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Track Cycling: Velodrome Racing and Training Area Looking to enter into the realm of track racing? Want to share your experiences and tactics for riding on a velodrome? The Track Cycling forums is for you! Come in and discuss training/racing, equipment, and current track cycling events.

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Old 09-22-13, 09:25 PM   #1
sbs z31
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Recommend me a wheelset!

Hi, I'm in the process of building up a track bike. I am planning to use the bike for road ITT and try out track racing next year. I wanted to try track racing this year but it's already too late for that so I'll have to wait. I did two road ITT events this year and just fell in love and I know if I give track racing a try I will love it. I've been researching for the last two weeks on wheelset and can't decide which wheelset to settle on. So far these are what I'm thinking:
Carbonzone(Chinese) 50/88 carbon track wheelset
Velocity Deep V's laced to Formula Hubs
H+Son SL42 24f/24r laced to Formula Hubs
FLO 30(if they offer a track version)
Miche Pistard WR wheelset(not sure if brakes can be use)
Mavic Ellipse(are these compatible with brakes?)

The wheelset has to be compatible with at least a front brake to be legal for the local road ITT events so I'm not sure if either the Miche or Mavic will work. My budget is $500 but if the recommended wheelset is worth going over my limit then I don't mind saving up. I should also add that my current commuter(what I use for the ITT events this year) already have Velocity Deep V's so please excuse my noobness and any help/suggestion would be much appreciated.
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Old 09-23-13, 10:16 AM   #2
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Just use your deep v's if you're just starting track racing IMO. You already have them.
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Old 09-23-13, 12:05 PM   #3
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As long as your deep Vs aren't laced to quando hubs I would use them for at least your first season. No need to pay a lot for new wheels when there are more valuable investments.
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Old 09-23-13, 02:06 PM   #4
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For tips on how to spend your money: http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...ew-track-racer
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Old 09-23-13, 02:17 PM   #5
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Thanks for the advices guys and the track is now closed here in MN but I have a fixed gear winter commuter I used last year and will be using it again this winter. I am planning on getting a roller to work on my cadence and pedal technique, would you guys also recommend a mag/fluid trainer? Was also thinking about getting some type of leg press bench to work at home but not sure if it is necessary. I just switched to nights shift at work so I can watch my kids during the day so my hours on the bike is limited that's why I plan on getting a roller and leg press bench. Another question I have is does my training for road ITT help me on the track?
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Old 09-23-13, 02:20 PM   #6
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If you are doing well in road TTs on a fixed gear, your cadence is probably relatively solid. So it may be a better investment to get a trainer so you can work on your power. Lifting would also help out with your power.
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Old 09-23-13, 02:32 PM   #7
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If you are doing well in road TTs on a fixed gear, your cadence is probably relatively solid. So it may be a better investment to get a trainer so you can work on your power. Lifting would also help out with your power.
Hi Kayce, I've only done two TT events so far and neither one was consider fast lol. I know I need to work on cadence, recovery and power but I know it takes time to get good at cycling so I am in no rush. I commute 3-5 times a week on my kilo tt and average anywhere from 18-20mph on my 8mi commute. What I like about my commute is the distant is close to one of the local TT series I'm planning to focus on which is 8.3mi. One thing I've been meaning to get is a HRM and do interval training on my regular commute. Right now I'm using 165mm cranks, 46/17 and cruising comfortable at 22-23mph, I know it's nothing fast compare to most of you guys on this forum but I've been only cycling for over a 1.5yrs and riding fixed for about a year. I'm all ears so please any recommendations will be very appreciative!
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Old 09-23-13, 03:07 PM   #8
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Don't use a commute for training for two reasons: a commute needs to be safe, and if you are focused on other things it is not safe. Training rides need to be flexible, and a commute is not flexible.

Track training is mostly about power building, which does not exist much in a TT. For lower and mid-level racing you one will help with the other. Your track power will help your TT starts, climbs, finish kicks and your TT endurance will be good for your cadence and ability to ride solo in an attack.

But at some point having two separate focuses will hinder you. At some point in the future if you get serious about one or the other, you may have to pick. But if you are like most racers just keep doing whats fun, even if you will never reach the top levels. Very few of us do.
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Old 09-23-13, 03:18 PM   #9
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Kayce, I was told at my first TT to no start too hard and just ease it in. The fastest guy at the TT I did was a track veteran and he annihilated everyone with his track bike. We had an interesting conversation after the race and he recommend me to gear for the next race and I did. He also told me to start hard, attack the hills and learn how to use the descent for recovery. I did asked him how fast he was going and he told me he was cruising around 29-30mph on his 47/17 gearing. I for sure will give track racing a try next year and hope to be somewhat decent lol.
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Old 09-23-13, 07:25 PM   #10
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Was also thinking about getting some type of leg press bench to work at home but not sure if it is necessary. I just switched to nights shift at work so I can watch my kids during the day so my hours on the bike is limited that's why I plan on getting a roller and leg press bench.
If your focus is on ITT stuff then I would question the need to shell out money on home gym gear.

