VanceMac

That's 3x longer than I've ever made it...

Baby Puke

Haha! I'm usually done in half that, the only reason I'd last an hour is if I add in longer rest periods.

carleton

Confession: I have inquired about a ridiculously expensive frame that I do not need.

Baby Puke

Ok, spill the details!

carleton

Well...

I have adopted a much different bike fit over the past year. Between getting better flexibility, better leg/belly clearance, I'm laying down flatter and extending arms further. This is MUCH longer reach than I've used in the past. When I use a 130mm stem and the long reach EC90 bars I still don't have the reach my new position requires. I'm already exceeding the "bars can't be further than 5cm in front of the front axle" rule. The end result is that I need a 60cm TT. My Tiemyer is 58cm with a Reach of 438mm.

Mr. Tiemeyer has retired, otherwise I'd ask him to make me another.

There are only a few middle to high-end track frames that come in a true 60cm that would offer significantly more than 438mm of reach. (Learning about Stack and Reach has been amazing for me, BTW). For example, the "61cm" Felt TK2's reach is 438mm...the same as my 58cm Tiemeyer, which is the same as the 59cm Dolan DF3.

The frames with longer Reach are:

- Hoy Fiorenzuola
- Fuji Track Elite
- Felt TK1

Concerns:

Hoy Fiorenzuola: It's an entry level frame. I'm a heavy guy that stress frames a lot during standing starts. Hoy says that it can withstand his starts...but he's selling bikes now I can't find any reviews yet.

Fuji Track Elite: It uses the Ritchey Seat Mast Topper using a 1-bolt seat rail binder that has been known to allow the saddle slip and tilt, even under moderate weight roadies. It uses a proprietary carbon seatpost that may slip. That's a deal breaker. I'm going to pass on this one.

Felt TK1: It uses proprietary seatpost, but it's a dead-stop post that you have to cut to measure. Also, the 3T seat binder is indexed, so no tilting. But, you can add shims to stack it back up. It has a 40mm offset fork (was sluggish to me). That is not a deal breaker.

So, it's down to two:
- Hoy Fiorenzuola
- Felt TK1


Am I missing any other 60cm bikes?

Quinn8it

Fit wins!

id go high end steel...
https://mothattack.com/

Hida Yanra

I dunno how soon you are wanting the new bike, but you could talk to JTW- I bet he'd build you one of those homegrown "beefy bikes" around an Alpina Wing Pista (30mm rake)
He could give you the front.center & wheelbase you want while are at it (since I *know* you have opinions about those)

Or, I hear Stoemper is making bikes these days? (you gotta like rad paint schemes tho)

AlexTaylor

Hoy was at my local track trying the bike out before it was released with two coaches from the track. He was absolutely giving it full gas. He said to them he wouldn't sell it if it wasn't up to his standard...

Baby Puke

YAMAGUCHI, kudasai!

brawlo

I'm going to be keeping an eye on this development Carleton.

Since JS has stopped making his Alien frames, I have often wondered what I would do if mine broke or I wanted to upgrade. Seeing as it's a 61cmTT, there aren't many directions to go from here besides custom. My sprint setup already uses a 140mm stem on the bike. The next best opportunity would be 60cmTT, so I'm interested. Also because of your stance with seatposts, I'm interested.

Is there any particular reason for not looking at the Serenity? I know you've had issues in the past with the seat posts, but there's not many around here, let alone under anyone other than a middleweight, so not much genuinely similar experience to draw on. I'm happy with my seat mast, so I was interested in the Serenity seat mast option.

Although a TK1 would be nice, it's not listed on the Australian Felt site at all, only the 2/3.

carleton

I totally agree. It doesn't have to be carbon.

When I had the TK1 before, I bought it new. The saddle kept dipping on me. I later found out that this was a known issue that lighter riders experienced, too. I imagine that's why they switched from the Ritchey seat mast topper to the 3T. But, I sold the TK1 at a slight loss and took the funds and bought a new Tiemeyer.

