"Dear Carleton"
04-12-12, 11:19 PM
#2426
Fixie Infamous
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: SF
Posts: 10,474
Bikes: 2007 CAAD Optimo Track, 2012 Cannondale CAAD10, 1996 GT Force restomod, 2015 Cannondale CAADX
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 54 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
4 Posts
It's nice stuff, but over-priced. High quality, low value. Plus it sort of has a d-bag vibe to it, mainly because people know it's over-priced. Most racers that I know don't wear it. It's usually the rich guys who associate expensive with better.
I'd wear it if I got it for free or as a gift I guess.
Maybe consider Specialized, Castelli, or Hincapie with Specialized providing high quality with the best value, in my humble opinion.
I'd wear it if I got it for free or as a gift I guess.
Maybe consider Specialized, Castelli, or Hincapie with Specialized providing high quality with the best value, in my humble opinion.
thanks.
04-12-12, 11:26 PM
#2427
Brown Bear, Sqrl Hunter
It's nice stuff, but over-priced. High quality, low value. Plus it sort of has a d-bag vibe to it, mainly because people know it's over-priced. Most racers that I know don't wear it. It's usually the rich guys who associate expensive with better.
I'd wear it if I got it for free or as a gift I guess.
Maybe consider Specialized, Castelli, or Hincapie with Specialized providing high quality with the best value, in my humble opinion.
I'd wear it if I got it for free or as a gift I guess.
Maybe consider Specialized, Castelli, or Hincapie with Specialized providing high quality with the best value, in my humble opinion.
Sometimes Assos stuff can be had for a great price (my buddy has bought bibs for as low as $130) which puts it at about the same price range. That being said, I still don't know what bibs to buy, other than a "team kit"
04-12-12, 11:36 PM
#2428
Elitist
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 15,965
Mentioned: 88 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1386 Post(s)
Liked 92 Times
in
77 Posts
Whenever you are ordering team kit and have the option to upgrade the chamois...upgrade.
04-12-12, 11:44 PM
#2429
Brown Bear, Sqrl Hunter
As you get more experience, you guys will pick up on the idea that the chamois is the heart of the bib short. Next time you are in a bike shop, turn the bibs inside out and look at the chamois. Some are better than others. Some are absolute crap. I personally like smooth, non-porous, thin, and dense chamois.
Whenever you are ordering team kit and have the option to upgrade the chamois...upgrade.
Whenever you are ordering team kit and have the option to upgrade the chamois...upgrade.
04-13-12, 12:01 AM
#2430
Banana-tastic!
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 1,969
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Oh my goodness, my Hincapie chamois are by FAR my favorite shorts. Exactly like carleton described ("smooth, non-porous, thin, and dense"), except for "thin." I prefer slightly plushier chamois that is still smooth.
I also have Pearl Izumis that are not smooth (and noticeably lower quality) and high quality Descente shorts that are very nice, but with thinner chamois than my Hincapies.
Do note that brand is a not a sole indicator, as you also have to buy high enough up the various tiers of quality offered in order not to find utter crap.
I also have Pearl Izumis that are not smooth (and noticeably lower quality) and high quality Descente shorts that are very nice, but with thinner chamois than my Hincapies.
Do note that brand is a not a sole indicator, as you also have to buy high enough up the various tiers of quality offered in order not to find utter crap.
04-13-12, 09:39 AM
#2431
Brown Bear, Sqrl Hunter
Carleton,
How do you know what is a good number of "base miles"? How do you know when to bring that number up?
How do you know what is a good number of "base miles"? How do you know when to bring that number up?
04-13-12, 09:42 AM
#2432
Elitist
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 15,965
Mentioned: 88 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1386 Post(s)
Liked 92 Times
in
77 Posts
I can tell you that now is not the time for base miles. That happens in the winter to prepare for spring and summer racing.
04-13-12, 09:42 AM
#2433
Elitist
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 15,965
Mentioned: 88 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1386 Post(s)
Liked 92 Times
in
77 Posts
I can tell you that now is not the time for base miles. That happens in the winter to prepare for spring and summer racing.
04-13-12, 10:39 AM
#2434
Not actually Tmonk
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 14,135
Bikes: road, track, mtb
Mentioned: 140 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2639 Post(s)
Liked 3,153 Times
in
1,660 Posts
some ppls will tell you that your first couple years (few?) are really all about base miles.
what i mean by this is that you don't need to increase your workload or periodize your workouts to see fitness gains, you'll simply keep getting faster for a while.
