Cycling and bicycle discussion forums. 
   Click here to join our community Log in to access your Control Panel  


Go Back   > >

Training & Nutrition Learn how to develop a training schedule that's good for you. What should you eat and drink on your ride? Learn everything you need to know about training and nutrition here.

User Tag List

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 09-29-05, 02:54 PM   #1
trekkie820
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Cleveland, OH
Bikes: 2004 Trek 4600, 1980's Univega Supra Sport, 2006 Lemond Reno
Posts: 2,287
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Running for training?

I have a race coming up, a singlespeed mountain bike race. I have a problem. I do not have a bike to ride roads, and the closest trails are 90 miles away. So, I have been running about 3 miles a day to compensate. Will this be enough to ride the race?
trekkie820 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-05, 03:09 PM   #2
Az B
Fattest Thin Man
 
Az B's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Directly above the center of the earth
Bikes: Miyata 610, Vinco V, Rocky Mountain Element
Posts: 2,649
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
See the nearby thread about gym training. Same thing applies.

Az
Az B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-05, 03:14 PM   #3
trekkie820
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Cleveland, OH
Bikes: 2004 Trek 4600, 1980's Univega Supra Sport, 2006 Lemond Reno
Posts: 2,287
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Edit: That is talking about weight lifting, an anaerobic activity. I am talking about running, an areobic activity.
trekkie820 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-05, 07:05 PM   #4
Az B
Fattest Thin Man
 
Az B's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Directly above the center of the earth
Bikes: Miyata 610, Vinco V, Rocky Mountain Element
Posts: 2,649
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Same principle. Running is not riding. While running will help your cardio, it won't make you much faster on a bike, if at all. (Depends on your current cardio ability)

A little cross training is a great thing for a balanced athletic body. But if you want to train for riding, you need to ride.

Az
Az B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-05, 07:22 PM   #5
kuan
Twincities MN
 
kuan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Salsa, Cannondale, Surly.
Bikes:
Posts: 2,527
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I would just use the bike on roads real hard. Do sprints and intervals for as long as the duration of the race. You afraid of wearing down your tires? Do the three mile runs for your recovery really slow, not more than 65% HR or around shuffle pace if you're not a runner... somewhere around 11-12 minute miles.
__________________
www.marrow.org
kuan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-29-05, 10:39 PM   #6
rmwun54
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 898
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Different muscles when running, than cycling, so best off riding around the blocks 50 times doing intervals. On a bike leg muscles are pushing and pulling in a dynamic fashion, that which running does not do in terms of muscular performance.
rmwun54 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-05, 04:07 PM   #7
trekkie820
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Cleveland, OH
Bikes: 2004 Trek 4600, 1980's Univega Supra Sport, 2006 Lemond Reno
Posts: 2,287
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Hell with it. I don't have the time to rack up serious saddle miles. I am just going to work on endurance running (3 miles+) in hopes of maintaining my current shape.
trekkie820 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-05, 05:15 PM   #8
jrennie
Race to train
 
jrennie's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: suffering on the back
Bikes:
Posts: 3,115
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
how long is the race? 3 miles is not endurance running, more of a sprint(20-25 min.) I dont think that would prepair you for a long mtn. bike race, also it is very different muscle groups used.
jrennie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-05, 06:16 PM   #9
trekkie820
Senior Member
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Cleveland, OH
Bikes: 2004 Trek 4600, 1980's Univega Supra Sport, 2006 Lemond Reno
Posts: 2,287
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Ah well. The race is informal, and it is over 17.5 miles. I can do the course hungover in just under 2 hours. I just want to race for fun, there are no prizes.
trekkie820 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-05, 11:00 AM   #10
watchman
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Asheville, NC
Bikes: 2001 Litespeed Vortex - Shimano Ultegra, Jamis Dakar XC- Shimano XT, Diamond Back Axis TT- rigid with drop bars and bar end shifters
Posts: 262
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Run helps biking more than biking helps running I have found. That said, only running 3 miles at a time isn't going to help much. I have found that running very steep hills is good training for cycling since it uses mainly your quadracepts and to a small degree replicates cycling motions, but that is only on very steep terrain. If you can find some moderate hills, you may want to look into doing some long interval repeats, at the very least it will help your body increase its ability to deal with lactic acid buildup, I'm guessing a single speed race would produce alot of lactic acid.
watchman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-07-05, 12:56 PM   #11
fastequalsfun
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 68
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Hey trekkie820.

My advice to you (from someone who races both running and cycling) is to build up to more than 3 miles per day. Running is great for cardio, because unlike being on the bike, there's no way to rest. Even on downhills, there's no way to "coast" while you run. So for maximum cardio benefit, try running a little bit longer each week to build up that high-intensity cardio, over a longer period of time.

Also, running tends to have a slower leg cadence with a lower range of motion than cycling. To compensate, try throwing in a little interval training. It doesn't take much, maybe one day a week of sprinting for 100 yards, then jogging for 300 yards, 4 or 5 times. Concentrate on developing fast leg turnover.

Also, to keep your "biking" leg muscles strong, add a day a week of hilly terrain. This forces you to use more quads, less hamstrings, thereby strengthening more of the muscles you'd use for riding.

