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Old 05-13-12, 06:12 PM   #1
Pantani98
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Giordana Summer Race Series

The Summer Weekly Series officially started last Thursday (C&D riders) and Friday (A&B). Events are a 500m TT, 2000km Individual Pursuit, and a Points Race. I've been waiting for this to be announced and start. Looks like I'll be waiting a bit longer, at least at the moment. Last Tuesday night my daughter and I were rear ended while sitting at a stop light. Most importantly, she's fine. I'm doing ok except for a fairly severe case of whiplash and having a still back and neck. So I've been off the bike since but am putting the bike on the trainer tomorrow to see how it goes and loosen things up. Really, I'm just wondering if anyone went and how it was. Thanks!
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Old 05-13-12, 06:59 PM   #2
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I didn't go, but I'll be there next Thursday. My bike I bought on eBay (2009 S-Works Langster, pretty cheap) should hopefully be here tomorrow. We'll see if I can get it in shape by Thursday (need to get the right cogs mainly, and fit it to me). I'll hopefully be there though.

Also, from what I've read, Friday (the A&B) has an Elimination Race as well.
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Old 05-13-12, 07:45 PM   #3
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Good deal on the bike and hopefully you can get out there. Let me know what you're looking for as far as cogs go and I'll be happy to help if I can. I'd like to make it out to race Thursday and spectate Friday. I'm just psyched the racing is under way!
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Old 05-13-12, 09:30 PM   #4
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I couldn't make it this week as I raced sprints and mass start stuff at DLV's "The Keirin". Maybe I can make it up in 2 weeks.

I find it a bit unusual to host time trial and mass start events twice a week, every week at the same event. Time trials take a long time to process and you are really subject to the number of people that sign up.

Has anyone heard how the first week's racing went? Are the results posted anywhere?
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Old 05-13-12, 10:07 PM   #5
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I find it a bit unusual to host time trial and mass start events twice a week, every week at the same event. Time trials take a long time to process and you are really subject to the number of people that sign up.
Especially the 2000km Individual Pursuits...

Personally would love to be able to race a pursuit and 500m TT each week, but agree it will make for a long nights racing!

@Pantani98 - hope the neck recovers quickly!
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Old 05-14-12, 06:33 AM   #6
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Especially the 2000km Individual Pursuits...

Personally would love to be able to race a pursuit and 500m TT each week, but agree it will make for a long nights racing!

@Pantani98 - hope the neck recovers quickly!
First, thanks for the well wishes. I don't expect any of this to linger much longer.

C'mon now! If you truly love track cycling you should be able to man up for the 2000km races. If you look at it in miles it's only 1242 and change. Ok, so I might've hit an extra zero, or three. And you know Carleton is hard core when the only reason he didn't race the 2000km was because he did "The Keirin". Dude is a beast!
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Old 05-21-12, 06:51 PM   #7
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Great. My bike came with a mixed 3/32" and 1/8" geartrain, 15/16 instead of 14/15 cogs, and a 50t instead of a 48t. Also, the 16t is crap (looks stamped) and unknown width, the 15t is 3/32", except I already bought a 15t 1/8" Dura Ace. The 50t is a nice Sugino, but unknown width. Chain is 1/8", but with a loose pin. I bought a 49t Sugino 1/8".

It's a mess. I'm working with the seller now. I plan on being there this week though. I'll just buy whatever I need to.
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Old 05-21-12, 11:29 PM   #8
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Yes, a stamped 16t is probably crap.

Buy a new chain. That way you know what you've got. Use the 49 till you can get a 48. 49x15 and 50x15 are nice race gears.

Also buy some steel chainring bolts, if it doesn't have any already. Alloy bolts will break over time.

...or just file a claim with ebay.
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Old 05-22-12, 08:05 PM   #9
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He refunded me $150. Nice guy. He's a Cat 1 on the road and track, out of PA, so I assume Trexler. If anyone knows who rode an S-Works with undecaled rims, that's him.

I used the money to buy a 48t Sugino, a 14t and 16t Dura Ace 1/8", and an 1/8" KMC 710SL in white.

I've now got 48,49,50 Sugino, 14,15,16 Dura Ace, two DA lockrings, and I haven't even ridden my bike yet. Is there a way to measure a chainring to see if it's 1/8"? I want to know what the 50t is.

I'll have to add the alloy chainring bolts to my list (after I go take a magnet out and see what they currently are).
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Old 05-22-12, 08:17 PM   #10
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Put the 50t on top of your road bike's chain. If the teeth enter the chain, it's 3/32". If they won't enter the chain and just sit on top, it's 1/8".
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Old 05-22-12, 08:17 PM   #11
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Excellent. Thanks, I'll try that.
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Old 05-23-12, 06:45 PM   #12
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This track bike has become a nightmare. So far the rear 16t is a POS stamped thing, the 14t is actually 15t and is 3/32", the 48t 1/8" 144bcd is actually 50t 3/32" 130bcd, the 167.5 144bcd crankset is actually 165 130bcd, and the 1/8" chain has a loose pin.

