
    -I personally see racers with nat'l champs stripes & uci stripes riding PT wheels at our track on a regular basis... this tool is just fine for the job.

    Sure, an SRM or a Quarq is potentially better suited to track use - but a PT is just dandy for 98% of all track racers.

    I personally have a Quarq, and it works just fine.
    The last bike check I read of Sarah Hammer she was riding 3/32. And you are right, there are many others. But, it is a pain to borrow stuff at the track (which happens sometimes.). There is a college student at our track who has a 3/32 setup and only a few chainrings and like 2 cogs. He can't borrow anything. It's just easier if you are on the standard 1/8".

    Quote Originally Posted by Dalai View Post
    If they can release an accurate system (be it the Brim Brothers cleat system, Garmin Vector or recently released Polar Look) the pedal system does appear to be the most flexible option.

    Must say for all three possible options, I wouldn't be selling my wired SRM's (all bought second hand and working flawlesly) and signing up for Version 1.0, with all the possible repercussions of realistically being a beta tester.
    Yeah, I have a wired SRM setup, too and it's rock solid. I especially like the 0.5" sampling rate option. Much better than the 1" or 1.2" that the PowerTap system has. This is great for data from short sprint events. I really don't know why computer manufacturers don't make that an option. It's a minor software tweak.

  11. #11
    Elitist carleton's Avatar
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    http://www.lookcycle.com/en/us/route...keo-power.html

    The LOOK Keo Power pedals are only spec'd to work for 170, 172.5, 175 or 177.5 mm cranks. So, trackies who like 165 or 167.5mm are out of luck. Not sure why crank length matters, though, since the strain gauges measure torque. Torque is torque, right?

    Also, the fact that it's not ANT+ is just plain stupid. They want force people to buy their sub-standard Polar head units.

    Here's a field test of 3 power meter systems on the same bike (wheel, cranks, and pedals): http://www.bikeradar.com/blog/articl...-pedals-32678/

  12. #12
    Elitist carleton's Avatar
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    Sorry for the multiple posts.

    Pedals are theoretically the best system...IF they can work out the kinks.

    - Pedals are closer to the power source (legs) than cranks or wheels. Wheel PMs have the added interference of the chain.
    - Pedals come in one size. No need to buy different sizes like you would with a crank PM.
    - Will work on any bike. Track and road bikes will use the same road pedals and CX and MTB bikes will use the MTB style pedals. Anyone serious enough to invest in power meters usually has multiple bikes of multiple disciplines.
    - Left vs Right output analysis. We all favor one leg over the other. Watch Victoria Pendleton in a sprint. She favors one leg BIG TIME. That's when you know she's giving 100%. If you don't see her favoring one side, that means she's got more in the tank.
    - Can use any wheel or crankset you like. I have SRM cranks, but I really really like the feel of Dura Ace cranks. The SRM cranks are actually the stiffest I've ever used...but the DA simply feel better. Less harsh, I guess.

    The only real drawback is that you are locked into a pedal system.

    I really hope they take off. That means that the prices will go down on all of this stuff with more offerings on the market.

    That being said, I think that power analysis is cool. Especially for Pursuiting. Not so much for sprinting. Everything is maximal in sprinting. There is no pacing. Speed and Cadence are much more important metrics. The charting of the data is very important, too. And of course recording frequency. 1" is not fast enough to get great data sets from track sprint efforts like standing 125M, standing 250M, flying 100M, flying 200M. This is why stopwatches are great. But, if you are self-coaching, the power meter is your on-board recording device.

  13. #13
    VeloSIRraptor
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    Carleton - Agreed on your points, good work being a the voice of reason
    Especially on 3/32, I've counseled a few kids (college students in fact) that are starting on our track to go with 1/8... better options for borrowing.

    Dalai - yes, there is variation in the slope, but since I know the slope of all my chainrings, I plug the appropriate one into Qualvin & ride away.
    I don't ride the Quarq all the time, I sometimes use Sram Omniums... same BB makes for easy swapping.
    Quote Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
    If it comes down to a field sprint, you probably won't win, so don't let it.

  14. #14
    No matches Flatballer's Avatar
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    That's stupid about the crank length. The ANT+ thing also makes no sense. However, there's word that they might be holding out and making it a bluetooth version, which is supposedly the next standard, and you could use any phone, etc.

    I'm personally waiting for the Vector. ANT+, I already like Keo, cheaper, etc.
    It's a bike race, not a tea party. - GirlAnachronism

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by carleton View Post
    Yeah, I have a wired SRM setup, too and it's rock solid. I especially like the 0.5" sampling rate option. Much better than the 1" or 1.2" that the PowerTap system has. This is great for data from short sprint events. I really don't know why computer manufacturers don't make that an option. It's a minor software tweak.
    Wait - so the Powertap is sampling just every second or even more? I wonder if that is why im always so disappointed by my peak numbers?! haha

    Seriously though, this is good to know, cause i was using the peak number as a gauge for my sprint efforts (trying to repeat, never too consistent). Now i see that isnt the greatest idea (road bike work, btw - i dont have a power meter on my track bike)

  16. #16
    Elitist carleton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ochizon View Post
    Wait - so the Powertap is sampling just every second or even more? I wonder if that is why im always so disappointed by my peak numbers?! haha

    Seriously though, this is good to know, cause i was using the peak number as a gauge for my sprint efforts (trying to repeat, never too consistent). Now i see that isnt the greatest idea (road bike work, btw - i dont have a power meter on my track bike)
    Yup. That would explain it. PowerTap would be accurate for even-paced efforts over, say, 20 seconds or higher. But, I wouldn't count on it for any efforts of 10 seconds or less.

    On the road bike, I'd do the same efforts, but I'd put more stock into data from Rolling/Flying efforts like rolling/flying 30 seconds and 1 minute efforts. You can measure progress that way.

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by carleton View Post
    Yup. That would explain it. PowerTap would be accurate for even-paced efforts over, say, 20 seconds or higher. But, I wouldn't count on it for any efforts of 10 seconds or less.

    On the road bike, I'd do the same efforts, but I'd put more stock into data from Rolling/Flying efforts like rolling/flying 30 seconds and 1 minute efforts. You can measure progress that way.
    thank man, this really helps me out.

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