Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Track Cycling: Velodrome Racing and Training Area Looking to enter into the realm of track racing? Want to share your experiences and tactics for riding on a velodrome? The Track Cycling forums is for you! Come in and discuss training/racing, equipment, and current track cycling events.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 03-06-14, 01:54 PM   #576
Brian Ratliff
Senior Member
 
Brian Ratliff's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Near Portland, OR
Bikes: Three road bikes. Two track bikes.
Posts: 10,060
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiveflat View Post
And this is precisely why I asked. I've never ridden road pedals (how different are they from MTB pedals?)
Maybe I'll see if my LBS has some inexpensive ones (here I go putting more money into this budget bike that I didn't want to do).
MTB pedals are designed with quick release/quick entry in mind. Road pedals are designed with retention and power transfer in mind. Track sprinters are the extreme; they usually have pedals which are impossible to release without manually loosening straps.
__________________
Cat 2 Track, Cat 3 Road.
"If you’re new enough [to racing] that you would ask such question, then i would hazard a guess that if you just made up a workout that sounded hard to do, and did it, you’d probably get faster." --the tiniest sprinter
Brian Ratliff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-14, 02:35 PM   #577
Fiveflat
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Sacramento, CA
Bikes: 1996 Gary Fisher Joshua X1 MTB; Micargi beach cruiser, Marfik FG
Posts: 46
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Just got back from LBS with Shimano R550 pedals and inexpensive Bontrager shoes. Thanks for the advise guys! I paid a little more than amazon prices, but good for LBS I suppose.
Fiveflat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-06-14, 03:24 PM   #578
carleton
Elitist
Thread Starter
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 13,067
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fiveflat View Post
Just got back from LBS with Shimano R550 pedals and inexpensive Bontrager shoes. Thanks for the advise guys! I paid a little more than amazon prices, but good for LBS I suppose.
Awesome. You'll probably find use for those outside of the velodrome, too.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by gtrob View Post
Roadies can run tempo all year as that's what humans were designed for. If you want to be a cheetah, lay around and lick your paws more.
carleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-14, 12:19 AM   #579
mxs
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: SFV
Bikes: Bianchi Pista
Posts: 126
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Not the Slowest View Post
Any particular type to get or just my favorite road tape and cut shorter.
Any type to avoid?

Sadly I do like the cushy feel of the one that came with the bike, but maybe a gel based tape would
I have been a loyal Specialized Roubaix user for years now and it's all I'll use as it is fairly cushy and makes for a slightly thicker bar. I also believe Carleton is a fan too.
mxs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-14, 01:27 AM   #580
carleton
Elitist
Thread Starter
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 13,067
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by mxs View Post
I have been a loyal Specialized Roubaix user for years now and it's all I'll use as it is fairly cushy and makes for a slightly thicker bar. I also believe Carleton is a fan too.
Hahaha, yeah I like Roubaix. I have it on my road bike. It's not expensive and you can stretch it to make it lay down thinner if you like. I also like the thin Lizard Skins tape. But that stuff is pricy. I use that on my track bars where one of the two rolls can be cut in half and used on both sides of track bars because you only wrap them 1/2 way.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by gtrob View Post
Roadies can run tempo all year as that's what humans were designed for. If you want to be a cheetah, lay around and lick your paws more.
carleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-14, 10:46 AM   #581
flip.flop
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Bikes:
Posts: 21
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
My local track is 450 metres and outdoor. I've never seen anyone take a lap in any sort of race, though I've only been going about a year. Do people actually take laps on tracks that size? It seems to take a big effort on a 250m track, so 450 seems a big ask. Cheers
flip.flop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-14, 11:20 AM   #582
noglider 
aka Tom Reingold
 
noglider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: West Village, New York City
Bikes: too many
Posts: 26,864
Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 85 Post(s)
I'm into leather.
__________________
Tom Reingold, noglider@pobox.com
New York City and High Falls, NY
Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog

Please email me rather than PM'ing me. Thanks.
noglider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-14, 11:39 AM   #583
Baby Puke
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: San Francisco, CA
Bikes: Marin Stelvio, Pogliaghi SL, Panasonic NJS, Dolan DF3, Intense Pro24 BMX
Posts: 1,001
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by noglider View Post
I'm into leather.
There are other forums out there that might be more appropriate for exploring this predeliction. Not judging, by the way.
Baby Puke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-14, 11:58 AM   #584
carleton
Elitist
Thread Starter
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 13,067
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by flip.flop View Post
My local track is 450 metres and outdoor. I've never seen anyone take a lap in any sort of race, though I've only been going about a year. Do people actually take laps on tracks that size? It seems to take a big effort on a 250m track, so 450 seems a big ask. Cheers
Taking a lap solo on a 450M track is like going up 2 laps back-to-back on a 250M track.

