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-   -   Can I Kilo? (http://www.bikeforums.net/track-cycling-velodrome-racing-training-area/713862-can-i-kilo.html)

2ndLaw 02-15-11 09:38 PM

Can I Kilo?
 
What sort of watts, or watts/kg, would be needed to go around a 1:09? I know that the track and bike and all that are important, so assume T-Town and a fairly aero bike. In looking at past results, going under a 1:09 at Masters Natz (30-34) is going to be competitive for the podium and possibly the win. My problem is that I think that I could concentrate on that event and improve considerably, but I'm not sure that it will be enough. My 5 sec. power is around 20 w/kg but my 60 sec power is around 8.6 w/kg. That is now (Feb.). Is it unreasonable to try to get to, say, 9.5 w/kg with a bunch of specific bike and weights work? I've always been a crit sprinter and have always concentrated on fitness needed to get to the sprint at the end of a crit. Will focused training get me on the podium? The only kilo I've ever done was around a 1:14 at about 2,000 feet altitude. That was with no specific training for it.

carleton 02-16-11 01:27 AM

Man. There is a lot in that post.

It seems that your W/kg numbers fair well in the "Sprinter" category in the spreadsheets made by Andy Coggan: http://home.trainingpeaks.com/articl...profiling.aspx

The 30-34 category is not a very competitive group on the masters scene being that most racers in that age group are still racing Elite. There are some 30-34 events at Masters that only have 4 competitors. 35-39 and 40-44 seem to be the fastest groups (based on 200M, 1K, and 4K times).

If you are serious and have the means, I say see about hiring a track sprint coach and get on an accelerated program. There are several coaches that coach remotely. You aren't starting from scratch.

Baby Puke 02-16-11 02:11 AM

You'll have to race it and see. You can't kilo with a sliderule.

agustinkim 04-12-11 07:26 PM

TRAIN TRAIN TRAIN TRAIN!!!!!! that's the only way to see

ochizon 05-07-13 06:51 AM

Digging up an old post, but...

Assuming, hypothetically, you only cared about the kilo, and trained exclusively for that. what sort of on-bike workouts would you focus on?

queerpunk 05-07-13 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ochizon (Post 15597646)
Digging up an old post, but...

Assuming, hypothetically, you only cared about the kilo, and trained exclusively for that. what sort of on-bike workouts would you focus on?

for starters, the obvious:
1 kilometer workouts. overdistance, undergeared efforts.
standing starts.

ochizon 05-07-13 09:10 AM

^^Thanks

well i do, for instance, 1min max effort workouts. 3 reps, easy spin between (5 min or so break - however long i need to go all out again). Some of my track buddies say that is too low a volume. But if i do anymore max efforts, my power drops, and i feel that is wearing myself out for no good reason. I just was wondering what you guys do :)

David Broon 05-07-13 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baby Puke (Post 12232825)
You'll have to race it and see. You can't kilo with a sliderule.


I definitely saw this and thought he was being sassy with Carletons Sig. Then I realized it was a zombie thread.

carleton 05-07-13 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by queerpunk (Post 15597964)
for starters, the obvious:
1 kilometer workouts. overdistance, undergeared efforts.
standing starts.

+1

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Broon (Post 15598588)
I definitely saw this and thought he was being sassy with Carletons Sig. Then I realized it was a zombie thread.

Ha!

Hida Yanra 05-08-13 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by David Broon (Post 15598588)
I definitely saw this and thought he was being sassy with Carletons Sig. Then I realized it was a zombie thread.

+2

JMR 05-09-13 11:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ochizon (Post 15597646)
Digging up an old post, but...

Assuming, hypothetically, you only cared about the kilo, and trained exclusively for that. what sort of on-bike workouts would you focus on?

Standing starts, flying kilos, standing starts, standing starts, 1 min. max efforts, standing starts, flying 500's, standing starts, and so forth. :)

I think the kilo is a lot about learning to hurt yourself, I hate it, but I love it... I hate everytime I do one, but I'm pretty good at it, so I keep doing it too myself.


JMR

Baby Puke 05-10-13 09:26 PM

Interesting we never heard from the OP again. Perhaps he couldn't kilo after all.

Baby Puke 05-10-13 09:28 PM

By the way, the old school work out for improving your last lap is: 4 flying 500's with three minutes rest between. Rest fully, repeat. Guaranteed to hurt you bad.

2ndLaw 05-13-13 06:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Baby Puke (Post 15613236)
Interesting we never heard from the OP again. Perhaps he couldn't kilo after all.