Jaytron my guess is you've been at this for a few years now. Have fun this season and if you're interested in competing more seriously next year, ramp up the volume over the winter and then the intensity in the spring.
what i mean by this is that you don't need to increase your workload or periodize your workouts to see fitness gains, you'll simply keep getting faster for a while.
Jaytron my guess is you've been at this for a few years now. Have fun this season and if you're interested in competing more seriously next year, ramp up the volume over the winter and then the intensity in the spring.
__________________
"Your beauty is an aeroplane;
so high, my heart cannot bear the strain." -A.C. Jobim, Triste
"Your beauty is an aeroplane;
so high, my heart cannot bear the strain." -A.C. Jobim, Triste
04-13-12, 10:53 AM
#2435
Brown Bear, Sqrl Hunter
Spend some time here: https://cptips.com/
I can tell you that now is not the time for base miles. That happens in the winter to prepare for spring and summer racing.
I can tell you that now is not the time for base miles. That happens in the winter to prepare for spring and summer racing.
some ppls will tell you that your first couple years (few?) are really all about base miles.
what i mean by this is that you don't need to increase your workload or periodize your workouts to see fitness gains, you'll simply keep getting faster for a while.
Jaytron my guess is you've been at this for a few years now. Have fun this season and if you're interested in competing more seriously next year, ramp up the volume over the winter and then the intensity in the spring.
what i mean by this is that you don't need to increase your workload or periodize your workouts to see fitness gains, you'll simply keep getting faster for a while.
Jaytron my guess is you've been at this for a few years now. Have fun this season and if you're interested in competing more seriously next year, ramp up the volume over the winter and then the intensity in the spring.
Last edited by Jaytron; 04-13-12 at 11:02 AM.
04-13-12, 11:06 AM
#2436
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: St Louis
Posts: 1,846
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
What track are you racing on where you gotta climb?
Base miles are a strategy for being fit to race(a meaning there is more than one). The idea is that you are always able to ride a certain amout of work, then you can add you other skills(power, speed, etc.) ontop of that to be a better racer. If you are looking to be able to ride longer or better just for your own personal gain, base miles arent really a way to do that.
Base miles are a strategy for being fit to race(a meaning there is more than one). The idea is that you are always able to ride a certain amout of work, then you can add you other skills(power, speed, etc.) ontop of that to be a better racer. If you are looking to be able to ride longer or better just for your own personal gain, base miles arent really a way to do that.
04-13-12, 11:11 AM
#2437
Brown Bear, Sqrl Hunter
What track are you racing on where you gotta climb?
Base miles are a strategy for being fit to race(a meaning there is more than one). The idea is that you are always able to ride a certain amout of work, then you can add you other skills(power, speed, etc.) ontop of that to be a better racer. If you are looking to be able to ride longer or better just for your own personal gain, base miles arent really a way to do that.
Base miles are a strategy for being fit to race(a meaning there is more than one). The idea is that you are always able to ride a certain amout of work, then you can add you other skills(power, speed, etc.) ontop of that to be a better racer. If you are looking to be able to ride longer or better just for your own personal gain, base miles arent really a way to do that.
So would you say base miles are crucial to have just to have saddle time?
04-13-12, 11:19 AM
#2438
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: St Louis
Posts: 1,846
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Climbing works different muscles than flat(or track) riding. If your goal is to add strength, the "trackie" way to do it is to ride overgeared. Meaning if normally you do race around 85-90 gear inches, do some jumps and sprints in 95-100 gi. Cutting weight is the simple burn more calories than you take in formula. But there is also the annoying little factor of muscle being denser than fat. But since there is no climbing in track racing, if your goal is to drop weight for racing it does not matter much. Not to say there arent other reasons to drop weight.
I am not really a base mile guy to a huge extent. It seems too limiting, but I do understand it. The whole thing is about building your body to be used to working on a bike for long periods. Most people think its muscles staminia in your legs, and heart and lung build up. But it is also good for your hand and arm muscles, abs, feet, neck, etc. Base mile advocates say it has to be a very specific kind of saddle time. But most people I know, and the style I have adopted, are much less rigid about what counts.
I am not really a base mile guy to a huge extent. It seems too limiting, but I do understand it. The whole thing is about building your body to be used to working on a bike for long periods. Most people think its muscles staminia in your legs, and heart and lung build up. But it is also good for your hand and arm muscles, abs, feet, neck, etc. Base mile advocates say it has to be a very specific kind of saddle time. But most people I know, and the style I have adopted, are much less rigid about what counts.
