Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Track Cycling: Velodrome Racing and Training Area Looking to enter into the realm of track racing? Want to share your experiences and tactics for riding on a velodrome? The Track Cycling forums is for you! Come in and discuss training/racing, equipment, and current track cycling events.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 04-26-13, 11:06 PM   #1
Brian Ratliff
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Brian Ratliff's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Near Portland, OR
Bikes: Three road bikes. Two track bikes.
Posts: 10,060
Gear Chart

You know how most gear charts are kind of confusing and hard to read, especially if your brain is fried from too much sprinting...

Check this out:


(PS: I was really bored at work today...)
Attached Images
File Type: png Gear Chart.png (93.3 KB, 454 views)
__________________
Cat 2 Track, Cat 3 Road.
"If you’re new enough [to racing] that you would ask such question, then i would hazard a guess that if you just made up a workout that sounded hard to do, and did it, you’d probably get faster." --the tiniest sprinter
Brian Ratliff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-27-13, 12:05 AM   #2
carleton
Elitist
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 13,012
Nice and Simple!

Stickied!
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by gtrob View Post
Roadies can run tempo all year as that's what humans were designed for. If you want to be a cheetah, lay around and lick your paws more.
carleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-13, 03:41 PM   #3
David Broon 
Sqrl
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Bikes:
Posts: 553
That's awesome!
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Doing one-legged squats while holding chickens in each hand will make someone strong...that doesn't mean it's the best way to train for track racing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nagrom_ View Post
That would be spectacular. A trail of blood and sealant.
David Broon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-13, 03:52 PM   #4
carleton
Elitist
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 13,012
Brian,

One small request: Is there any way that you can add 45/13 and 52/15 to the chart? Those are sort of common ratios by advanced racers. They make almost the exact same gear ratio, but the feel different. The 45/13 is used by sprinters and 52/15 by enduros. 45/13 feels "snappy" and 52/15 is good for cruising at speed. I can't really explain why, but they do feel different.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by gtrob View Post
Roadies can run tempo all year as that's what humans were designed for. If you want to be a cheetah, lay around and lick your paws more.
carleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-13, 04:25 PM   #5
Brian Ratliff
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Brian Ratliff's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Near Portland, OR
Bikes: Three road bikes. Two track bikes.
Posts: 10,060
Quote:
Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Brian,

One small request: Is there any way that you can add 45/13 and 52/15 to the chart? Those are sort of common ratios by advanced racers. They make almost the exact same gear ratio, but the feel different. The 45/13 is used by sprinters and 52/15 by enduros. 45/13 feels "snappy" and 52/15 is good for cruising at speed. I can't really explain why, but they do feel different.
Yea, no problem. The gear range was originally related to what I had in my gear bag.


You can see the "one chainring tooth equals two inches" rule of thumb (this is what I used for the "nominal gearing") breaks down a bit across the full range... I hadn't thought of a 45/13 before; right between a 49/14 and a 48/14 which are common gears for me. Might have to experiment with that a bit.
Attached Images
File Type: png Gear Chart_extd.png (95.9 KB, 148 views)
__________________
Cat 2 Track, Cat 3 Road.
"If you’re new enough [to racing] that you would ask such question, then i would hazard a guess that if you just made up a workout that sounded hard to do, and did it, you’d probably get faster." --the tiniest sprinter

Last edited by Brian Ratliff; 04-28-13 at 04:29 PM.
Brian Ratliff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-28-13, 09:26 PM   #6
carleton
Elitist
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 13,012
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Ratliff View Post
Yea, no problem. The gear range was originally related to what I had in my gear bag.


You can see the "one chainring tooth equals two inches" rule of thumb (this is what I used for the "nominal gearing") breaks down a bit across the full range... I hadn't thought of a 45/13 before; right between a 49/14 and a 48/14 which are common gears for me. Might have to experiment with that a bit.
Thanks!