I'm fairly good at it, but that year didn't get the training done that I needed when I needed it. Various bouts of minor illness in the 2 months leading up to the event. I think I posted around 1:12-ish at T-Town for 4th at Masters Natz. I have since gone low 1:10 at Giordana Velodrome, but then training lost out to life and I probably would have a hard time finishing a kilo now. My former goal of sub-1:10 has not yet been reached. Hope to pick it back up in a few weeks and see how badly the atrophy has set in.

Baby Puke 05-13-13 06:00 PM

Don't know how old you are but 1:10 is pretty fast for a master, nice job. Getting under that is a toughy...

JMR 05-13-13 11:26 PM

I did a 1:09.477 at Australian Masters Track Nationals. :)

I want to get that down to 1:07's by next year.

JMR

carleton 05-14-13 02:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMR (Post 15622999)
I did a 1:09.477 at Australian Masters Track Nationals. :)

I want to get that down to 1:07's by next year.

JMR

Wow. I'm impressed! I wish I could ride a 1:10.

spazegun2213 05-14-13 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carleton (Post 15623148)
Wow. I'm impressed! I wish I could ride a 1:10.

What is your Kilo time? While I don't want to turn this into a d*ck measuring contest, I'm always really surprise when I hear of people's times. One of the guys that runs my friday night races, is a huge roadie, good track racer, and shocked me when he said his best is a 1:13.. that is a flying time as far as I'm concerned.

carleton 05-14-13 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spazegun2213 (Post 15624250)
What is your Kilo time? While I don't want to turn this into a d*ck measuring contest, I'm always really surprise when I hear of people's times. One of the guys that runs my friday night races, is a huge roadie, good track racer, and shocked me when he said his best is a 1:13.. that is a flying time as far as I'm concerned.

My best Kilo is 1:15 using drop bars.

My 500M splits put me on a pace to go around a 1:10, but the wheels fall off when I have around 250M to go...then it's like somebody straps a refrigerator to my back.

JMR 05-14-13 07:36 PM

Thanks!

They held the TT's on the last day of competition, so I didn't feel like I went as well as I should have... the last lap I faded pretty badly when normally I can hold it fairly well to the end.

Next year I am Masters 2 and I went a second quicker than any of the Masters 2 guys this year. If I get a good result (hopefully 1:07's) I am planning on going to worlds and see how I fair there! :)

JMR

carleton 05-15-13 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMR (Post 15626240)
Thanks!

They held the TT's on the last day of competition, so I didn't feel like I went as well as I should have... the last lap I faded pretty badly when normally I can hold it fairly well to the end.

Next year I am Masters 2 and I went a second quicker than any of the Masters 2 guys this year. If I get a good result (hopefully 1:07's) I am planning on going to worlds and see how I fair there! :)

JMR

Nice.

If you don't mind my asking...
- What kind of times are you getting for your standing 500M?
- Aerobars or drop bars for your 500M?

Baby Puke 05-15-13 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carleton (Post 15624607)

My 500M splits put me on a pace to go around a 1:10, but the wheels fall off when I have around 250M to go...then it's like somebody straps a refrigerator to my back.

-Ha, isn't that how it's supposed to feel??

TMonk 05-16-13 12:04 PM

can I Kilo?

Yes you can!

[video=youtube;gtATrfNQJLU]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gtATrfNQJLU[/video]

JMR 05-16-13 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carleton (Post 15628908)
Nice.

If you don't mind my asking...
- What kind of times are you getting for your standing 500M?
- Aerobars or drop bars for your 500M?

No problem... happy to share what info I have.

Unfortunately, I didn't get my splits from Nationals... I even emailed and tried to get them.

I use aeros.... http://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/sp/roa...rs/dedahbat180

Got these not too long ago and the dropped bullhorns seemed to really help my starts, I'm able to really get my back into the starts.

I'll see if I can dig up some splits from training and send them to you.

JMR

VanceMac 05-19-13 04:20 PM

I rode my first kilo today. Since I'm 50+, I may never have to ride one again. And right now, I'm not exactly crying about that.

My initial impression: it hurt in a way I didn't quite expect. In a 2k, I hurt just as much, but it's more of a balance between aerobic and anaerobic. Being shorter, the kilo is obviously more anaerobic, but it wasn't the kind of deep muscle burn that I expected, it was more this:
Quote:

Originally Posted by carleton (Post 15624607)
the wheels fall off when I have around 250M to go...then it's like somebody straps a refrigerator to my back.

The last lap felt like I was pedaling through quicksand. My quads, rather than being on fire, felt like they were in a permanently over-flexed state and thus could barely budge (it honestly felt like I was adding no power, the legs were only moving because the pedals were pushing them). The weird part is that I would have guessed the final lap was a full 3 seconds slower (I know 3 seconds for a lap is a HUGE difference... that's how slow it felt!!), but it was only 1 second slower than lap 3.


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