On the other hand, I am working my way down the sprint route, and I invested in a power cage style setup that came with weights and an adjustable bench. The whole setup cost me the equivalent of 1 1/2 yrs of gym membership. It has now well and truly paid for istelf and I can fit weights into my schedule whenever I need to. I never have to wait for equipment to become available. I never have to deal with someone else's sweat, and I can pump my own music however loud I want (I live in the country so my nearest neighbour is around 700m away!) to really pump the mood. I'm limited to free weights exercises but that's fine by me.
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Old 09-23-13, 07:36 PM   #11
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If your focus is on ITT stuff then I would question the need to shell out money on home gym gear.

On the other hand, I am working my way down the sprint route, and I invested in a power cage style setup that came with weights and an adjustable bench. The whole setup cost me the equivalent of 1 1/2 yrs of gym membership. It has now well and truly paid for istelf and I can fit weights into my schedule whenever I need to. I never have to wait for equipment to become available. I never have to deal with someone else's sweat, and I can pump my own music however loud I want (I live in the country so my nearest neighbour is around 700m away!) to really pump the mood. I'm limited to free weights exercises but that's fine by me.
Hi brawlo, as of right now my focus will be road ITT and planning to try track racing next year. So would you say a roller is much more needed for the type of events I'm planning to do? The reason I'm focusing on road ITT is because I haven't done any track racing yet and I'm sure I'll get hook on track racing just like how I did on road ITT.
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Old 09-23-13, 08:31 PM   #12
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if your focus is road ITT than you need to just ride as much as possible. The intensity at which you ride will be dictated by your (presumably limited) time schedule - for someone with less than or equal to 5 or 6 hrs/week to train this will be almost all long, painful threshold-type interval riding on the road or the trainer.

if your focus is track racing, than you need consider what type of racing you are interested in. while an enduro type may train more like a road TT'er than a track sprinter would, a points racer needs more anaerboic power work and neuromusicular strength than a TT'er.

just sayin you should think about what you want in racing (TT and/or track specific) before you decide how to train
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Old 09-23-13, 09:16 PM   #13
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if your focus is road ITT than you need to just ride as much as possible. The intensity at which you ride will be dictated by your (presumably limited) time schedule - for someone with less than or equal to 5 or 6 hrs/week to train this will be almost all long, painful threshold-type interval riding on the road or the trainer.

if your focus is track racing, than you need consider what type of racing you are interested in. while an enduro type may train more like a road TT'er than a track sprinter would, a points racer needs more anaerboic power work and neuromusicular strength than a TT'er.

just sayin you should think about what you want in racing (TT and/or track specific) before you decide how to train

TMonk, thanks for the advices and I'll wait til next year to try out track racing and see if it is something I would like to focus more on. For as right now road ITT has my full focus and I just thought that by asking in the track forum would help me because I will be using a track bike. I would like to thank those who have give me some excellent advices so far!
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Old 09-23-13, 10:22 PM   #14
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Hi brawlo, as of right now my focus will be road ITT and planning to try track racing next year. So would you say a roller is much more needed for the type of events I'm planning to do? The reason I'm focusing on road ITT is because I haven't done any track racing yet and I'm sure I'll get hook on track racing just like how I did on road ITT.
A trainer (mag/fluid) rather than rollers I would say. If your focus is ITT, then I presume you'd be wanting to train on your aero bars. That could be interesting to say the least on rollers. I haven't done it, but have heard it can be just plain scary! I have a coach and I have rollers and a Kurt Kinetic (our winter has just finished). The only session he's had me do on the rollers is a shorter 20min to get my legs spinning and smoothing my pedal stroke. Everything else I do on the fluid trainer if not on the road.
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Old 09-27-13, 01:44 PM   #15
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Well I guess I'm beating myself on wheelset lol anyways a local cyclist is selling my his used roller and trainer both for $175. I wanted a Chinese 50/88 full carbon tubular wheelset but I decided to use that money towards getting the trainer and roller so I can train during the cold winter here in MN. I was also given a free pair of new Ambrosio Crono F20 tubular rims and was wondering if they are worth building up? I just need a good wheelset that will be good for both training and racing, I'll pick up some carbon wheelset down the road. Oh and the Velocity are staying on the commuter.

