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-   -   Ask your small, random, track-related questions here (http://www.bikeforums.net/track-cycling-velodrome-racing-training-area/924726-ask-your-small-random-track-related-questions-here.html)

carleton 12-03-13 01:47 PM

Ask your small, random, track-related questions here
 
Ask the questions that you were always wondering about but were afraid to ask or that didn't necessitate their own thread.

Wondering what a word means?
Wondering why athletes do seemingly weird things?
Wondering why track equipment is similar but different that road equipment?
Wondering if something is worth the time/hassle/money?

Have a question? Have an answer? Post it here.

queerpunk 12-03-13 02:38 PM

What's the rep of Zipp 950 disc wheels for track use?

carleton 12-03-13 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by queerpunk (Post 16297922)
What's the rep of Zipp 950 disc wheels for track use?

I think that they are old (produced in 1991) and may be subject to fatigue, delamination, or other issues. If you have one, check it over thoroughly before using. If you are considering buying one, I'd spend that money elsewhere.

queerpunk 12-03-13 05:07 PM

I can't tell when they stopped making it though; it would be practically free, so - investigating.

wens 12-03-13 05:13 PM

What do people use for tubulars if they're planning on using the same wheel for road and track? Seems like dual compound isn't so popular for track use.

bigfred 12-03-13 05:13 PM

Any reason not to get sram omnium cranks on a track bike?

JMR 12-03-13 05:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wens (Post 16298377)
What do people use for tubulars if they're planning on using the same wheel for road and track? Seems like dual compound isn't so popular for track use.

Vittoria Corsa Evo CX's are good for both road and track (not sure about on board tracks, but certainly concrete tracks).

JMR

Quinn8it 12-03-13 05:38 PM

Zipp 950
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by queerpunk (Post 16298361)
I can't tell when they stopped making it though; it would be practically free, so - investigating.

I really liked my 950 (ridden by me in 2011/2012)

these are sort of Cult Favorites, and you still see them in play quite regularly. I have heard claims by national team sprinters that they are a favorite because their lateral stiffness exceeds Zipps modern disc- and rivals the higher end new disc by other producers..

I have had issues with other manufactures convertible axles and ive never been crazy about allen bolt track nuts.. but both work quite well on the 950. I really liked how easily the bearings could come out- making it possible to easily service them and lube them with very light oil for key events, and then go back to thicker grease.. (i get a little carried away sometimes!)

I did see 2 guys strip the cog threading this year (one was my old 950) so its worth being extra cautious of the threads and possibly doing as i did and just leave a 14t on always..

this is an old wheel- so obviously use your best judgement as to is quality and safety.. but i have heard people say this wheel is from the era where Carbon was more often over-built than under...

if it is free- it is certainly worth a look..

-Q

carleton 12-03-13 06:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigfred (Post 16298380)
Any reason not to get sram omnium cranks on a track bike?

There are a very few minor reasons:

The chainring spider is abnormally thick on the Omniums causing it to catch on the chainstay of a very very few frames. Just google "SRAM Omnium" and your frame and if people had issues, it may show up in the results.

Being that the spider is so thick, standard single chainring bolts only get maybe 2 turns of thread purchase. Not the 3 or 4 that you'd expect. Because of this, they come with aluminum road Double chainring bolts which is weird for a track crank (steel singles are standard for track). This also makes gear changes a pain in the ass because you have to use that little tool to keep the backs from spinning. But don't worry, there is a very easy solution.

1) Some people say that using single chainring bolts is no problem.

2) Buy 1 set of steel Single chainring bolts and one set of steel Double chainring bolts (you can get these at a MTB shop). Use the female end from the Singles (super glue these in) and the male end of the Doubles and you are good to go. You'll get 7-8 turns of thread purchase. I did this when I ran Omniums a while back.

Also, the bottom bracket has about 1-2 good seasons of use in it. This is how they keep the price low by including a budget BB. Think of it as a Free BB because all of the other manufacturers charge more for their cranks alone THEN have you buy the BB and chainring.