The only way I can see that happening is if there is a rider who is beyond head-and-shoulders above the field (think Taylor Phinney dropping in on a local CAT3 points race).

But, I guess anything is possible. I almost lapped the field during a 5 lap scratch once on a 327M track. I got cursed out by a guy who thought it was unsportsmanlike. The race director laughed
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by gtrob View Post
Roadies can run tempo all year as that's what humans were designed for. If you want to be a cheetah, lay around and lick your paws more.
carleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-14, 12:34 PM   #585
Not the Slowest
Senior Member
 
Not the Slowest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Riverdale, NY
Bikes: 2002 Seven Axiom
Posts: 731
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Done, Thanks...Now I just have to decide on color...Hmmm Red = Fast.. ARGHHHH More decisions to make
Quote:
Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Hahaha, yeah I like Roubaix. I have it on my road bike. It's not expensive and you can stretch it to make it lay down thinner if you like. I also like the thin Lizard Skins tape. But that stuff is pricy. I use that on my track bars where one of the two rolls can be cut in half and used on both sides of track bars because you only wrap them 1/2 way.
Not the Slowest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-14, 12:45 PM   #586
flip.flop
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Bikes:
Posts: 21
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Thanks Carleton.
This seems to take out an entire element of tactics - attacking, even with some other riders, requires considerably more effort until the end of the race. A sprint at the end seems the likely conclusion of any scratch and points races miss that entire opportunity. Am I missing something?
flip.flop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-14, 12:55 PM   #587
Not the Slowest
Senior Member
 
Not the Slowest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Riverdale, NY
Bikes: 2002 Seven Axiom
Posts: 731
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
40mm or 30mm? I know what you guys are thinking so I'll share a story to help explain why I need help.

Years ago when Starbucks started making their big push in NYC I visited one while my wife went shopping.
I'm a pretty plain guy and like my life if possible as simple as possible.

I walk in to the Starbucks and take a look at the the menu board and after a few moments I notice that nothing has the word "coffee" in it.
Suddendly I begin to sweat like a child loss in a big department store and unable to ask for help.

So with that I did the manly thing. I turned around and sulked out the door back to my wife.
Wifey asked "How was the coffee"? I simply said..."The line was too long".

So 30mm or 40mm?

Quote:
Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Hahaha, yeah I like Roubaix. I have it on my road bike. It's not expensive and you can stretch it to make it lay down thinner if you like. I also like the thin Lizard Skins tape. But that stuff is pricy. I use that on my track bars where one of the two rolls can be cut in half and used on both sides of track bars because you only wrap them 1/2 way.
Not the Slowest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-14, 03:11 PM   #588
carleton
Elitist
Thread Starter
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 13,067
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by flip.flop View Post
Thanks Carleton.
This seems to take out an entire element of tactics - attacking, even with some other riders, requires considerably more effort until the end of the race. A sprint at the end seems the likely conclusion of any scratch and points races miss that entire opportunity. Am I missing something?
Can you rephrase your question. I can't understand what you've written.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by gtrob View Post
Roadies can run tempo all year as that's what humans were designed for. If you want to be a cheetah, lay around and lick your paws more.
carleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-14, 03:15 PM   #589
carleton
Elitist
Thread Starter
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 13,067
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Not the Slowest View Post
40mm or 30mm? I know what you guys are thinking so I'll share a story to help explain why I need help.

Years ago when Starbucks started making their big push in NYC I visited one while my wife went shopping.
I'm a pretty plain guy and like my life if possible as simple as possible.

I walk in to the Starbucks and take a look at the the menu board and after a few moments I notice that nothing has the word "coffee" in it.
Suddendly I begin to sweat like a child loss in a big department store and unable to ask for help.

So with that I did the manly thing. I turned around and sulked out the door back to my wife.
Wifey asked "How was the coffee"? I simply said..."The line was too long".