04-13-12, 01:50 PM
#2439
Elitist
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 15,965
Mentioned: 88 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1386 Post(s)
Liked 92 Times
in
77 Posts
OK...let me get started...
What's wrong with periodization now? Nothing, in my opinion.
He may not know how to do it, but there is nothing wrong with a beginner being on such a program. To do this effectively, he'd need to set goals and have a coach to write a program for him.
No. If you aren't going to pay a coach, then you will have to learn to coach yourself. Go to the library, buy books, read websites on training for cycling. Unfortunately, just about all of them are specific to road racing. Track racing is somewhat different. But, there is a fair amount of overlap if you are going to be an endurance racer. If you are going to be a sprinter, then you will have to train like a track & field sprinter.
I am not going to write a program for you as you ask small question after small question
Climb? Are you looking to race on the road or the track?
+1
Base miles is essentially "training to train". It raises your base level of fitness. So, when the specific training comes, you can do more of it. So, let's say you can do 8 sets of a certain training exercise before becoming fatigued, if you base level of fitness were higher, you might be able to do 12 sets before fatigue sets in.
Climbing doesn't make you stronger.
Climbing doesn't necessarily cut weight. There are more efficient and effective ways.
Climbing doesn't make you faster. You are moving slowly when you climb. This does not translate to 140+ RPM.
So, why do it?
+1
some ppls will tell you that your first couple years (few?) are really all about base miles.
what i mean by this is that you don't need to increase your workload or periodize your workouts to see fitness gains, you'll simply keep getting faster for a while.
Jaytron my guess is you've been at this for a few years now. Have fun this season and if you're interested in competing more seriously next year, ramp up the volume over the winter and then the intensity in the spring.
what i mean by this is that you don't need to increase your workload or periodize your workouts to see fitness gains, you'll simply keep getting faster for a while.
Jaytron my guess is you've been at this for a few years now. Have fun this season and if you're interested in competing more seriously next year, ramp up the volume over the winter and then the intensity in the spring.
He may not know how to do it, but there is nothing wrong with a beginner being on such a program. To do this effectively, he'd need to set goals and have a coach to write a program for him.
I am not going to write a program for you as you ask small question after small question
What track are you racing on where you gotta climb?
Base miles are a strategy for being fit to race(a meaning there is more than one). The idea is that you are always able to ride a certain amout of work, then you can add you other skills(power, speed, etc.) ontop of that to be a better racer. If you are looking to be able to ride longer or better just for your own personal gain, base miles arent really a way to do that.
Base miles are a strategy for being fit to race(a meaning there is more than one). The idea is that you are always able to ride a certain amout of work, then you can add you other skills(power, speed, etc.) ontop of that to be a better racer. If you are looking to be able to ride longer or better just for your own personal gain, base miles arent really a way to do that.
Base miles is essentially "training to train". It raises your base level of fitness. So, when the specific training comes, you can do more of it. So, let's say you can do 8 sets of a certain training exercise before becoming fatigued, if you base level of fitness were higher, you might be able to do 12 sets before fatigue sets in.
Climbing doesn't necessarily cut weight. There are more efficient and effective ways.
Climbing doesn't make you faster. You are moving slowly when you climb. This does not translate to 140+ RPM.
So, why do it?
Climbing works different muscles than flat(or track) riding. If your goal is to add strength, the "trackie" way to do it is to ride overgeared. Meaning if normally you do race around 85-90 gear inches, do some jumps and sprints in 95-100 gi. Cutting weight is the simple burn more calories than you take in formula. But there is also the annoying little factor of muscle being denser than fat. But since there is no climbing in track racing, if your goal is to drop weight for racing it does not matter much. Not to say there arent other reasons to drop weight.
I am not really a base mile guy to a huge extent. It seems too limiting, but I do understand it. The whole thing is about building your body to be used to working on a bike for long periods. Most people think its muscles staminia in your legs, and heart and lung build up. But it is also good for your hand and arm muscles, abs, feet, neck, etc. Base mile advocates say it has to be a very specific kind of saddle time. But most people I know, and the style I have adopted, are much less rigid about what counts.
I am not really a base mile guy to a huge extent. It seems too limiting, but I do understand it. The whole thing is about building your body to be used to working on a bike for long periods. Most people think its muscles staminia in your legs, and heart and lung build up. But it is also good for your hand and arm muscles, abs, feet, neck, etc. Base mile advocates say it has to be a very specific kind of saddle time. But most people I know, and the style I have adopted, are much less rigid about what counts.
