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-   -   Sprinting Helmets (http://www.bikeforums.net/track-cycling-velodrome-racing-training-area/929255-sprinting-helmets.html)

brawlo 01-09-14 06:54 PM

Sprinting Helmets
 
Does anyone have any experience or know of people using the Kask Bambino helmet for sprinting?

I have been sitting on the sidelines for a new helmet, waiting for the Giro Air Attack to arrive on our shores, and it's still a work in progress, and now it seems that the Specialized Evade beats it for aero anyway.

At the last meet I went to, a junior was running around in the Kask and for the same reasons I was looking at the Giro, I could now be looking at the Kask. British cycling are using them in sprinting, so they definitely aren't bad, but how do they compare to the Casco as they seem to be in that playing field? The Kask is approved here, so could be used for other events on the track and road as well

wens 01-09-14 07:45 PM

Has anyone seen a comparison of the lg course, air attack, and evade under the same conditions? Wind tunnel on a manakin would be awesome, but I don't think I can track down all 3 to do field testing, so something to make reasonabe guesses from would be great.

brawlo 01-09-14 09:14 PM

Most of the info regarding comparisons of these helmets is among the triathlete community. The Specialized appears to be the winner here with the LG coming in second. Generally speaking, I think the Spec and LG are close enough that it comes down to personal fit/looks preference from what I've read. Not many seem to like the Giro helmet for some reason. There is mention of doing a head to head comparison that I can't find now, but was not anticipated to be done until this year.

Dalai 01-10-14 04:36 AM

Having seen for myself a CASCO perform worse for an individual than a MET Stradivarius, I would suggest the only right option is found after testing each helmet yourself...

jods 01-10-14 05:52 AM

1 Attachment(s)
The Kask Bambino, is basically the helmet British Cycling developed for the sprinting in Beijing. Once Team Sky got up and running they bought the design from BC and made it lighter and a more finished production product with the help of Kask.

http://bikeforums.net/attachment.php...hmentid=358951 here's Jason Kenny in the "Smurf Helmet" from Beijing

Hida Yanra 01-10-14 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dalai (Post 16398541)
I would suggest the only right option is found after testing each helmet yourself...

I would second this.

carleton 01-10-14 12:20 PM

I wonder how a $50 Skate helmet ranks among Sprint helmets in aero tests. I wish someone would put them in a wind tunnel.

I have a Casco Warp III ($300 USD) as well as a Pro-Tec Classic ($50 USD) skateboarding helmet. The profile is similar although the skate helmet didn't have an integrated visor.

One day I decided to weight the two. You won't believe what I discovered...they weighed the same. What's more is that the Casco (as with most bicycle helmets) is only rated to survive 1 crash. Skate helmets are rated to survive at least 3 crashes. The skate helmet has better ventilation :D

A buddy at DLV found a visor at a Triathlon shop and affixed it to his Nutcase skate helmet. It worked. Or you can simply wear your cycling glasses.

But, are they legal according to USA Cycling rules? YES. Many "skate" helmets meet or exceed CPSC Bike helmet standards and have "bike" certificates...which is all you need for USA Cycling approval. Not sure about UCI.

A skateboarding helmet is a poor man's (or smart man's) aero helmet. Plus you can get them in darn near any city in the world.

carleton 01-10-14 12:35 PM

Further:

Quote:

The "skateboard" helmets now on the market in big retail stores are almost all bicycle helmets in the classic old school skate style that Pro-Tec made popular decades ago. They have small vents, but their impact protection is designed for bike riding if the sticker inside only certifies that they meet the CPSC bike helmet standard. Most have better rear coverage than bike helmets do, and are more stable on the head because of that.
Quote:

Most Pro-tec helmets look exactly the same on the outside, so you must find the standards sticker inside and be very careful about the model you buy for bicycling.
http://www.bhsi.org/helmet14.htm

zizou 01-10-14 02:44 PM

Not sprint specific but a couple of new aero helmets will be getting released soon

Bontrager
http://cdn.media.cyclingnews.com/201..._front_670.jpg

POC
http://cdn.pocsports.com/images/6424/product_view.jpg

Kayce 01-10-14 04:03 PM

Every time I read about stickers I am reminded of a guy walking around the parking lot at Northbrook asking for a sticker for his Catlike.

I raced for my first couple of months with a skateboard helmet, really really hot under there. The super thick hard foam does not breath at all, and the tiny vents didn't do a thing.

carleton 01-10-14 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kayce (Post 16400127)
Every time I read about stickers I am reminded of a guy walking around the parking lot at Northbrook asking for a sticker for his Catlike.

I raced for my first couple of months with a skateboard helmet, really really hot under there. The super thick hard foam does not breath at all, and the tiny vents didn't do a thing.

The Casco is worse. It says in the documentation, "Recommended for events 1KM or shorter."