I think the Ominiums are a great choice. They are inexpensive and VERY strong. I've seen many elite national level sprinters using them. They also come in Silver or Black.

I've seen many people buy them them and ditch the BB and buy a new high-end BB and still come out cheaper than with Dura-Ace.

Soil_Sampler 12-03-13 06:59 PM

Omniums
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by carleton (Post 16298541)
There are a very few minor reasons:

The chainring spider is abnormally thick on the Omniums causing it to catch on the chainstay of a very very few frames.

I had the same problem with my FSA Carbon Track Pro crankset on my Jamis Sonik.


Omniums:

Very easy to update the the BB with bearings, or a brand new BB such as the Chris King.

bigfred 12-03-13 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carleton (Post 16298541)
There are a very few minor reasons:

The chainring spider is abnormally thick on the Omniums causing it to catch on the chainstay of a very very few frames. Just google "SRAM Omnium" and your frame and if people had issues, it may show up in the results.

Being that the spider is so thick, standard single chainring bolts only get maybe 2 turns of thread purchase. Not the 3 or 4 that you'd expect. Because of this, they come with aluminum road Double chainring bolts which is weird for a track crank (steel singles are standard for track). This also makes gear changes a pain in the ass because you have to use that little tool to keep the backs from spinning. But don't worry, there is a very easy solution.

1) Some people say that using single chainring bolts is no problem.

2) Buy 1 set of steel Single chainring bolts and one set of steel Double chainring bolts (you can get these at a MTB shop). Use the female end from the Singles (super glue these in) and the male end of the Doubles and you are good to go. You'll get 7-8 turns of thread purchase. I did this when I ran Omniums a while back.

Also, the bottom bracket has about 1-2 good seasons of use in it. This is how they keep the price low by including a budget BB. Think of it as a Free BB because all of the other manufacturers charge more for their cranks alone THEN have you buy the BB and chainring.

I think the Ominiums are a great choice. They are inexpensive and VERY strong. I've seen many elite national level sprinters using them. They also come in Silver or Black.

I've seen many people buy them them and ditch the BB and buy a new high-end BB and still come out cheaper than with Dura-Ace.

Thanks for the excellent response Carleton.

Next question; What are the odds on you morphing Bikeforums.net/track into what FGF used to be in the event of FGF's ultimate demise?

carleton 12-03-13 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigfred (Post 16298676)
Thanks for the excellent response Carleton.

No problem. Glad to help.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigfred (Post 16298676)
Next question; What are the odds on you morphing Bikeforums.net/track into what FGF used to be in the event of FGF's ultimate demise?

If you build it, they will come.

Who knows.

sbs z31 12-03-13 08:17 PM

Are there people out there who actually use Aerospoke wheels on the track?

wens 12-03-13 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigfred (Post 16298380)
Any reason not to get sram omnium cranks on a track bike?

I'll throw in another maybe reason, depending: They're wider to the outside of he crankarms than at least some other cranks (dura ace). I had problems with hitting my feet on them and switched because of that.

carleton 12-03-13 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sbs z31 (Post 16298838)
Are there people out there who actually use Aerospoke wheels on the track?

No.

Quinn8it 12-03-13 10:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wens (Post 16298916)
I'll throw in another maybe reason, depending: They're wider to the outside of he crankarms than at least some other cranks (dura ace). I had problems with hitting my feet on them and switched because of that.

Also- I think they have about the widest Q-Factor of any track crank..

That could be a positive or a negative depending on the person.. but its worth thinking about.

JMR 12-03-13 10:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carleton (Post 16298928)
No.

LOL... you beat me to it!

JMR

Baby Puke 12-04-13 12:36 AM

Why is Quinn so quick when he does so much goddamn volume?

Dalai 12-04-13 06:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by queerpunk (Post 16297922)
What's the rep of Zipp 950 disc wheels for track use?

I have a converted Zipp Predator (The original Zipp disc) which I got for free :) and a Zipp 950 I used till a few years ago on my TT bike with an 8 speed screw on cluster I'll convert shortly. The disc is now permanently bolted on the bike which is raced a couple of days a week and the disc has been rock solid. I have heard concerns of the glue holding the hub to the disk failing but mine looks fine and holds up to my skinny enduro leg sprints...