04-13-12, 02:10 PM
#2440
Brown Bear, Sqrl Hunter
It feels like climbing work has made me faster, but I think it's been just tying into the "base fitness" you guys were talking about. I guess I can cut that out. I do go on road rides with friends here and there, and being terrible at climbing isn't the best, I was hoping it went hand in hand with strength.
Hopefully I'll be able to do more open track days (they're typically cat 3+, but sometimes they'll let you on the track as long as you're not an idiot about it). Would it make sense to then run a higher gi on practice days then? On the chart you posted in the track forums regarding gi, you suggested a slightly lower gear in training/practice.
I know the club I joined has some coaching options, I think I'l have to look into that. Thanks for all the advice everyone.
Hopefully I'll be able to do more open track days (they're typically cat 3+, but sometimes they'll let you on the track as long as you're not an idiot about it). Would it make sense to then run a higher gi on practice days then? On the chart you posted in the track forums regarding gi, you suggested a slightly lower gear in training/practice.
I know the club I joined has some coaching options, I think I'l have to look into that. Thanks for all the advice everyone.
04-13-12, 02:26 PM
#2441
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: St Louis
Posts: 1,846
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Get quick at changing your gearing around. Doing a full work out in the same gear does not really help with anything other than the base fitness. Doing jumps over geared helps you build strength, doing jumps undergeared helps you spin. Doing lap long "sprints" helps you hold max speeds. Half lap 90%, then 100% helps you learn to push the extra bit you need. All of these things help fine tune your body and your mind, and all work best with different gearings.
You dont always need to be on the track, its just the easiest and the safest. Often times I train at a park that has a relivly flat oval road. But make sure you have a good brake on your bike. Skip stops dont work with 90 gear inches.
You dont always need to be on the track, its just the easiest and the safest. Often times I train at a park that has a relivly flat oval road. But make sure you have a good brake on your bike. Skip stops dont work with 90 gear inches.
04-13-12, 02:39 PM
#2442
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 13,447
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4236 Post(s)
Liked 2,949 Times
in
1,808 Posts
Really stupid question, but is there an issue with chain length if you change your gear inches too much in a workout? I mean I know that's what the horizontal dropouts are for, but I didn't know if some workout would exceed that leeway.
__________________
Bikes: 1996 Eddy Merckx Titanium EX, 1989/90 Colnago Super(issimo?) Piu(?),1990 Concorde Aquila(hit by car while riding), others in build queue "when I get the time"
Bikes: 1996 Eddy Merckx Titanium EX, 1989/90 Colnago Super(issimo?) Piu(?),
04-13-12, 02:53 PM
#2443
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: St Louis
Posts: 1,846
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Not Carleton of course.
"Changing either sprocket size by one tooth is the equivalent of moving the axle 1/8" Sheldon Brown.
So the answer is, it depends. Depends on where your wheel sits on the dropouts, how much you are changing, and how big your dropouts are.
Most track racers have some extra length of chain with a good masterlink on it for quick changes.
"Changing either sprocket size by one tooth is the equivalent of moving the axle 1/8" Sheldon Brown.
So the answer is, it depends. Depends on where your wheel sits on the dropouts, how much you are changing, and how big your dropouts are.
Most track racers have some extra length of chain with a good masterlink on it for quick changes.
04-13-12, 02:57 PM
#2444
Elitist
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 15,965
Mentioned: 88 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1386 Post(s)
Liked 92 Times
in
77 Posts
It feels like climbing work has made me faster, but I think it's been just tying into the "base fitness" you guys were talking about. I guess I can cut that out. I do go on road rides with friends here and there, and being terrible at climbing isn't the best, I was hoping it went hand in hand with strength.
Hopefully I'll be able to do more open track days (they're typically cat 3+, but sometimes they'll let you on the track as long as you're not an idiot about it). Would it make sense to then run a higher gi on practice days then? On the chart you posted in the track forums regarding gi, you suggested a slightly lower gear in training/practice.
I know the club I joined has some coaching options, I think I'l have to look into that. Thanks for all the advice everyone.
Hopefully I'll be able to do more open track days (they're typically cat 3+, but sometimes they'll let you on the track as long as you're not an idiot about it). Would it make sense to then run a higher gi on practice days then? On the chart you posted in the track forums regarding gi, you suggested a slightly lower gear in training/practice.