Impreza_aL 01-10-14 05:36 PM

i had a casco but sold it to fund some race wheels.

this will be my aero helmet for the year ;)

http://rcdn.roadbikereview.com/wp-co...16-650x700.jpg

Hida Yanra 01-10-14 05:50 PM

[QUOTE=carleton;16399564]I wonder how a $50 Skate helmet ranks among Sprint helmets in aero tests. I wish someone would put them in a wind tunnel./QUOTE]

Wind tunnel won't do much for sprint helmets as the head position changes too much to get "clean" data- too many things moving around.

An ERO setup could probably do it, but roll down/Aerolab/tunnel set ups? Probably not.

that said, a round skate lid might test well-trick it to test it, I come out differently than several teammates who ride similar-ish positions, helmets seem to be the most individual bits of gear.

Hida Yanra 01-10-14 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zizou (Post 16399957)
Not sprint specific but a couple of new aero helmets will be getting released soon

Bontrager


POC

Also catlike

Brian Ratliff 01-10-14 06:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carleton (Post 16400266)
The Casco is worse. It says in the documentation, "Recommended for events 1KM or shorter."

It's really not that bad. More of a German CYA thing than any real warning. Anything without vents is going to be worse than helmets with vents. Even the new Giro air attack helmet is pretty hot compared to a standard road helmet. Just because the helmet's north of $200 doesn't mean you get to cheat physics, no matter what the marketing copy says.

Dalai 01-10-14 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carleton (Post 16399564)
A buddy at DLV found a visor at a Triathlon shop and affixed it to his Nutcase skate helmet. It worked.

But, are they legal according to USA Cycling rules? YES. Many "skate" helmets meet or exceed CPSC Bike helmet standards and have "bike" certificates...which is all you need for USA Cycling approval. Not sure about UCI.

Attaching a non standard visor (any helmet mods including stickers) is not allowed by the UCI.

carleton 01-10-14 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Ratliff (Post 16400441)
It's really not that bad. More of a German CYA thing than any real warning. Anything without vents is going to be worse than helmets with vents. Even the new Giro air attack helmet is pretty hot compared to a standard road helmet. Just because the helmet's north of $200 doesn't mean you get to cheat physics, no matter what the marketing copy says.

I wore a Casco in Atlanta in the summer...it was that bad :D

I would try to push it up or remove it entirely as I entered the cool down circle!

carleton 01-10-14 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dalai (Post 16400611)
Attaching a non standard visor (any helmet mods including stickers) is not allowed by the UCI.

Very true.

VanceMac 01-10-14 08:45 PM

Casco is just a terrible helmet. It's wicked hot (my Air Attack is practically air conditioned by comparison). It has very limited practical use, especially for a non-sprinter like me. It is overpriced. And some aspects of the build quality are quite suspect (I treat the visor attachment like it's made of tissue paper). But I love it. :)

Although the aerodynamic limitations of a sphere are well known, I don't think that is necessarily a disadvantage for short, chaotic efforts like match sprint and flying 200m, because:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hida Yanra (Post 16400348)
Wind tunnel won't do much for sprint helmets as the head position changes too much to get "clean" data- too many things moving around.

Theo Bos during flying 200m:


In this position, I would guess* the Casco would compare favorably with just about anything. I suspect the Kask Bambino might be the best compromise... wish they weren't so expensive.

(*Of course, aerodynamics are notorious for often being counter-intuitive. And, unfortunately, the only extensive testing I've seen on helmets has been done in the stable tri/tt position. With the current trend of aero road helmets, hopefully that will change.)

Hida Yanra 01-12-14 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VanceMac (Post 16400710)
Theo Bos during flying 200m:

well just bring in complete outliers and freaks why dontcha ;)
Non-elites that can remain that still while generating torque during a flying 200 don't need our help.

VanceMac 01-12-14 01:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hida Yanra (Post 16404419)
well just bring in complete outliers and freaks why dontcha ;)
Non-elites that can remain that still while generating torque during a flying 200 don't need our help.

Just to be clear, I was agreeing with you. His head did not stay still during that effort (that's a youtube screen shot).

JMR 01-12-14 07:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carleton (Post 16400266)
The Casco is worse. It says in the documentation, "Recommended for events 1KM or shorter."

What about keirin? :)

JMR

brawlo 01-19-14 06:05 PM

Wow, it seems I fell off the grid for the last week. I went on holidays and the internet was comparable to the old dial up speeds, so no internetting for me.

I was hoping to get a look at the kask through my local as he had some on the shelf. It seems that they're old stock however as he doesn't deal with that importer any more, so I will have to travel to get a try at one.

The problem for us is the Casco has no Aust standard certification and can therefore only be used on the track in certain events. The kask however appears to be comparable but with it's certification is far more flexible for use elsewhere.

Thanks for your input.

Jaytron 01-22-14 01:35 PM

Wait, I only bought my Casco cause it looks badass. Woops.



It makes me feel like I'm Maverick in Top Gun. Whenever I put it on, "Danger zone" plays in my head and it motivates me to go faster. Therefore, it is the best helmet choice. Science.


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