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Old 10-09-13, 07:56 PM   #16
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Well I ended up picking up both the rollers and fluid trainer for $160 and been riding the rollers for the last three days. I definitely like the rollers more than the trainer, goal is to keep riding the rollers til my pedalling is more efficient then I'll mix the trainer in with my training. I felt that the rollers has way more resistance than actual road riding so my first 20min session was pretty exhausting so I had to take a couple of breaks in between. The second and third day riding the rollers was a lot better, I can now ride more than 20min without taking any breaks and riding off the rollers. So far I've been doing 3min of warm up, 12min of 17-18mph, 2.5-3min of 19-21mph, 30-40sec of all out effort and 3min cool down. Is this the correct way to approach my training? I'm not that strong yet so I figure I'll take it slowly by adding a minute a day to build up my endurance.
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Old 10-23-13, 11:53 AM   #17
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You sound a lot like me. I find that doing a commute like that is great training, because for most of us working people, any seat time is good seat time. 22mph is pretty fast on a commute. I do agree that commute is not a great place to train, as I was doing both and got pretty hurt when my shoe unclipped at high rpm on my commute. Still, if you have a safe space, you could throw some interval training in part of your commute.

I’m not sure I understand with your friends gearing (he is targeting 130rpm steady state???). I do 100rpm commuting (stead state at least), while 120-150rpm sprinting on the track. Two different animals. Gearing for time trial and gearing for track are going to be different (as are speeds and rpm).

I like rollers as they are not as boring as something where your bike is bolted to the trainer, and they let you do high cadence work pretty easily.

TT and Track racing have very different requirements (aside from the fact that the skill level requirement is very different for track). Time trial is about constant output while track racing is about explosive power and acceleration (and tactics).

Don’t be hard on yourself. If you are commuting like you say (which is basically what I do), you are plenty strong, you just need to fine tune things.
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Old 10-23-13, 07:01 PM   #18
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You sound a lot like me. I find that doing a commute like that is great training, because for most of us working people, any seat time is good seat time. 22mph is pretty fast on a commute. I do agree that commute is not a great place to train, as I was doing both and got pretty hurt when my shoe unclipped at high rpm on my commute. Still, if you have a safe space, you could throw some interval training in part of your commute.

Iím not sure I understand with your friends gearing (he is targeting 130rpm steady state???). I do 100rpm commuting (stead state at least), while 120-150rpm sprinting on the track. Two different animals. Gearing for time trial and gearing for track are going to be different (as are speeds and rpm).

I like rollers as they are not as boring as something where your bike is bolted to the trainer, and they let you do high cadence work pretty easily.

TT and Track racing have very different requirements (aside from the fact that the skill level requirement is very different for track). Time trial is about constant output while track racing is about explosive power and acceleration (and tactics).

Donít be hard on yourself. If you are commuting like you say (which is basically what I do), you are plenty strong, you just need to fine tune things.
Thanks for the advices and I'm loving the rollers so far and will keep training. It seems to me that time trial is pretty much endurance type racing and track racing is hard effort type race due to the short duration races. I thought about it and I'm just going to throw drop bars on my new track and run in the stock class for the local TT series. I just don't want to be switching handlebars back and forth and planning to give track racing a try next year.
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Old 01-19-14, 12:52 AM   #19
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Hey, sorry to hijack this thread, but I just wanted to reply to your PM. You can keep sending me messages if you want to reply, but I can't cause I only have 25 posts on this forum and you need 50...So here's my reply. Sorry about that.


Thanks! Yeah, man. These are my main wheels and I ride them (cautiously) through the city. They're obviously not meant for all the potholes and stuff, but they're definitely rigid and seem to be well built. I don't know how many miles I've ridden with them so far because I've been so busy lately...maybe <25? And I've had no problems. The weave and gloss on them look phenomenal in person. They're also super light and "fast." Certainly not as fast the dimpled wheels that other companies have probably, but they definitely cut the air and sit well with my tires, almost flush like tubulars. I don't know what kind of tires you'll be using though. There's also the tube option of course.


Check their website, Yoeleo.com to get more information. They seem to be a really reliable company so far. Their site has so many different types of wheels and options, and you can also find them on Taobao if you can read Chinese. I paid under $500 USD for mine, built with spokes and Novatec Hubs. They are really helpful and will help you customize them to your needs. My guy asked me questions that I forgot about and even called me to make sure of a couple things after I went offline.


Let me know if you have any more questions. Good luck!


Brian
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