There's no substitute for saddle time, but if you plan your running workouts, you'll be fine.
fastequalsfun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-05, 11:17 PM   #12
psurrena
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Brooklyn, NY
Bikes: Nashbar carbon frame - Force 22
Posts: 15
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Hindu squats and hindu pushups are great!
psurrena is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-12-05, 01:14 PM   #13
DRLski
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Derry, NH
Bikes:
Posts: 1,608
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I heard the more running done the slower you are on the bike, read this from a triathlon book or something.
DRLski is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-05, 08:36 PM   #14
DannoXYZ 
Senior Member
 
DannoXYZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Saratoga, CA
Bikes:
Posts: 11,606
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
This is because running only uses about 1/3rd of the muscles used during biking. And you do stress the muscles that are used more than you would during biking. So some biking muscles gets stronger while others get no training. So with running, you may be training the cardiovascular system, but you're sacrificing development of the muscular system. Depending upon the distance of his MTB race, he may need to do endurance workout as well, and it's really difficult to burn off 3000 calories by running...

I actually think running sprints is great training for biking-sprints. But it's in addition to the 1 day/week of bike-sprints, not a substitute for it.
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-15-05, 11:11 PM   #15
operator
cab horn
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Toronto
Bikes: 1987 Bianchi Campione
Posts: 28,306
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I'd run anwyays.
There have been stuides that show that cylists lose more bone mass than couch potatoes. High impact exercise is good for you.
Now whether or not these studies are actually ture is another thing but, running is aerobic exercise so it's good.
operator is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-21-05, 09:07 PM   #16
popluhv
Doortrapper
 
popluhv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Syracuse, NY
Bikes:
Posts: 892
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
At what point will running cause me to lose muscle tissue?
popluhv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-05, 05:47 AM   #17
jjsinglespeed
Senior Member
 
jjsinglespeed's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Bikes:
Posts: 138
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Well you have to throw a lot of advise out the window when it comes to single speed riding.
Back in my racing days I would often park my bike on the trail and run sprints up steep hills.Look at how much standing you do on a S/S.. I highly reccomend trail running,intervals and high rep deadlifts
Good Luck--JJ
jjsinglespeed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-05, 09:52 AM   #18
Phatman
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: NC
Bikes:
Posts: 3,411
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
running is better than nothing, but not better than cycling to improve cycling performance.
Phatman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-05, 10:05 AM   #19
SandySwimmer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Bikes: Trek 1000c
Posts: 384
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Running is one of the most efficient ways to lose weight in a short time. If you happen to have extra storage, lsoing it through running and diet will make you faster on the bike . . . at least on the uphills. But it seems the only way to train for a sport is to do the actual sport.
SandySwimmer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-05, 10:24 AM   #20
StanSeven
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Delaware shore
Bikes: Cervelo C3, Guru Photon, Waterford, Specialized CX
Posts: 11,997
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 162 Post(s)
As others have said, running doesn't provide the same type of training. But if you can't ride, I would find hills and do hillwork. Running on trails is the best. Mix it up doing things like 100-200 yard up-hill sprints and jog back down. If you have a long hill, try starting out slow and gradually pick up your pace.

I would also try some fast downhill running. It takes practice but go fast, don't try and "brake" by leaning back and let your heels hit first but lean forward so your back is perpendicular to the ground and "throw" yourself down the hill.

What you should try to do is simulate as much as you can on the bike ride.
StanSeven is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-05, 01:30 PM   #21
popluhv
Doortrapper
 
popluhv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Syracuse, NY
Bikes:
Posts: 892
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Aerobics is my weak point. I am just wondering if running will be counter productive, there are some posts about muscle tissue being used up for energy in longer races. i know I could go to a gym and spin, but i'd prefer to be lifting during my time at the gym. Spining is just so boring, and still not quite as aerobic as running. I will use the advise to run up hills though.
popluhv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-05, 02:07 PM   #22
Doctor Who
Lotion/Basket/Hose
 
Doctor Who's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Chicago
Bikes: 1992 Schwinn Paramount
Posts: 1,368
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I've been running to keep myself sane and fit while the days are shorter and the weather crappier. Certainly, I could get on the turbo, but it's so mind-numbing, that I find myself avoiding it like the plague. I have noticed that with an intensive running regimen, I am at a lower weight than I was during the height of the cycling racing season.

Funny.

I got out and did hill repeats on the bike a few days ago because the temperature finally decided to get out of the 20s. I definitely felt like I had lost a little cycling fitness since I stopped riding/training for the CX season. I was riding my Redline with the CX tires on, on the road, so I think that had something to do with my perceived slowness, but it could also be due to the fact that I'm down to 5 hours a week on the bike, as opposed to the 15-20 I was doing when the weather was nicer.

But to get to the point of this post - you're gonna have to ride your bike to maintain cycling fitness and see improvement ON the bike. Run if need be to stay in shape, but ride if you want to be a better rider.
Doctor Who is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-05, 03:04 PM   #23
Mo'Phat
Scum, Freezebag!
 
Mo'Phat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Poway, CA
Bikes: 2007 Leader 796R w/ 10sp DA and 2005 Jamis Dakar XLT FS MTB
Posts: 4,546
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Doing ANYTHING for an extended period of time can only help. If nothing more than to stretch your muscles and loosen the joints. A 3 mile run is just fine, but if you're doing it in 45 minutes, you might as well just walk. Get yourself down to a 24-26 minute pace (8 - 8:30 min miles) and you are actually getting a fairly strong (if short) cardio and anerobic workout. If your runs have to be short due to lack of time, make sure you run hills, mix in some sprints, and focus on form. I'd really try to push for a solid hour of running (7-8 miles). Really work on your breathing/lung capacity and use the opportunity to push your body to recognize your limits.
Mo'Phat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-22-05, 08:12 PM   #24
akarius
~
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Bikes:
Posts: 162
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I found that jogging has helped me on my bike immensely. Running taught me to breathe properly and made it so I can push harder and longer while on the bike.
akarius is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:09 PM.