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  1. #576
    Senior Member Brian Ratliff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fiveflat View Post
    And this is precisely why I asked. I've never ridden road pedals (how different are they from MTB pedals?)
    Maybe I'll see if my LBS has some inexpensive ones (here I go putting more money into this budget bike that I didn't want to do).
    MTB pedals are designed with quick release/quick entry in mind. Road pedals are designed with retention and power transfer in mind. Track sprinters are the extreme; they usually have pedals which are impossible to release without manually loosening straps.
    Cat 2 Track, Cat 3 Road.
    "If you’re new enough [to racing] that you would ask such question, then i would hazard a guess that if you just made up a workout that sounded hard to do, and did it, you’d probably get faster." --the tiniest sprinter

  2. #577
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    Just got back from LBS with Shimano R550 pedals and inexpensive Bontrager shoes. Thanks for the advise guys! I paid a little more than amazon prices, but good for LBS I suppose.

  3. #578
    Elitist carleton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fiveflat View Post
    Just got back from LBS with Shimano R550 pedals and inexpensive Bontrager shoes. Thanks for the advise guys! I paid a little more than amazon prices, but good for LBS I suppose.
    Awesome. You'll probably find use for those outside of the velodrome, too.

  4. #579
    mxs
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not the Slowest View Post
    Any particular type to get or just my favorite road tape and cut shorter.
    Any type to avoid?

    Sadly I do like the cushy feel of the one that came with the bike, but maybe a gel based tape would
    I have been a loyal Specialized Roubaix user for years now and it's all I'll use as it is fairly cushy and makes for a slightly thicker bar. I also believe Carleton is a fan too.
    Quote Originally Posted by carleton View Post
    Wouldn't stand a chance. Like bringing a knife to a laser cat fight.

  5. #580
    Elitist carleton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mxs View Post
    I have been a loyal Specialized Roubaix user for years now and it's all I'll use as it is fairly cushy and makes for a slightly thicker bar. I also believe Carleton is a fan too.
    Hahaha, yeah I like Roubaix. I have it on my road bike. It's not expensive and you can stretch it to make it lay down thinner if you like. I also like the thin Lizard Skins tape. But that stuff is pricy. I use that on my track bars where one of the two rolls can be cut in half and used on both sides of track bars because you only wrap them 1/2 way.

  6. #581
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    My local track is 450 metres and outdoor. I've never seen anyone take a lap in any sort of race, though I've only been going about a year. Do people actually take laps on tracks that size? It seems to take a big effort on a 250m track, so 450 seems a big ask. Cheers

  7. #582
    aka Tom Reingold noglider's Avatar
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    I'm into leather.
    I have made this longer than usual because I have not had time to make it shorter. --Blaise Pascal

    Tom Reingold, noglider@pobox.com
    Residences: West Village, New York City and High Falls, NY
    Blogs: The Experienced Cyclist; noglider's ride blog

  8. #583
    Senior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by noglider View Post
    I'm into leather.
    There are other forums out there that might be more appropriate for exploring this predeliction. Not judging, by the way.

  9. #584
    Elitist carleton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flip.flop View Post
    My local track is 450 metres and outdoor. I've never seen anyone take a lap in any sort of race, though I've only been going about a year. Do people actually take laps on tracks that size? It seems to take a big effort on a 250m track, so 450 seems a big ask. Cheers
    Taking a lap solo on a 450M track is like going up 2 laps back-to-back on a 250M track.

    The only way I can see that happening is if there is a rider who is beyond head-and-shoulders above the field (think Taylor Phinney dropping in on a local CAT3 points race).

    But, I guess anything is possible. I almost lapped the field during a 5 lap scratch once on a 327M track. I got cursed out by a guy who thought it was unsportsmanlike. The race director laughed

  10. #585
    Senior Member Not the Slowest's Avatar
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    Done, Thanks...Now I just have to decide on color...Hmmm Red = Fast.. ARGHHHH More decisions to make
    Quote Originally Posted by carleton View Post
    Hahaha, yeah I like Roubaix. I have it on my road bike. It's not expensive and you can stretch it to make it lay down thinner if you like. I also like the thin Lizard Skins tape. But that stuff is pricy. I use that on my track bars where one of the two rolls can be cut in half and used on both sides of track bars because you only wrap them 1/2 way.
    Robert
    Not The Slowest, Never The Fastest, even Solo

  11. #586
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    Thanks Carleton.
    This seems to take out an entire element of tactics - attacking, even with some other riders, requires considerably more effort until the end of the race. A sprint at the end seems the likely conclusion of any scratch and points races miss that entire opportunity. Am I missing something?

  12. #587
    Senior Member Not the Slowest's Avatar
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    40mm or 30mm? I know what you guys are thinking so I'll share a story to help explain why I need help.

    Years ago when Starbucks started making their big push in NYC I visited one while my wife went shopping.
    I'm a pretty plain guy and like my life if possible as simple as possible.