Easy enough to convert to a solid axle. Either modify a Wheels Manufacturing part no:Axle-34 9.5*180mm 24 tpi or get a metal shop to turn a custom axle. My custom axle is 158mm long threaded 44mm one side and 33mm the other. Threads are 24 tpi. Although probably unnecessary I had a sleave cut to sit on the axle inside the disc to fit the internal space between the bearings. Unfortunately I didn't get a spare cut so can't provide the exact dimensions of this.

Bearings are easy to come by. Any R6 3/8" x 7/8" x 9/32" inch will fit. You can decide if ceramic is worth the trouble.

Top custom axle, bottom Wheels Manufacturing. They are the same diameter even the photo looks like they aren't.

http://i43.tinypic.com/dmtkyo.jpg

Looks bent but isn't...

http://i39.tinypic.com/rw49yc.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/1945yh.jpg

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMR (Post 16298387)
Vittoria Corsa Evo CX's are good for both road and track (not sure about on board tracks, but certainly concrete tracks). JMR

I use Vittoria Corsa Evo CX's on concrete and timber. Longer lasting than the pistas and still roll nicely...

Dalai 12-04-13 06:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by queerpunk (Post 16298361)
I can't tell when they stopped making it though; it would be practically free, so - investigating.

History Zipp discs... http://www.zipp.com/support/identify/discs.php

The non dimpled Zipp 900's appeared in 2002 to be then replaced with the Dimpled version 2007.

https://web.archive.org/web/20011214...els/index.html

carleton 12-04-13 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigfred (Post 16298676)
Next question; What are the odds on you morphing Bikeforums.net/track into what FGF used to be in the event of FGF's ultimate demise?

I just noticed that we have at least one more world-level athlete in our midst :D

usheen 12-04-13 03:09 PM

Should I get a 7710 or 7700 BB? I cant find much on them with a quick google other than basic info. Is there noticeable difference between the two? Are there any good videos for how to install and service them?

bigfred 12-04-13 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carleton (Post 16301128)
I just noticed that we have at least one more world-level athlete in our midst :D

Carleton, what are you on about?

carleton 12-04-13 03:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by usheen (Post 16301189)
Should I get a 7710 or 7700 BB? I cant find much on them with a quick google other than basic info. Is there noticeable difference between the two? Are there any good videos for how to install and service them?

BB-7700 is a needle bearing BB. Schematic. It must be serviced as regularly as any other non-sealed ball bearing system.

BB-7710 is the sealed version of the same BB. Schematic. You don't have to service it like you don the 7710. Basically "set it and forget it." The 7710 is Japanese NJS certified. The NJS Cert doesn't mean it's any better. It just means that it is legal for use in their league.

I've used both and I've found that the 7710 is simply easier to maintain. I don't think the small amount of decreased drag of the 7700 is worth having to remove it and service it.

In short, the difference is the same difference between any other Sealed vs Non-Sealed BB sytem on our bikes (wheel bearings, headset bearings, pedal bearings, etc...)

Both are pretty easy to install. You need that special tool in the schematic. You can get the tool from a good bike shop or Performance bike or REI. It's less than $10. Park makes one called the BBT-22

http://www.parktool.com/product/bott...et-tool-bbt-22

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigfred (Post 16301220)
Carleton, what are you on about?

Maybe he'll introduce himself.

bigfred 12-04-13 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carleton (Post 16301268)
Maybe he'll introduce himself.

Ah, now I understand.

FGF was great "because" it was literally littered with some world class talent and experience. Due to it's specificity, people knew what they were getting into there and, at least earlier in it's life, appropriate respect for that experience was generally shown.

I suspect there may be a bit more chaf with the wheat here in bikeforums.net. A couple things that would help immensely with sorting out which opinions to give more weight to is if individuals were comfortable giving up a bit more of their identity than an anonymous username and adding any palmares in their sig line.


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