Guess I won't be racing tomorrow. He already refunded me $150, but now I don't know what to do. I now don't even have a crankset I can use, and if he refunds me enough to replace that crankset and chainring, he's gonna be giving me the bike for free basically.
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Old 05-26-12, 06:53 PM   #13
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I raced the A/B races last night at Rock Hill.

I had a blast! The track is awesome and so are the staff and racers. They provided the greatest hospitality.

The transitions of the track are SO NICE. Tracking a line on (and under) the measurement line at high speeds was so easy! There were even quite a few spectators in the stands. More than I've ever seen for local weekly racing at other tracks.

I can't wait to go back and race again.
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Old 06-12-12, 09:40 AM   #14
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There is a great cycling comunity here in rock hill! I beleave the new dome will be packed with riders and watchers as soon as people can get qualified to ride. And I will assume it was biult here because land is way cheaper south of the border! We also have a large mountain bike community as well and several nice walking trails thru out town. The velodrome has a site where there is info on riding and the race stats. Hope to see you there!
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Old 06-12-12, 08:20 PM   #15
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Raced D on Thursday last week, and I'll be there again this Thursday. It was awesome. I'm terribly slow, but it was fun. Need some intensity though.

200m was over 16 I think, first out in the Elimination, dropped early in the unknown distance. Points race I went for it from the gun, got about half a lap, and then blew up. Just went too hard.

I don't have the leg speed right now. When it ramps up my power is there, but I can't get it down because I don't have the leg speed yet. Spent 30 minutes on the rollers yesterday working on leg speed. Today was 1,1,2,5,2,1,1 pyramids on the road, working on anaerobic stuff for track. Fun.


Bike problems: I couldn't get either cog off. They were both incredibly tight. I broke my new Park tool whip, and another guys (I gave him $5 for his time to fix it). I fixed mine, drilled it out and put in a much bigger bolt. Got them off. Greased them before I put them back on. I'm wondering if it's a problem with the hub. When I do a standing start and it tightens down the cog, my hub starts making noise. I think it's compressing the hub somehow. Also, I'm using DA lockrings, on an Ellipse hub. I've read (since I bought them) that the Ellipse hub can only use Mavic lockrings? My DA seems to thread on and tighten just fine.

I know you ride Ellipse for training. Is this a common problem? Am I doing something wrong?
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Old 06-13-12, 07:22 AM   #16
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Raced D on Thursday last week, and I'll be there again this Thursday. It was awesome. I'm terribly slow, but it was fun. Need some intensity though.

200m was over 16 I think, first out in the Elimination, dropped early in the unknown distance. Points race I went for it from the gun, got about half a lap, and then blew up. Just went too hard.

I don't have the leg speed right now. When it ramps up my power is there, but I can't get it down because I don't have the leg speed yet. Spent 30 minutes on the rollers yesterday working on leg speed. Today was 1,1,2,5,2,1,1 pyramids on the road, working on anaerobic stuff for track. Fun.


Bike problems: I couldn't get either cog off. They were both incredibly tight. I broke my new Park tool whip, and another guys (I gave him $5 for his time to fix it). I fixed mine, drilled it out and put in a much bigger bolt. Got them off. Greased them before I put them back on. I'm wondering if it's a problem with the hub. When I do a standing start and it tightens down the cog, my hub starts making noise. I think it's compressing the hub somehow. Also, I'm using DA lockrings, on an Ellipse hub. I've read (since I bought them) that the Ellipse hub can only use Mavic lockrings? My DA seems to thread on and tighten just fine.

I know you ride Ellipse for training. Is this a common problem? Am I doing something wrong?
Unless they have changed the threading, the DA lockrings shouldn't fit on the Mavic hubs. Did you buy your Mavic Ellipse new? Maybe they changed the threading. Do you have the owner's manual/documentation?

You should put some grease on the threads before you install a cog so you can get it off later.

What gear ratio are you racing with?
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Old 06-13-12, 04:34 PM   #17
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Bought them used. No manual, and on Mavic's site it's terrible, no manual I can find there either. The D/A seems to fit anyway, maybe I'll try the one that came with it. I think I'm only going to run cogs on one side, so I don't bind the hub. Have you had any trouble with the hub not spinning freely when the cogs are tight?

I ran a 48/15 for the Flying 200, elimination, and unknown distance, and then a 49/15 for the Points. They're fine gear ratios I think, I'm just not comfortable at high rpm (over 120) yet and don't make much power there. I'll just keep working on it.
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Old 06-13-12, 06:11 PM   #18
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You need the proper lock ring.

