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  1. #1
    Senior Member chas58's Avatar
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    Don’t try this at home – Chris Hoy video

    Only someone like Sir Chris Hoy could get away with something like this.

    Kerin race, he is in 4th place going into turn 3, and can’t go over 3 riders on the turn. What is one to do?

    Drop down low – can’t pass under the guy in the sprinter’s lane, so he literally elbows his way between riders to make a hole and sprint to first place. Geeze. Won’t see me doing that move any time soon. Makes for a heck of a video though.

    Men's Keirin Melbourne 2012 UCI World Championship Track Cycling :
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=o_5Y-huPAcU
    Last edited by chas58; 04-12-12 at 01:35 PM.

  2. #2
    Still spinnin'..... Stealthammer's Avatar
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    Sweet! Thanks for posting it.
    Just your average 'high-functioning' lunatic, capable of passing as 'normal' for short periods of time.....

    “The difference between genius and stupidity is; genius has its limits.” - Albert Einstein

    “We all know that light travels faster than sound. That's why certain people appear bright until you hear them speak.” - Albert Einstein

  3. #3
    Senior Member chas58's Avatar
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    It is a heck of a ballsy move that very few people could get away with. He has a wall of 3 people abreast in front of him, Simon comes down to the red line to box him in, Hoy literally elbows him out of the way to create the hole in the wall that he needs, and just powers through it.

    To make it more impressive is that this change in strategy was executed in 4 seconds:
    4:36 he is thinking of going over the top of the riders
    4:38 he has decided to go under or through the 3 riders
    4:39 Simon blocks him in
    4:40 He has elbowed Simon out of the way and has clear view of the finish line (and the power to seize it)

  4. #4
    Senior Member Kayce's Avatar
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    Everything he did was perfectly legal, risky as hell, but toally legal. So he didnt really get away with anything. That implies a rule was broken. He is just super powerful, and can take a risk.
    If You Meet The Buddha On The Road, Kill Him

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    Given he elbowed his way through and forced the rider off his line, surpised it was seen as legal...
    http://climbinglama.blogspot.com.au

  6. #6
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    It look comparatively gentle to me. If you wanna see rough, watch some Japanese pro keirin. Headbutts, full-on hooks nearly to the rail, chops down on the the apron. Ugly stuff.

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    Gentle compared to the Japanese pro Keirin...

    But given the DQ's and relegations handed out in Melbourne for some very minor hooks and other racing incidents, I did expect Sir Chris to be also relegated...
    http://climbinglama.blogspot.com.au

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    Technically, I don't think he "impeded" Van Veltooven. He put out an elbow, and VV yielded his spot. He didn't have to do that (in my opinion).

  9. #9
    Senior Member chas58's Avatar
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    I’m not sure what above implies it was illegal. Often when running in tight packs, we will flair our elbows so any contact is a gentle eblow to elbow contact, and not the dangerous bike to bike contact. Usually this is good incentive to hold your line and prevent a dangerous crash. However in this case, Simon went from defending his position to opening up a large hole for Hoy to ride through.

    Heck, if Hoy tapped my elbow in a race, I would probably give him room to pass too. ;-)

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    Senior Member Kayce's Avatar
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    The application of rules on a kerien is much much much different then on a match sprint.
    If You Meet The Buddha On The Road, Kill Him

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    Senior Member melville's Avatar
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    Haven't we all done a little space negotiation with our elbows in a miss-n-out?

    Unable to play the vid to see how Hoy did it, but it doesn't sound unfamiliar to me from what I'm reading here.

  12. #12
    Senior Member chas58's Avatar
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    I don't see anything illegal about what happened. Simon came down on Hoy to defend his line, they touched elbows, and then Simon gave Hoy the big hole he needed.

    For Hoy, it is a very gutsy and aggressive move – attacking low when there are 3 riders abreast in front of you going into turn 3.

    It is an interesting strategic move, because you know that they are not going to be 3 abreast exiting turn 4, and that is what he was planning on. All he needed was a gap to power through. The downside of going low is getting boxed in. Hoy got boxed in on turn 4 and if Simon VV held his line (that he started to defend), Hoy had nowhere to go. But with a little elbow talk exiting turn 4, Hoy made the gap he needed, and took advantage of it.


    If you tried that in your local velodrome during a “friendly” race, you would probably get kicked off the track. However at national or international level things are a little different.

  13. #13
    Elitist carleton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by chas58 View Post
    I don't see anything illegal about what happened. Simon came down on Hoy to defend his line, they touched elbows, and then Simon gave Hoy the big hole he needed.

    For Hoy, it is a very gutsy and aggressive move – attacking low when there are 3 riders abreast in front of you going into turn 3.