    I walk in to the Starbucks and take a look at the the menu board and after a few moments I notice that nothing has the word "coffee" in it.
    Suddendly I begin to sweat like a child loss in a big department store and unable to ask for help.

    So with that I did the manly thing. I turned around and sulked out the door back to my wife.
    Wifey asked "How was the coffee"? I simply said..."The line was too long".

    So 30mm or 40mm?

    Quote Originally Posted by carleton View Post
    Hahaha, yeah I like Roubaix. I have it on my road bike. It's not expensive and you can stretch it to make it lay down thinner if you like. I also like the thin Lizard Skins tape. But that stuff is pricy. I use that on my track bars where one of the two rolls can be cut in half and used on both sides of track bars because you only wrap them 1/2 way.
    Robert
    Not The Slowest, Never The Fastest, even Solo

  13. #588
    Elitist carleton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flip.flop View Post
    Thanks Carleton.
    This seems to take out an entire element of tactics - attacking, even with some other riders, requires considerably more effort until the end of the race. A sprint at the end seems the likely conclusion of any scratch and points races miss that entire opportunity. Am I missing something?
    Can you rephrase your question. I can't understand what you've written.

  14. #589
    Elitist carleton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not the Slowest View Post
    40mm or 30mm? I know what you guys are thinking so I'll share a story to help explain why I need help.

    Years ago when Starbucks started making their big push in NYC I visited one while my wife went shopping.
    I'm a pretty plain guy and like my life if possible as simple as possible.

    I walk in to the Starbucks and take a look at the the menu board and after a few moments I notice that nothing has the word "coffee" in it.
    Suddendly I begin to sweat like a child loss in a big department store and unable to ask for help.

    So with that I did the manly thing. I turned around and sulked out the door back to my wife.
    Wifey asked "How was the coffee"? I simply said..."The line was too long".

    So 30mm or 40mm?
    Hahahaha

    Specialized’s Nic Sims said the wider design saves weight because you’re not using as long of a piece of tape and it provides better coverage that’s easier to wrap.
    http://www.bikerumor.com/2011/05/19/...a-ltd-edition/


    Hell, I didn't even know it came in 2 different widths. It doesn't matter.

  15. #590
    Senior Member Not the Slowest's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by carleton View Post
    Hahahaha



    http://www.bikerumor.com/2011/05/19/...a-ltd-edition/


    Hell, I didn't even know it came in 2 different widths. It doesn't matter.

    GREAT, Time to go shopping. Did you know there are 7 colors? I'll think this out carefully. Hope the store has a short line.
    Robert
    Not The Slowest, Never The Fastest, even Solo

  16. #591
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    Quote Originally Posted by carleton View Post
    Can you rephrase your question. I can't understand what you've written.
    Sorry, reading it back you're right.

    i suppose what I'm trying to say is that tactics will vary quite a lot with a longer track, since that entire option of taking a lap is removed from a racers range of options... not really a question anymore. Thanks for your help.

  17. #592
    Elitist carleton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flip.flop View Post
    Sorry, reading it back you're right.

    i suppose what I'm trying to say is that tactics will vary quite a lot with a longer track, since that entire option of taking a lap is removed from a racers range of options... not really a question anymore. Thanks for your help.
    Yeah, you are right. Track length is definitely a factor when it comes to tactics. Just like on a 200M track, taking a lap may be easy, but so easy that many will do it.

  18. #593
    Senior Member Huffandstuff's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Not the Slowest View Post
    GREAT, Time to go shopping. Did you know there are 7 colors? I'll think this out carefully. Hope the store has a short line.
    I actually just bought some Roubaix tape for my commuter and just make sure you don't make my mistake of thinking it looks black while in the store, then taking it home and realizing it's "charcoal". I now have an all black bike with bar tape that doesn't match at all.

  19. #594
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    Quote Originally Posted by carleton View Post
    Yeah, you are right. Track length is definitely a factor when it comes to tactics. Just like on a 200M track, taking a lap may be easy, but so easy that many will do it.
    Thats all in the fun. We have a 138m indoor track, so its hard to go FAST but its 'easy' to lap the field. So in a scratch or points race you will see every attack chased down. You get a good run from the top of the track and you can take half a lap pretty fast. Meanwhile at a 250+ track they can let someone hang out there longer. On a 450 track I imagine you start to see a lot of 'splits' like you see on the road, multiple groups chasing each other, rather than 1 guy smoking off the front.

  20. #595
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    Track fork question. Looking into purchasing a new track fork. The current fork I presently have is the Edge/Enve carbon fork. I've been using it for nearly 4+ years. I absolutely like the fork. The reason why I was looking into purchasing a new fork is that I really feel the need to have one or two centimeters longer on the steerer tube for the purpose of raising my position. It appears that the Edge fork is no longer in production. I wanted to inquire about the Alpina carbon fork, Alpina Wing carbon fork, and the Warp 9. My concern with the Warp 9 is the 38mm offset. I think the other forks are 30mm, similar to the one I presently have. Would the Alpina forks be an adequate substitution? BTW, the frame is a Tiemeyer.

