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  1. #1
    Born To Ride Fast NextLevelMentor's Avatar
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    Why Do We Really Get Diabetes as Cyclist?

    A lot is written about treating diabetes but nothing is spoken about it's true cause. I came from a family tree riddled with diabetes and being a lifetime cyclist who has racked up over 750,000 miles so far in my life I've studied diabetes and other symptoms for decades.

    What I've come to learn is that in cultures where athletisism and eating close to nature and eating a variety of foods that are high in micro and macro nutrients there is little if any diabetes.

    I myself began to show signs of heading towards the pathology of diabetes when at one time I began to not ride as much as was peak for me in my 20's only to find my narrow dietary patterns hid and addiction piling on long hours in the saddle in an attempt not notice the huge nutrient deficit I lived with.

    As I realized that my diet was truly deficient I set out on a search for clues as to what was actually missing and how to fill in the defeciancies without becoming obsessed with food and supplementation.

    I can confidently say that not only have I eliminated all traced of being pre diabetic but have helped a ton of others identify their own defeciency patterns and find readily available solutions to balance their health enough to in most cases eliminate artificial insulin use.

    For more dialogue about this feel free to contact me at NextLevelMentor at aol dot com
    Erskien Lenier
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    I beleive you can definitly put off type 2 diabetes by eating right and keeping fit. Most of the type 2 diabetics and I did say most, are overweight and their diet is horrible at best. They do not take care of themselves nor do they care. I was hit with type 1 at the age of 11. I had no family history what so ever. Could I have prevented this, I doubt it. From what I read I would have to have a so called defective gene and a virus tripped it off and wiped out the cells that produce insulin. I did not have much of a choice. I was very active as a kid and was never over weight and ate very well. So yes I think you can prevent most type 2 diabetes but type 1 is a different story.

  3. #3
    Senior Member slim_77's Avatar
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    Right, Gordonm.

    By and large once it is in your family there tends to be a disposition to acquire both forms.

    Type 1 Diabetes is either inherited or acquired through genetic "accident" (I am intentionally being vague on this last point). Both my younger brother and I became Type 1 at age 12. This is ironic because in normal patterns of diabetes distribution it is extremely rare for two members in the same generation to acquire it. In fact, it usually skips a generation. I have heard--rumor mind you!--that there have been elevated rates of type 1 diabetes in the children of Vietnam vets. My youger brother and I, for example. Some believe that these cases may be the result of traces of Agent Orange or other dioxins. There have been studies done regarding Type 2 Diabetes and Agent Orange ( see this article ) but a great deal more is simply unknown. As a case in point, just compare the treatment now with 10 or 20 years ago!

    Keep up the good work with the mentoring and educating!
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  4. #4
    Banned Bikepacker67's Avatar
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    racked up over 750,000 miles
    That's 30 mile a day, EVERY SINGLE DAY, for 70 years.

  5. #5
    GiantRdr
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    Type1 Diabetes = an autoimmune disorder

    Type 2 = is beleived to be inhereted. You cannot "catch" diabetes.

  6. #6
    Born To Ride Fast NextLevelMentor's Avatar
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    750k miles and rolling on....

    Try training and racing at over 500 miles a week for over 23 yrs + being a Century Monster since the age of 12 yrs old! Not 70..... I'm 49 heading for 50.... and still dropping 20 somethings who know no humility....
    Erskien Lenier
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  7. #7
    Born To Ride Fast NextLevelMentor's Avatar
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    Have any of you with type 1 looked into the latest research whereby they have successfully used stem cells to create the pancreatic cells that produce insulin and injected it successfully into trial subjects with productive results? Try googling this area... I hope this comes available for folks like you... That would be a huge blessing and restore your lives to full capacity...
    Erskien Lenier
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    http://www.LiveJohn1010.com

  8. #8
    Faster but still slow slowandsteady's Avatar
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    A lot is written about treating diabetes but nothing is spoken about it's true cause.
    Uh, not true. Diabetes is well understood. I work in biotech, and we can make a mouse diabetic by just putting them on a diet consisting of 60% calories from fat. In 16 weeks 100% of the mice are obese and 80% are diabetic(fasting glucose of >120). Not all strains of mice will become diabetic with this diet, but the C57Bl/6 strain is predisposed to diet induced diabetes. Most people become diabetic by this same mechanism. Genetic predisposition + obesity = diabetes.

