Track Racing Frames and Complete Bikes
#176
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I second the idea of Ti dropout plates. I would like them done in the BT style tho, where it's a large metal plate bolted to the frame. I hate those little dropout inserts. The plates are easy enough to get sourced from a local machinist if need be and can be made in aluminum as well. I had a set of Ti plates made up for my BT by a guy. Took him all of 20 minutes to put each one on a flatbed scanner and have them cut on a waterjet. Ti is great not because it's soft as Carlton stated above. It's actually quite hard. It's positive attributes are that it's hard, elastic, and tough. This causes it to wear well, yet deform so that track nuts can bite, but the metal won't break loose because it is tough, keeping the nuts from slipping. I never got around to using them because I had yet to wear out the aluminum plate dropouts.
Does the BT come with a true 60cm TT?
(I'm going to sell all of my belongings and consider buying one)
#177
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I could probably get over the short dropouts and recommend it to people if it was a great value, but at over 2 grand? The only thing nicer than the tk2/omnium spec is the wheels, and those aren't worth that much more to me.
#178
Lapped 3x
[QUOTE=carleton;17433909
Does the BT come with a true 60cm TT?
(I'm going to sell all of my belongings and consider buying one)[/QUOTE]
I know for a fact that they come in a 59cm TT. I used to have a 57.5 TT and the 59 was the next size up. I believe the sizing is 52, 53.5, 55, 57.5, 59, 61? (never heard of one that big).
Does the BT come with a true 60cm TT?
(I'm going to sell all of my belongings and consider buying one)[/QUOTE]
I know for a fact that they come in a 59cm TT. I used to have a 57.5 TT and the 59 was the next size up. I believe the sizing is 52, 53.5, 55, 57.5, 59, 61? (never heard of one that big).
#180
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I'd be curious to ride one and see how it goes, they have a very slack seat tube angle in my size, which stretches the reach out quite a bit. It's still not the carbon track frame I'd like to see from Cannonade, but good on them for getting back in the game.
#181
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That new Cannondale track bike seems like they did no market research before coming out with it. There are half a dozen similar bikes for much cheaper (giant, argon, fuji) that are just as good/better. Cannondale doesn't have a sexy italian name to match the added price, so not sure who their demographic for that bike is.
FWIW my shop was looking at around $2300cnd retail, compared to around $1300 on the giant. Where does the extra $1000 go?
FWIW my shop was looking at around $2300cnd retail, compared to around $1300 on the giant. Where does the extra $1000 go?
#182
Lapped 3x
There's this cyclone (I know, short head tube) for sale
- BT 59cm Carbon Track Bike With BT Aero Bars NON Road Bike | eBay
#183
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There's this cyclone (I know, short head tube) for sale
- BT 59cm Carbon Track Bike With BT Aero Bars NON Road Bike | eBay
- BT 59cm Carbon Track Bike With BT Aero Bars NON Road Bike | eBay
#185
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#186
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My current "competition bike" is an Argon18 Electron Pro.
My dream bike (with the tall HT option):
#187
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That Cipollini Speed is all sorts of ugly! Even the geo is all wrong.
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Re: ti track ends and dropouts. I have a custom ti road fix gear. I had it made with a very long road style dropout that opens at the front but down instead of forward so 1) wheel changes/flips really easy. No need to handle the chain at all. 2) with this setup I can tighten the track nut at any location inside the dropout and 3) I can locate the tire right behind the seattube without having to deflate the tire to pull the wheel. The dropouts were cut from 1/4" plate, just as a track end would be.
I had my doubts as to whether road style drops with a metal as "slippery" as ti would work without slipping. After three years, a lot of miles and countless wheel removals and flips, I no longer have doubts. Ti works as well as plain steel and better than chromed steel. And, the ti dropouts have held up really well. They look like they are set to go many more years.
Ben
I had my doubts as to whether road style drops with a metal as "slippery" as ti would work without slipping. After three years, a lot of miles and countless wheel removals and flips, I no longer have doubts. Ti works as well as plain steel and better than chromed steel. And, the ti dropouts have held up really well. They look like they are set to go many more years.
Ben
#189
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So what's wrong with the geometry? It has typical 73-75 size dependent angles and it has two head tube length options and two bottom bracket drop options.
Cipollini Speed Geometry (scroll down)
#190
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The Cipollini is absurdly expensive. I think it's like $6,000 USD. You can get bespoke (custom) carbon for those prices.
Those prices are totally unjustified...along with the bad paint jobs
There's a reason why we've never actually seen one in the wild
Those prices are totally unjustified...along with the bad paint jobs
There's a reason why we've never actually seen one in the wild
Last edited by carleton; 01-03-15 at 09:48 AM.