    Many Thanks

  21. #596
    VeloSIRraptor
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    Quote Originally Posted by flip.flop View Post
    My local track is 450 metres and outdoor. I've never seen anyone take a lap in any sort of race, though I've only been going about a year. Do people actually take laps on tracks that size?
    It does happen. I race on a 400 and a 200, and one is certainly easier than the other.
    That said, 400s tend to turn into more speedways where a group might get together and work well. More common however is that a group will get a large enough lead and then hold on to it in such a way that the race ends with various "team pursuits" going on.
    I've never seen it done solo, even with riders that were obviously on another level. Your mileage may vary.

    Quote Originally Posted by carleton View Post
    Taking a lap solo on a 450M track is like going up 2 laps back-to-back on a 250M track.
    But, I guess anything is possible.
    Yep. Distance to lap a decent size field on a 200m track is about 160m. After gaining 160 on a 400m track, you'd still have 220m to go. Of note, the field strings out much longer on short tracks than on long tracks, this makes both tactics and strategy meaningfully distinct from one scenario to the other.


    Quote Originally Posted by flip.flop View Post
    This seems to take out an entire element of tactics - attacking, even with some other riders, requires considerably more effort until the end of the race.
    See above, quite different tactics are the name of the game for long v short tracks.
    At least here at our track, we see more points races than scratch races, and I'd think this has something to do with it. Frequently the pack will be riding at high speed at least 2-wide, you'll never see that on a short track, the distance around is much longer.

    On longer tracks, a sprint will tend to develop more quickly as sprinters can come around more quickly.

    Admittedly, I've never gone into a race on a 400m track with my intended strategy being to "go lap the field", but there have been plenty of races where my strategy was to attack by myself or with 2-3 others, get 200m, and then TTT in to the end.
    The upshot is that attacks either happen closer to the end of the race, or the people attacking know they have to be able to hold on for a while at 30mph, vs lapping and sitting-in.
    Quote Originally Posted by shovelhd View Post
    If it comes down to a field sprint, you probably won't win, so don't let it.

  22. #597
    Elitist carleton's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pole Line Stand View Post
    Track fork question. Looking into purchasing a new track fork. The current fork I presently have is the Edge/Enve carbon fork. I've been using it for nearly 4+ years. I absolutely like the fork. The reason why I was looking into purchasing a new fork is that I really feel the need to have one or two centimeters longer on the steerer tube for the purpose of raising my position. It appears that the Edge fork is no longer in production. I wanted to inquire about the Alpina carbon fork, Alpina Wing carbon fork, and the Warp 9. My concern with the Warp 9 is the 38mm offset. I think the other forks are 30mm, similar to the one I presently have. Would the Alpina forks be an adequate substitution? BTW, the frame is a Tiemeyer.

    Many Thanks
    Actually, Tiemeyer ships his frames with both Enve and Alpina forks depending on the rider. I think the lighter riders got the Enve forks and the sprinters (ahem...heavier riders) got the Alpina forks. It's a great fork that is popular and sort of easy to find.

    I just ordered one yesterday for my new frame that is being made: http://www.retro-gression.com/produc...f04-track-fork

    I believe that Retrogression is the only US importer of Alpina forks ever since DPM Sports started closing its operations.

  23. #598
    GMJ
    GMJ is offline
    Would you just look at it GMJ's Avatar
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    How do you feel about Mack hubs?

    I'm building a new wheelset for what is now going to be a dedicated track bike, and I was looking to get some really nice stuff for it.

    That being said, maybe some pointers on rims would be appreciated as well. I weigh about 180lbs, I don't really specialize in any events yet, and I ride at Penrose (****ty ****ty surface).
    - George
    PedalRoom
    McChinken: "That's why you put it in the bottom bracket."

  24. #599
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    Quote Originally Posted by carleton View Post
    Actually, Tiemeyer ships his frames with both Enve and Alpina forks depending on the rider. I think the lighter riders got the Enve forks and the sprinters (ahem...heavier riders) got the Alpina forks. It's a great fork that is popular and sort of easy to find.

    I just ordered one yesterday for my new frame that is being made: http://www.retro-gression.com/produc...f04-track-fork

    I believe that Retrogression is the only US importer of Alpina forks ever since DPM Sports started closing its operations.
    Thank you for the quick reply on the alpina. The price is not too bad as well.

  25. #600
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    Thanks for the help last week. I had a successful, fun first day out at the track!
    I couldn't imagine riding the track in just toe clips, so I'm really glad I got clipless pedals. I did terrible in the little scratch races at the end but I will improve my lung capacity and my riding!

    On to the question... I have my bike geared 46/14. I didn't feel like I couldn't get going, I felt more like I was unstable at higher RPM. I guess that'll come with practice, but everyone else out there left my legs looking like toothpicks and they looked to be turning really fast RPM. Should gear for higher rpm as a beginner?

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