It was random (and cool) meeting you today at the track! I'll see you Thursday or Friday for racing.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by gtrob View Post
Roadies can run tempo all year as that's what humans were designed for. If you want to be a cheetah, lay around and lick your paws more.
carleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-13, 04:20 PM   #7
carleton
Elitist
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 13,012
Unsticking this and adding a link to if from the Tips thread.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by gtrob View Post
Roadies can run tempo all year as that's what humans were designed for. If you want to be a cheetah, lay around and lick your paws more.
carleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-15, 01:20 PM   #8
myth001
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Milton Velodrome/Escarpment
Bikes:
Posts: 124
Sorry to bring out another relic thread, but am new to track , and am trying to figure out some basics here.

According to your chart, and (Track Racing) the gearing in inches come out to the following:

46 x 15 = 82.8
48 x 14 = 92.6
49 x 14 = 94.5
50 x 15 = 90.0
50 x 14 = 96.4

But according to some other sites such as (BikeCalc.com - Bicycle Gear Inches Chart)
the numbers differ quite a bit:

46 x 15 = 80.7
48 x 14 = 90.2
49 x 14 = 92.1
50 x 15 = 87.6
50 x 14 = 93.9

Is this due to various tire sizes kept in mind, or something else? I tried a few tire sizes, but that didn't make for the difference.

I just got a new bike with a 46 x 15, and am spinning it out on the track. I just ordered a 48 and 49 chainring, along with 14, 15, 16 cogs. Looking at gear charts, perhaps a 50 will also be a good one to keep and that can give me a wider range of gears to start with.

PS: not looking at TT or Pursuits, possible scratch and point races for now.
myth001 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-15, 02:03 PM   #9
queerpunk
aka mattio
 
queerpunk's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Bikes:
Posts: 5,940
It all depends on the constant you use. The formula for gear inches is: (Chainring/cog)*wheel diameter.

A 700c wheel with a 23mm tire has a wheel diameter of something like 26.3 inches. However, on the track, most people use the nominal 27" constant. Why? Who cares. a 50/15 is a 90" gear.
queerpunk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-15, 02:28 PM   #10
carleton
Elitist
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 13,012
queerpunk is right.


myth, basically you hit on a minor inconsistency in the track cycling world: Actual vs Nominal Gear Inches

"Nominal" means: Existing in name only.

Actual: The actual distance that your wheel travels per complete pedal revolution based on your actual tire circumference (which obviously will vary).
Nominal: The distance that our wheel travels based on a commonly adopted "close enough" standard wheel diameter. 27 inch diameter for Imperial and 2.1 meter circumference for metric.

So, some general (and more technical) bike calculators will ask for your tire size and calculate your actual gear inches. Usually track-specific calculators will use a 27" track standard as the factor when calculating.

So, when trackies are talking to each other they use 27" in their calculations to figure out relative gearing. "I was on a 90-inch gear. I made it using 50t/15t x 27 inches" They don't take the time to figure in the actual diameter of their tires because they will vary between 19-23c tires.

So, stick with the track standard chaining/cog X 27 to calculate your gear inches and when you are discussing gear inches with your fellow trackies.
carleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-15, 02:29 PM   #11
carleton
Elitist
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 13,012
myth, I created an app in the Apple app store that might help you. It's free: https://itunes.apple.com/us/app/trac...925659197?mt=8

carleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-15, 05:05 PM   #12
myth001
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Milton Velodrome/Escarpment
Bikes:
Posts: 124
Thanks guys for nice explanations.
And Carlton, yes I did get that app already, I just got lazy to manually calculate and saw the charts as a direct simpler comparison tool. Guess I'll be back to your app for these gear calculations from now on.
myth001 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-15, 05:18 PM   #13
dunderhi
Senior Member
 
dunderhi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Lost in the Mid-Atlantic Track Triangle
Bikes: No 22 Little Wing, Pinarello XTRACK, Argon18 Electron Pro, Schwinn Paramount
Posts: 327
Quote:
Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by queerpunk View Post
It all depends on the constant you use. The formula for gear inches is: (Chainring/cog)*wheel diameter.

A 700c wheel with a 23mm tire has a wheel diameter of something like 26.3 inches. However, on the track, most people use the nominal 27" constant. Why? Who cares. a 50/15 is a 90" gear.
queerpunk is right.


myth, basically you hit on a minor inconsistency in the track cycling world: Actual vs Nominal Gear Inches

"Nominal" means: Existing in name only.