Moth Attack looks great. The "Mothra" is priced at $2,600.



I priced another similar "sprinter-friendly" steel bike at just under $3,000. Those make my $1,500-ish Tiemeyer seem like a steal.

Who is "JTW"?

Yes. I have LOTS of opinions!

That is great to hear! At $1,000 ($1,250 shipped to the US) for a complete bike, that's an amazing value. Who needs aero tubes?

I actually looked at those.

carleton

I've seen too many people have issues with the one-bolt saddle clamp systems and proprietary seatposts that can slip. So, I categorically reject them.

The only reason I'm considering the TK1 is because the "difflock" system is splinded and indexed. So, in order to tilt it, you have to remove the guts, tilt, then re-install the guts.


I still think that a 27.2 Thomson is the best seatpost ever. This is why the Hoy is on the list and the Fuji and Serenity are not. It kills me to see bike manufacturers fix something that isn't broken.

Brian Ratliff

Carleton, if you are considering custom steel, check out Ti Cycles. Some of the sprinters at the Alpenrose really like his frames.

carleton

Yeah, that's the one that was quoted to be "Just under 3 grand." for one that would suit me. That's a lot for a steel bike that won't have the same resale value (speaking of percentage of initial cost) as one of the others mentioned above.

Hida Yanra

sorry, FTW- finger slip.
(Frank the Welder)

Brian Ratliff

Man, that "difflock" system looks over-complicated. And even though it has that fancy double splined thing to make the pitch finer, at the end of the day, it's still splined. Notice in their video, the saddle went from nose low to very slightly nose-high. IMHO, there are several ways of making solid one and two bolt systems and with the difflock it seems like the engineers all went on a bender and picked the most complicated system possible just to be different. I'm sure it works fine, but damn, they chose a complicated route to get there.

My new Dolan came with a two bolt system very similar to the Thomson and it is solid. I agree with you, the Thomson style clamp is the most fundamentally sound seatclamp you can find. Forces in all directions are taken up by bolts in tension (as opposed to splines or *gulp* friction), just as god intended.

Brian Ratliff

As I was writing that, I was wondering if you hadn't already talked to them. Oh well. There's a reason I didn't go this route either...

FWIW, my Dolan looks solid. I'm pretty certain the seatpost won't be slipping on me (good seatpost fit and well-designed clamp).

Baby Puke

I actually looked at those.[/QUOTE]

...and then you bought one? Yamaguchi is a not-so-secret lust of mine. Probably also not cheap.

carleton

Why is their website soooo dated?
https://www.yamaguchibike.com/content/Frames/Track

But the prices are from the future:

carleton

By the way, the award for the Least Informative Bike Website goes to BT.


https://www.biketechnologies.com/inde...d=54&Itemid=60

It only has like 10 detailed pics of the frame and the only info offered:

It's been that way since 2009. No price (sorta important), no specs, no size options, no angles, no geometry, no marketing jargon. Oh and what if I want to buy one? Sorry. Ask Santa. Maybe he'll bring you one because the website won't tell you how to get one.

VanceMac

Intentional, no? My impression is that they don't want to sell to consumers, they only go through the motions to satisfy UCI (or Olympic?) requirements?

carleton

Really? Ha.

Why do so many show up on the local/masters scene in Australia and whatnot? It looks like they are just as popular as US company high-end bikes are in the US (Felt TK1, Serenity, etc...)

(Don't give us Masters crap for spending lots on bikes when we are slow as molassas. That money helps the bike companies )

carleton

Update on the bike:

Living in Portland is awesome. I just talked to a local frame builder and I'm meeting him after work. His ballpark prices are reasonable.

Baby Puke

Dude, contact BT and see what the deal is. That is my #1 dream bike. I can live vicariously through you.

Quinn8it

If i had normal dimensions- instead of being built like Pan,

Id just ride an EAI Bare Knuckle..

all you need is a stiff- strong bike that isn't a total anchor and it HAS TO FIT!

save your money for other stuff..