You also need the Mavic bearing adjustment tool. Any good shop will have tons of them in a spare parts drawer. Adjust the bearings.

48/15 is probably too small to be competitive.

Learn to spin. Bike fit is key to being free to spin.
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Old 06-13-12, 07:00 PM   #19
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Well, I just tried the lockring that came with the bike (doesn't say anything on it), and it doesn't spin on very well. My DA spins on better, but not great. Neither of them actually butts up against the cog. I suppose that putting the DA on is better than nothing, if I happen to back it off (unlikely) it'll only go so far and I can still stop.
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Old 06-13-12, 07:23 PM   #20
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Yeah, neither one will snug up to the cog. Even on the Mavic Comete disc.
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Old 06-15-12, 10:41 AM   #21
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Last night was second week. Class D again (like 4/5 basically). I did considerably better. Last week I was 9th out of 9 in basically everything, with a flying 200m time of 15.76 seconds.

Last night I got fired (3rd, see Glengarry Glen Ross for reference) a few times. Flying 200m was 15.14 seconds, miss and out was 3rd, 12 lap scratch was 3rd, points was 4th. My legs still aren't there, but I managed to be smart and hide well. Scratch race I rode a guy off a wheel, which I'm not sure I'd ever really done before. I was down on the black line, the train was above me on the stayers, I didn't want to be pulling down low, so I just eased up the track and moved him over. I wasn't strong enough to pull for very long, so I mostly just sat 2nd or 3rd wheel and let other people work. When the sprint would come I didn't have enough to do anything but maintain my line at the bottom and force people over top, which they couldn't do. Track racing is definitely helping my bike handling and comfort near people though. I was only an inch or two from a guy's rear tire as I swung up over him at one point. Also helps knowing that nobody else has brakes either. Gearing made a big difference. I went to a 48/14 from 48/15, huge help. I'd still like something bigger for the flying 200m though, so I might buy a big chainring.

Kinda sad that I still haven't broken 30mph for my flying 200, at least not average speed. Takes time to get the legs back though. I'm only doing my 1min intervals at like 320, with a max of 380 or something, not exactly track racing power.
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Old 06-15-12, 01:29 PM   #22
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Good job on the improvements.

Did you get your hub adjusted? If not, that's like racing with your brakes rubbing the wheel.
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Old 06-15-12, 07:37 PM   #23
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Bought them used. No manual, and on Mavic's site it's terrible, no manual I can find there either. The D/A seems to fit anyway, maybe I'll try the one that came with it.
Mavic lockrings are most definitely not the same as DA lockrings. There are three lockring standards that are all incompatible-- English/Japanese, Italian (campy), and French (Mavic). Sheldon Brown gives the threading details here: sheldonbrown.com. There are also old BB lockrings that are a righthand 1.37x24" thread.

If you're going to use a lockring, use the right one for your hub-- using the wrong one will chew up the threads. I keep one of each flavor in my track bag (because I have a variety of wheels), but they're all still fresh in the plastic baggies they came in, never having touched a wheel. I keep them on the off chance I'll race someplace where they demand them. In ~20 years I've seen one cog come off backward (at the rollout off the rail when a guy had done a wheel change too fast) and two or three come off forward on standing starts when people tore the threads off their hubs. The old specialized tri-spokes can't even accept a lockring in a meaningful way-- they just have a 1.37x24" thread that you screw an adapter onto to get the right width, then you screw the cog onto that. You could make an adapter that takes a lockring, but then the adapter would still be able to unscrew if it could. When I was racing tri-spokes I had an adapter that didn't have flats and I carried a pipe wrench to keep it from unthreading when I was taking cogs off.

On the track, if you're backpedaling hard enough to unscrew a cog you already have much bigger problems and what happens to the cog is irrelevant. Riding on the street where there's a lot of stop and go and typically smaller gears (and more torque transmitted to the cog) you need a lockring.
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Old 06-15-12, 09:24 PM   #24
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Mavic lockrings are most definitely not the same as DA lockrings. There are three lockring standards that are all incompatible-- English/Japanese, Italian (campy), and French (Mavic).
+1

As luck would have it, I spun off a cog on Tuesday during our monthly sprint night. During the first 1/2 lap of the match where I was following, my opponent suddenly initiated a track stand to send me in front of him and I snapped the cranks backwards spinning the cog off. Nothing that would cause a mishap. I just said, "Oops!" and threw my hand up and floated off the track for a restart.

That was my first time in 4 years, but I usually use lockrings, though.
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Old 06-16-12, 02:01 AM   #25
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As luck would have it, I spun off a cog on Tuesday during our monthly sprint night.
That's two that I know of now...

I wouldn't be surprised if you could spin one off forward on a standing start, too, though...
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