Actual: The actual distance that your wheel travels per complete pedal revolution based on your actual tire circumference (which obviously will vary).
Nominal: The distance that our wheel travels based on a commonly adopted "close enough" standard wheel diameter. 27 inch diameter for Imperial and 2.1 meter circumference for metric.

So, some general (and more technical) bike calculators will ask for your tire size and calculate your actual gear inches. Usually track-specific calculators will use a 27" track standard as the factor when calculating.

So, when trackies are talking to each other they use 27" in their calculations to figure out relative gearing. "I was on a 90-inch gear. I made it using 50t/15t x 27 inches" They don't take the time to figure in the actual diameter of their tires because they will vary between 19-23c tires.

So, stick with the track standard chaining/cog X 27 to calculate your gear inches and when you are discussing gear inches with your fellow trackies.
How is that this is the first I've ever heard of trackies using a generic nominal gear terminology? Here, I thought I was a trackie, but I also thought that if I switched to 19c tires for a pursuit that I would need to a add a tooth to chainwheel to maintain my gearing.

When asked about my gearing, I've always stated 47x14 or 48x14. If they asked about the number of inches, I would just refer to my track bag. I guess it's good to learn something new everyday. Unfortunately for the "trackies", I don't plan to change the way I talk about gearing. As an engineer, I just can just round pi to 3 and feel good about it.



P.S. If I switch out my tires, I just insert a new table.


P.P.S Based on iPhone App example above is 51x14 a nominal 98.4 or rounded to 98?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Track_bag.jpg (102.9 KB, 14 views)

Last edited by dunderhi; 02-03-15 at 05:26 PM. Reason: Post Post script
dunderhi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-15, 05:41 PM   #14
carleton
Elitist
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 13,012
When we (Americans) ask about gear inches, what we really want to know is a relative measure of chainring/cog ratio instead of chainring/cog * 27". Because all of the tires are more similar than different.

I think if we started using ratio of chainring/cog like the Japanese do when they speak of gearing, we'd be better off.

Basically:

46/14 would be "3.3"
50/15 would be "3.3"
51/15 would be "3.4"
47/14 would be "3.5"
45/13 would be "3.5"
52/15 would be "3.5"

That's why I included ratios in my app.

Next I'm gonna try to get the USA on the Metric system...
carleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-15, 05:58 PM   #15
Dan Burkhart 
Senior member
 
Dan Burkhart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Oakville Ontario
Bikes:
Posts: 5,891
Here is my go to gear inch calculator.
HTML5 Gear Calculator
It lets you chose between single speed, cassette or popular IGHs. In KPH, it will show meters development, for gear inches, switch to mph.
It also allows you to chose your tire size for greater accuracy.
Dan Burkhart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-15, 07:17 PM   #16
dunderhi
Senior Member
 
dunderhi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Lost in the Mid-Atlantic Track Triangle
Bikes: No 22 Little Wing, Pinarello XTRACK, Argon18 Electron Pro, Schwinn Paramount
Posts: 327
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Burkhart View Post
Here is my go to gear inch calculator.
HTML5 Gear Calculator
It lets you chose between single speed, cassette or popular IGHs. In KPH, it will show meters development, for gear inches, switch to mph.
It also allows you to chose your tire size for greater accuracy.
That's pretty nice. After playing with it a bit, I see I can enter the rollout distance rather than use the tire size drop down, which would help account for my 23mm road tubulars having a different diameter than my 23mm track tubulars.
dunderhi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-15, 08:34 PM   #17
Dan Burkhart 
Senior member
 
Dan Burkhart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Oakville Ontario
Bikes:
Posts: 5,891
Quote:
Originally Posted by dunderhi View Post
That's pretty nice. After playing with it a bit, I see I can enter the rollout distance rather than use the tire size drop down, which would help account for my 23mm road tubulars having a different diameter than my 23mm track tubulars.
Yes, I should have been clearer about that, but it does give you that option.
Dan Burkhart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-03-15, 08:35 PM   #18
carleton
Elitist
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 13,012
You can do all of that with my other app.
carleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:14 AM.