So 30mm or 40mm?
Hahahaha

Quote:
Specialized’s Nic Sims said the wider design saves weight because you’re not using as long of a piece of tape and it provides better coverage that’s easier to wrap.
http://www.bikerumor.com/2011/05/19/...a-ltd-edition/


Hell, I didn't even know it came in 2 different widths. It doesn't matter.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by gtrob View Post
Roadies can run tempo all year as that's what humans were designed for. If you want to be a cheetah, lay around and lick your paws more.
carleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-14, 04:09 PM   #590
Not the Slowest
Senior Member
 
Not the Slowest's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Riverdale, NY
Bikes: 2002 Seven Axiom
Posts: 731
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 4 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Hahahaha



http://www.bikerumor.com/2011/05/19/...a-ltd-edition/


Hell, I didn't even know it came in 2 different widths. It doesn't matter.

GREAT, Time to go shopping. Did you know there are 7 colors? I'll think this out carefully. Hope the store has a short line.
Not the Slowest is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-14, 04:30 PM   #591
flip.flop
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Bikes:
Posts: 21
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Can you rephrase your question. I can't understand what you've written.
Sorry, reading it back you're right.

i suppose what I'm trying to say is that tactics will vary quite a lot with a longer track, since that entire option of taking a lap is removed from a racers range of options... not really a question anymore. Thanks for your help.
flip.flop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-07-14, 05:07 PM   #592
carleton
Elitist
Thread Starter
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 13,067
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by flip.flop View Post
Sorry, reading it back you're right.

i suppose what I'm trying to say is that tactics will vary quite a lot with a longer track, since that entire option of taking a lap is removed from a racers range of options... not really a question anymore. Thanks for your help.
Yeah, you are right. Track length is definitely a factor when it comes to tactics. Just like on a 200M track, taking a lap may be easy, but so easy that many will do it.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by gtrob View Post
Roadies can run tempo all year as that's what humans were designed for. If you want to be a cheetah, lay around and lick your paws more.
carleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-14, 12:09 AM   #593
Huffandstuff
Senior Member
 
Huffandstuff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Portland, OR
Bikes: I got bikes.
Posts: 1,758
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Not the Slowest View Post
GREAT, Time to go shopping. Did you know there are 7 colors? I'll think this out carefully. Hope the store has a short line.
I actually just bought some Roubaix tape for my commuter and just make sure you don't make my mistake of thinking it looks black while in the store, then taking it home and realizing it's "charcoal". I now have an all black bike with bar tape that doesn't match at all.
Huffandstuff is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 03-08-14, 01:38 PM   #594
gtrob
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Ontario
Bikes: T1, S2, P3
Posts: 728
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Yeah, you are right. Track length is definitely a factor when it comes to tactics. Just like on a 200M track, taking a lap may be easy, but so easy that many will do it.
Thats all in the fun. We have a 138m indoor track, so its hard to go FAST but its 'easy' to lap the field. So in a scratch or points race you will see every attack chased down. You get a good run from the top of the track and you can take half a lap pretty fast. Meanwhile at a 250+ track they can let someone hang out there longer. On a 450 track I imagine you start to see a lot of 'splits' like you see on the road, multiple groups chasing each other, rather than 1 guy smoking off the front.
gtrob is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-14, 04:08 PM   #595
Pole Line Stand
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 10
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Track fork question. Looking into purchasing a new track fork. The current fork I presently have is the Edge/Enve carbon fork. I've been using it for nearly 4+ years. I absolutely like the fork. The reason why I was looking into purchasing a new fork is that I really feel the need to have one or two centimeters longer on the steerer tube for the purpose of raising my position. It appears that the Edge fork is no longer in production. I wanted to inquire about the Alpina carbon fork, Alpina Wing carbon fork, and the Warp 9. My concern with the Warp 9 is the 38mm offset. I think the other forks are 30mm, similar to the one I presently have. Would the Alpina forks be an adequate substitution? BTW, the frame is a Tiemeyer.

Many Thanks
Pole Line Stand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-14, 04:37 PM   #596
Hida Yanra
VeloSIRraptor
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Deschutes
Bikes:
Posts: 4,543
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by flip.flop View Post
My local track is 450 metres and outdoor. I've never seen anyone take a lap in any sort of race, though I've only been going about a year. Do people actually take laps on tracks that size?
It does happen. I race on a 400 and a 200, and one is certainly easier than the other.
That said, 400s tend to turn into more speedways where a group might get together and work well. More common however is that a group will get a large enough lead and then hold on to it in such a way that the race ends with various "team pursuits" going on.
I've never seen it done solo, even with riders that were obviously on another level. Your mileage may vary.