I know the club I joined has some coaching options, I think I'l have to look into that. Thanks for all the advice everyone.
The key is to make the most of your limited time.I suggest participating in any and everything that happens at the track. That way you can gain not only fitness, but bike skills and track racing experience in the process. If there's nothing going on at the track available to you, then ride your road bike or lift weights (assuming you want to be a sprinter).
04-13-12, 03:08 PM
#2445
Elitist
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 15,965
Mentioned: 88 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1386 Post(s)
Liked 92 Times
in
77 Posts
Not Carleton of course.
"Changing either sprocket size by one tooth is the equivalent of moving the axle 1/8" Sheldon Brown.
So the answer is, it depends. Depends on where your wheel sits on the dropouts, how much you are changing, and how big your dropouts are.
Most track racers have some extra length of chain with a good masterlink on it for quick changes.
"Changing either sprocket size by one tooth is the equivalent of moving the axle 1/8" Sheldon Brown.
So the answer is, it depends. Depends on where your wheel sits on the dropouts, how much you are changing, and how big your dropouts are.
Most track racers have some extra length of chain with a good masterlink on it for quick changes.
04-13-12, 03:09 PM
#2446
Not actually Tmonk
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: San Diego, CA
Posts: 14,135
Bikes: road, track, mtb
Mentioned: 140 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2639 Post(s)
Liked 3,153 Times
in
1,660 Posts
climbing won't inherently make you faster.
riding hard will make you faster. you can do that on any terrain that doesn't spin you out of gear(s), hills and flats included.
riding hard will make you faster. you can do that on any terrain that doesn't spin you out of gear(s), hills and flats included.
__________________
"Your beauty is an aeroplane;
so high, my heart cannot bear the strain." -A.C. Jobim, Triste
"Your beauty is an aeroplane;
so high, my heart cannot bear the strain." -A.C. Jobim, Triste
04-13-12, 03:10 PM
#2447
Brown Bear, Sqrl Hunter
As a beginner, in terms of training, doing anything regularly will make you faster. From the bottom, there's nowhere to go but up, right? The key is to make the most of your limited time.
I suggest participating in any and everything that happens at the track. That way you can gain not only fitness, but bike skills and track racing experience in the process. If there's nothing going on at the track available to you, then ride your road bike or lift weights (assuming you want to be a sprinter).
The key is to make the most of your limited time.I suggest participating in any and everything that happens at the track. That way you can gain not only fitness, but bike skills and track racing experience in the process. If there's nothing going on at the track available to you, then ride your road bike or lift weights (assuming you want to be a sprinter).
Will do. There are a ton of races once the season starts. I think Tuesday/Wed/Friday nights, with practice sessions Saturday/Sunday.
As a Sprinter I should concentrate on: dead lifts, squats, etc? Are there variations of this I can do at home, without weights? I've seen videos of trackies practicing their vertical leap?
When you say ride your road bike, is there anything you concentrate on in particular (since you said climbing doesn't really help me)? Or just ride?
04-13-12, 03:11 PM
#2448
Fixie Infamous
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: SF
Posts: 10,474
Bikes: 2007 CAAD Optimo Track, 2012 Cannondale CAAD10, 1996 GT Force restomod, 2015 Cannondale CAADX
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 54 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
4 Posts
Plyometrics. I hear it does wonders.
04-13-12, 03:12 PM
#2449
Elitist
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 15,965
Mentioned: 88 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1386 Post(s)
Liked 92 Times
in
77 Posts
Makes sense, haha I'm still out of shape, so I'm sure anything helps right now.
Will do. There are a ton of races once the season starts. I think Tuesday/Wed/Friday nights, with practice sessions Saturday/Sunday.
As a Sprinter I should concentrate on: dead lifts, squats, etc? Are there variations of this I can do at home, without weights? I've seen videos of trackies practicing their vertical leap?
When you say ride your road bike, is there anything you concentrate on in particular (since you said climbing doesn't really help me)? Or just ride?
Will do. There are a ton of races once the season starts. I think Tuesday/Wed/Friday nights, with practice sessions Saturday/Sunday.
As a Sprinter I should concentrate on: dead lifts, squats, etc? Are there variations of this I can do at home, without weights? I've seen videos of trackies practicing their vertical leap?
When you say ride your road bike, is there anything you concentrate on in particular (since you said climbing doesn't really help me)? Or just ride?