    It is an interesting strategic move, because you know that they are not going to be 3 abreast exiting turn 4, and that is what he was planning on. All he needed was a gap to power through. The downside of going low is getting boxed in. Hoy got boxed in on turn 4 and if Simon VV held his line (that he started to defend), Hoy had nowhere to go. But with a little elbow talk exiting turn 4, Hoy made the gap he needed, and took advantage of it.


    If you tried that in your local velodrome during a “friendly” race, you would probably get kicked off the track. However at national or international level things are a little different.
    I think plan B (after Hoy realized that he didn't have enough time to go around Kenny) was to get in behind Levy and hope to get 3rd place in front of Kenny who was above and half a wheel behind Van Velthooven by this time. Then the touch with Van Velthooven happened which caused Van Velthooven to open the door for Hoy. Hoy then mashed the hardest 3 pedal strokes of his career. Not only did he pass Van Velthooven for 2nd, he was able to pass Levy for the win.

    Mind you all three of the other guys were in the wind the last half-lap or so while Hoy was sheltered. Actually, I think Hoy was sheltered the entire race (I can't look at the video right now at work). Riding at 45+ MPH with no shelter is exhausting, and that's what Levy, Van Velthooven, and Kenny did for various amounts of time. I believe that's one reason why Hoy had the gas at the end to punch out the last move. He was less fatigued than the rest.

  14. #14
    Senior Member Kayce's Avatar
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    That is what hoy has over a lot of riders, he has such a final punch that he ride sheltered longer than a lot of guys out there. His moves come so late compared to most.
    If You Meet The Buddha On The Road, Kill Him

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    Elitist carleton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kayce View Post
    That is what hoy has over a lot of riders, he has such a final punch that he ride sheltered longer than a lot of guys out there. His moves come so late compared to most.
    This is what happened in 2011 when he was unsheltered:

    He was unsheltered for over 10" seconds in the 2011 Keirin before the final sprint as Shane Perkins wouldn't let him drop in and get Crampton's wheel. Perkins (AUS) was sheltered the entire time and was fresh enough to come around Crampton to win. Hoy got 2nd.

    Skip to 4:30 here:



    But, in his defense, in years-past, his game was to win from the front:


  16. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by chas58 View Post
    It is an interesting strategic move, because you know that they are not going to be 3 abreast exiting turn 4, and that is what he was planning on. All he needed was a gap to power through. The downside of going low is getting boxed in. Hoy got boxed in on turn 4 and if Simon VV held his line (that he started to defend), Hoy had nowhere to go. But with a little elbow talk exiting turn 4, Hoy made the gap he needed, and took advantage of it.
    That little elbow tap sent Simon over the blue line... My understanding in the sprint is you are to hold your line.
    http://climbinglama.blogspot.com.au

  17. #17
    Senior Member Kayce's Avatar
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    The only person obliged to stay in line is the person that has taken the sprinter's lane after the 200 mark, on a sprint lap. The sprinter's lane is the one below the red line. Any one else can move wherever they want, for the most part. Simon did not have to move with the bump that Hoy gave him, but to an extent Hoy had every right to try and move uptrack.
    If You Meet The Buddha On The Road, Kill Him

  18. #18
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    I know about the sprinters lane rule, I am probably mixing up what we are always told racing on the track (to reduce accidents at club and Masters racing) and same when racing road...
    http://climbinglama.blogspot.com.au

  19. #19
    Senior Member chas58's Avatar
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    That is correct, sir.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kayce View Post
    The only person obliged to stay in line is the person that has taken the sprinter's lane after the 200 mark, on a sprint lap. The sprinter's lane is the one below the red line. Any one else can move wherever they want, for the most part. Simon did not have to move with the bump that Hoy gave him, but to an extent Hoy had every right to try and move uptrack.

  20. #20
    Senior Member chas58's Avatar
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    Yep, I think you are right. He saw going into turn 3 that the 3 in front of him were not going to stay side by side, since the upper riders had not started accelerating. So that wall was going to break up. Second or third would be a good bet for most people. First is impressive. Certainly being sheltered helps a lot too.

    Quote Originally Posted by carleton View Post
    I think plan B (after Hoy realized that he didn't have enough time to go around Kenny) was to get in behind Levy and hope to get 3rd place in front of Kenny who was above and half a wheel behind Van Velthooven by this time. Then the touch with Van Velthooven happened which caused Van Velthooven to open the door for Hoy. Hoy then mashed the hardest 3 pedal strokes of his career. Not only did he pass Van Velthooven for 2nd, he was able to pass Levy for the win.

    Mind you all three of the other guys were in the wind the last half-lap or so while Hoy was sheltered. Actually, I think Hoy was sheltered the entire race (I can't look at the video right now at work). Riding at 45+ MPH with no shelter is exhausting, and that's what Levy, Van Velthooven, and Kenny did for various amounts of time. I believe that's one reason why Hoy had the gas at the end to punch out the last move. He was less fatigued than the rest.

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