Quote:
Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Taking a lap solo on a 450M track is like going up 2 laps back-to-back on a 250M track.
But, I guess anything is possible.
Yep. Distance to lap a decent size field on a 200m track is about 160m. After gaining 160 on a 400m track, you'd still have 220m to go. Of note, the field strings out much longer on short tracks than on long tracks, this makes both tactics and strategy meaningfully distinct from one scenario to the other.


Quote:
Originally Posted by flip.flop View Post
This seems to take out an entire element of tactics - attacking, even with some other riders, requires considerably more effort until the end of the race.
See above, quite different tactics are the name of the game for long v short tracks.
At least here at our track, we see more points races than scratch races, and I'd think this has something to do with it. Frequently the pack will be riding at high speed at least 2-wide, you'll never see that on a short track, the distance around is much longer.

On longer tracks, a sprint will tend to develop more quickly as sprinters can come around more quickly.

Admittedly, I've never gone into a race on a 400m track with my intended strategy being to "go lap the field", but there have been plenty of races where my strategy was to attack by myself or with 2-3 others, get 200m, and then TTT in to the end.
The upshot is that attacks either happen closer to the end of the race, or the people attacking know they have to be able to hold on for a while at 30mph, vs lapping and sitting-in.
Hida Yanra is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-14, 08:31 PM   #597
carleton
Elitist
Thread Starter
 
carleton's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Atlanta, GA
Bikes:
Posts: 13,067
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Pole Line Stand View Post
Track fork question. Looking into purchasing a new track fork. The current fork I presently have is the Edge/Enve carbon fork. I've been using it for nearly 4+ years. I absolutely like the fork. The reason why I was looking into purchasing a new fork is that I really feel the need to have one or two centimeters longer on the steerer tube for the purpose of raising my position. It appears that the Edge fork is no longer in production. I wanted to inquire about the Alpina carbon fork, Alpina Wing carbon fork, and the Warp 9. My concern with the Warp 9 is the 38mm offset. I think the other forks are 30mm, similar to the one I presently have. Would the Alpina forks be an adequate substitution? BTW, the frame is a Tiemeyer.

Many Thanks
Actually, Tiemeyer ships his frames with both Enve and Alpina forks depending on the rider. I think the lighter riders got the Enve forks and the sprinters (ahem...heavier riders) got the Alpina forks. It's a great fork that is popular and sort of easy to find.

I just ordered one yesterday for my new frame that is being made: http://www.retro-gression.com/produc...f04-track-fork

I believe that Retrogression is the only US importer of Alpina forks ever since DPM Sports started closing its operations.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by gtrob View Post
Roadies can run tempo all year as that's what humans were designed for. If you want to be a cheetah, lay around and lick your paws more.
carleton is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-14, 11:04 PM   #598
GMJ
Would you just look at it
 
GMJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Denver
Bikes: good ones.
Posts: 1,517
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
How do you feel about Mack hubs?

I'm building a new wheelset for what is now going to be a dedicated track bike, and I was looking to get some really nice stuff for it.

That being said, maybe some pointers on rims would be appreciated as well. I weigh about 180lbs, I don't really specialize in any events yet, and I ride at Penrose (****ty ****ty surface).
GMJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-14, 03:45 AM   #599
Pole Line Stand
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Bikes:
Posts: 10
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by carleton View Post
Actually, Tiemeyer ships his frames with both Enve and Alpina forks depending on the rider. I think the lighter riders got the Enve forks and the sprinters (ahem...heavier riders) got the Alpina forks. It's a great fork that is popular and sort of easy to find.

I just ordered one yesterday for my new frame that is being made: http://www.retro-gression.com/produc...f04-track-fork

I believe that Retrogression is the only US importer of Alpina forks ever since DPM Sports started closing its operations.
Thank you for the quick reply on the alpina. The price is not too bad as well.
Pole Line Stand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-10-14, 08:29 AM   #600
Fiveflat
Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: Sacramento, CA
Bikes: 1996 Gary Fisher Joshua X1 MTB; Micargi beach cruiser, Marfik FG
Posts: 46
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Thanks for the help last week. I had a successful, fun first day out at the track!
I couldn't imagine riding the track in just toe clips, so I'm really glad I got clipless pedals. I did terrible in the little scratch races at the end but I will improve my lung capacity and my riding!

On to the question... I have my bike geared 46/14. I didn't feel like I couldn't get going, I felt more like I was unstable at higher RPM. I guess that'll come with practice, but everyone else out there left my legs looking like toothpicks and they looked to be turning really fast RPM. Should gear for higher rpm as a beginner?
Fiveflat is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:44 PM.