#191
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#192
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You might see one visiting DLV next year.
#194
Full Member
Anyway, if all goes according to plan, I'll be down to DLV & Giordonna the second half of April this year. If that works out, I might make it an annual spring trip. I probably won't have anything like the Cipollini this spring, but next spring might be a different story.
#195
Lapped 3x
I always admired Super Mario's boldness, so I think this paint job is worthy of a bike carrying his name. The naked carbon and white painted versions look like any other carbon bike.
So what's wrong with the geometry? It has typical 73-75 size dependent angles and it has two head tube length options and two bottom bracket drop options.
Cipollini Speed Geometry (scroll down)
So what's wrong with the geometry? It has typical 73-75 size dependent angles and it has two head tube length options and two bottom bracket drop options.
Cipollini Speed Geometry (scroll down)
#196
Full Member
There's a difference between bold and ugly. To each their own tho. I was looking at a geo chart on a different site, so I only saw the one with the Lower BB drop. I would like less offset on the fork tho. Also their XS frame has a steeper head tube than their S, then gets steeper again. Curious as to what's up with that. Usually frames get steeper as they get larger because you don't have to kick the wheel out to make room for the downtube.
Also, what is a good fork rake for an omnium bike on concrete tracks nowadays? I'm looking at picking up a Look 464 this spring which as 43mm rake and a 73.5 degree HT angle.
#197
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Thanks, but I think T-Town is pretty friendly track. I shared my tent/stall with maybe 30 different people over the course of summer and more than half were people being new acquantances. Some would bring their own chairs to squeeze in, but we always made room. I had to buy a bigger canopy half-way through the season to make room. Of course, my teammates were regulars. So, if you come back up to T-Town, look me up, I'll save a spot for you.
Anyway, if all goes according to plan, I'll be down to DLV & Giordonna the second half of April this year. If that works out, I might make it an annual spring trip. I probably won't have anything like the Cipollini this spring, but next spring might be a different story.
Anyway, if all goes according to plan, I'll be down to DLV & Giordonna the second half of April this year. If that works out, I might make it an annual spring trip. I probably won't have anything like the Cipollini this spring, but next spring might be a different story.
Sounds like a great plan. I believe that Giordana starts their weekly racing early in the season as well. The climate is moderate there. Bobby Lea trained on Giordana's track through the winter leading up to the Olympics.
#198
Senior Member
Re: ti track ends and dropouts. I have a custom ti road fix gear. I had it made with a very long road style dropout that opens at the front but down instead of forward so 1) wheel changes/flips really easy. No need to handle the chain at all. 2) with this setup I can tighten the track nut at any location inside the dropout and 3) I can locate the tire right behind the seattube without having to deflate the tire to pull the wheel. The dropouts were cut from 1/4" plate, just as a track end would be.
I had my doubts as to whether road style drops with a metal as "slippery" as ti would work without slipping. After three years, a lot of miles and countless wheel removals and flips, I no longer have doubts. Ti works as well as plain steel and better than chromed steel. And, the ti dropouts have held up really well. They look like they are set to go many more years.
Ben
I had my doubts as to whether road style drops with a metal as "slippery" as ti would work without slipping. After three years, a lot of miles and countless wheel removals and flips, I no longer have doubts. Ti works as well as plain steel and better than chromed steel. And, the ti dropouts have held up really well. They look like they are set to go many more years.
Ben
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I raced an All-City on the weekends this past year at T-town. It's a pretty solid bike that can handle large riders (I was 255lbs). I had absolutely no issues with the bike in 40+ races. My Thunderdome is 58cm, but I'm going smaller - to maybe a 55cm frame and maybe alloy rim tubular wheels. Another Thunderdome or the Look 464 are likely primary contenders to replace it as my "work-horse" bike.
My current "competition bike" is an Argon18 Electron Pro.
My dream bike (with the tall HT option):
My current "competition bike" is an Argon18 Electron Pro.
My dream bike (with the tall HT option):
#200
Lapped 3x
I suspect the XS HT angle is a typo, since the pursuit frame has the same (and expected) angles except for XS omnium frame HT. So, I think the correct number is 73 degrees.
Also, what is a good fork rake for an omnium bike on concrete tracks nowadays? I'm looking at picking up a Look 464 this spring which as 43mm rake and a 73.5 degree HT angle.
Also, what is a good fork rake for an omnium bike on concrete tracks nowadays? I'm looking at picking up a Look 464 this spring which as 43mm rake and a 73.5 degree HT angle.