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  1. #1
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    Weird lactic acid thingy

    I am 18 years old and my max heart rate is just under 200. I can get up to 90%, give or take, and sustain it for the majority of a race (my races are like 35 minutes or so). I can also get up to around 95% of my max for shorter amounts of time (3 or 4 minutes) before having to ease off or blowing up. When i sprint, i normally come withing 2 or 3 beats of that tested max heart rate. Now, here's the thing. When i sprint or do these super hard efforts that get my heart rate so high, i almost never feel any lactic acid. My legs will fatigue and tire out, or i will blow up and not be able to keep going, and i can push myself to throwing up with ease (i normally don't for obvious reasons, but i can normally do so in a sprint at the end of a race or something if need be) but i never get any form of burn that is associated with lactic acid production and aneroabic exercise. I'll be the first to admit that i don't know much about lactic acid production from a sports point of view (i know some about it on a celluelar level from bio.), so i was wondering, without having an actual LT test, does it sound like i have a naturally high lactic acid tolerance, or do different people have different reactions to lactic acid, or am i so out of shape that i actually give out and get sick before reaching my LT? I know an LT test is the only way to actually determine this, and one day, i will probablly have that and a VO2 max test done, but i was just wondering af any of the more knowledgeable people on this board had any input based on what i describe. thanks

  2. #2
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    If you could maintain 90% of your heart rate max for 35 minutes and 95% for 3 too 4 minutes, I would suggest you go out for a team on the Tour de France.

    Who tested you?

    If your legs are fatiguing and tiring out, that's lactic acid. If you're blowing up, that's lactic acid.

    I would say that you need to find a professional lab where you can get professionally tested so you can find out what your lactate threshold is for real. It sounds like you're serious about it, but if you're training at too low a heart rate, you won't be able to really be effective during your races.

    Koffee

  3. #3
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    my PT/team mate did the test. Let me say though, my performances at those levels are not too impressive. My power output is very weak relative to most riders at that level. i would be happy to describe the test if you think that would help. Also, i guess that just means that different people have different responses to lactic acid, and that's probablly the cause for the lack of burning (assuming the test got accurate results), right?

  4. #4
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    If your personal trainer did the test, what methodology did he use? My thoughts are that it's WAAAAAAY off.

    I posted a 2 X 20 anaerobic threshold test, but I would still say it's better to be tested... let them take blood from you and monitor heart rate as they increase workload over time. Now that's accurate.

    The more off you are, the less accurately you're able to train, and when you race, you'll never be at optimal training.

    Koffee

  5. #5
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    well, the test started with my bike on a fluid trainer with a fan. We hooked up a powertap to the rear so we could see my cadence, wattage, and speed. We started off at 10 mph in whatever gear i chose at whatever cadence i chose. I kept it at that rate for 2 minutes, and then increased my speed 2 mph. i continued to make these increases at the 2 minute/2 mile per hour interval for as long as possible, keeping my speed constant for those two minutes. When i felt i could no longer sustain the speed for two minutes based on my legs giving out and getting that light headed tingly feeling, i got out of the saddle, shifted down 2 gears or so, and sprinted for 15 to 20 seconds. Like i said i got sick afterwards, so i am confident that i pushed my self as hard as i possibly could. The test was supposed to get my max attainable heart rate, and the training schedule was based off of that. I am headed to a college with a med school next year, so i was wondering if any of them offer this sort of testing and how much it usually costs.

  6. #6
    Senior Member skydive69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by koffee brown
    If you could maintain 90% of your heart rate max for 35 minutes and 95% for 3 too 4 minutes, I would suggest you go out for a team on the Tour de France.

    Who tested you?

    If your legs are fatiguing and tiring out, that's lactic acid. If you're blowing up, that's lactic acid.

    I would say that you need to find a professional lab where you can get professionally tested so you can find out what your lactate threshold is for real. It sounds like you're serious about it, but if you're training at too low a heart rate, you won't be able to really be effective during your races.

    Koffee
    I see nothing unusual about those numbers. In my last 10K TT, I averaged 97% of my maximum heart rate. It was incredibly painful, but the effort remains the best age group time in the nation for 2005. I, BTW, wouldn't be worthy of cleaning the drive train of the worst guy in the TDF!
    www.brokennecktobrokenrecords.com

  7. #7
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    Perhaps for a 10k time trial for a few minutes, but not for 35 continuous minutes....

    What dood did describe sounds like a 2 X 20 anaerobic threshold test with a powertap attached to the wheel.

    Get to a performance lab. Let them do the test. Without a lactate test, how do you know when you've gotten to your lactate threshold? Estimation just doesn't do one justice if they plan to race.

    Koffee

  8. #8
    bzzzz fuzzthebee's Avatar
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    I also see nothing wrong with those numbers. I did a 1 hr race last weekend and my average heart rate was 90% of my maximum. The important factor is the power your putting out at that effort. TDF=400+watts (i'm guessing)
    Average Joe=200-300 watts (still guessing)
    Heart rate alone is insignificant.

  9. #9
    Senior Member skydive69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fuzzthebee
    I also see nothing wrong with those numbers. I did a 1 hr race last weekend and my average heart rate was 90% of my maximum. The important factor is the power your putting out at that effort. TDF=400+watts (i'm guessing)
    Average Joe=200-300 watts (still guessing)
    Heart rate alone is insignificant.
    What average heart rate does seem to directly correlate to his pain! The higher you average over 90, the more intense the pain. Races, particularly my favorite, time trials, often come down to who is willing and able to withstand the most pain. I would rather die than lose!
    www.brokennecktobrokenrecords.com

  10. #10
    Climbing Fool terrymorse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by koffee brown
    Without a lactate test, how do you know when you've gotten to your lactate threshold? Estimation just doesn't do one justice if they plan to race.
    There is a growing belief out there that knowing your lactate threshold with blood testing is not that important. What is important, the argument goes, is how much power you can put out. These power advocates use the term "functional threshold" to instead identify how much power you can sustain over an extended time period:

    "At least in theory, the most precise way of determining an athlete's power at LT would be to rely on laboratory-based testing with invasive blood sampling. Very few individuals, however, have access to such measurements on a routine basis. Furthermore, while LT is often defined by sports scientists as the initial non-linear increase in lactate with increasing exercise intensity, this intensity tends to be significantly below that which coaches and athletes tend to associate, on the basis of practical experience, with the concept of a "threshold" exercise intensity. Thus, probably the easiest and most direct way of estimating a rider's functional threshold power is to simply rely on data collected in the field using a power meter."
    http://www.cyclingpeakssoftware.com/levels.html

    Threshold power: what is it, why is it important, and how do I measure it?
    http://www.cyclingpeakssoftware.com/threshold.html
    Managing Director, Undiscovered Country Tours

  11. #11
    bzzzz fuzzthebee's Avatar
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    This 2x20 test seems more like a "functional threshold" test, as the results would likely be way higher than blood test results. It may be better to base training zones on "functional threshold" rather than max heart rate (when using a heart rate monitor to gauge intensity) because FT will vary depending on fitness throughout the year, and it is important to adjust training zones accordingly.

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