    If these mice are returned to regular chow the diabetes is reversed. The same can be true of people. Fat, especially visceral fat, is not benign. It is in many ways an organ. Fat in excess creates hormones such as estrogen, adiponectin, resitin, etc... It is these hormones unbalanced or in excess that cause the destruction of beta islet cells in the pancreas as well as insulin resistance.
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  9. #9
    Faster but still slow slowandsteady's Avatar
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    Type1 Diabetes = an autoimmune disorder

    Type 2 = is beleived to be inhereted. You cannot "catch" diabetes.
    Boy, with that expertise you should quit your day job. We have an opening in our metabolics research group...wanna apply?
    "Ride lots." -- Eddy Merckx

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by NextLevelMentor
    Try training and racing at over 500 miles a week for over 23 yrs + being a Century Monster since the age of 12 yrs old! Not 70..... I'm 49 heading for 50.... and still dropping 20 somethings who know no humility....
    You gotta like that-hats off to ya, at 55 I love dropping the young ones(even if they are 45).

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    Quote Originally Posted by slowandsteady
    Uh, not true. Diabetes is well understood. I work in biotech, and we can make a mouse diabetic by just putting them on a diet consisting of 60% calories from fat. In 16 weeks 100% of the mice are obese and 80% are diabetic(fasting glucose of >120). Not all strains of mice will become diabetic with this diet, but the C57Bl/6 strain is predisposed to diet induced diabetes. Most people become diabetic by this same mechanism. Genetic predisposition + obesity = diabetes.

    If these mice are returned to regular chow the diabetes is reversed. The same can be true of people. Fat, especially visceral fat, is not benign. It is in many ways an organ. Fat in excess creates hormones such as estrogen, adiponectin, resitin, etc... It is these hormones unbalanced or in excess that cause the destruction of beta islet cells in the pancreas as well as insulin resistance.
    I agree with you 100% for a type 2 diabetic. This is not true for a type 1. Being a type 1 I always get asked you are not overweight why do you have diabetes. I hate being grouped together with type 2. The 2 are toatlly different.

  12. #12
    Riding Heaven's Highways on the grand tour ModoVincere's Avatar
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    There's about 15-20% of us type 2's that are not obese. I've never been obese, I have been over weight with a BMI as high as 28.5, but never obese. My diet has always been reasonably healthy and well balanced. Lack of exercise has never been an issue. Type 2 runs in my family, with myself and both sisters having it. My father has type 2 as well, and my mother suffers from hypoglycemia (blood glucose that runs too low). Obviously, genetics plays a major role in both forms of this disease, and its not all about high fat diets or being overweight.
    And we don't know as much about this disease as some would like everyone to think. There are a lot of questions still remaining resolved.
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  13. #13
    Semper Fidelis
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    Quote Originally Posted by slim_77
    Right, Gordonm.

    By and large once it is in your family there tends to be a disposition to acquire both forms.

    Type 1 Diabetes is either inherited or acquired through genetic "accident" (I am intentionally being vague on this last point). Both my younger brother and I became Type 1 at age 12. This is ironic because in normal patterns of diabetes distribution it is extremely rare for two members in the same generation to acquire it. In fact, it usually skips a generation. I have heard--rumor mind you!--that there have been elevated rates of type 1 diabetes in the children of Vietnam vets. My youger brother and I, for example. Some believe that these cases may be the result of traces of Agent Orange or other dioxins. There have been studies done regarding Type 2 Diabetes and Agent Orange ( see this article ) but a great deal more is simply unknown. As a case in point, just compare the treatment now with 10 or 20 years ago!

    Keep up the good work with the mentoring and educating!

    this is true. If you or your brother were in vietnam I would go to the VA and have a scheduled AO exam. If it was your father or possibly your mother who came into contact with herbicides/pesticides while in the military I would get their military records to show when they were in- country, to show linkage of diabetes or other smilar health problems. You can also get much needed information from Vietnam Veterans of America, {VVA**
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  14. #14
    Senior Member serpico7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ModoVincere
    There's about 15-20% of us type 2's that are not obese. I've never been obese, I have been over weight with a BMI as high as 28.5, but never obese. My diet has always been reasonably healthy and well balanced. Lack of exercise has never been an issue. Type 2 runs in my family, with myself and both sisters having it. My father has type 2 as well, and my mother suffers from hypoglycemia (blood glucose that runs too low). Obviously, genetics plays a major role in both forms of this disease, and its not all about high fat diets or being overweight.
    And we don't know as much about this disease as some would like everyone to think. There are a lot of questions still remaining resolved.
    +1. I know several people who became diabetic after 40 or 50 years of age, but were not very fat or out of shape. Though apparently the symptoms (and effectively, the disease) can be kept in check with a controlled diet and exercise.

  15. #15
    Faster but still slow slowandsteady's Avatar
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    The 2 are toatlly different.
    Well sort of. Many people with Type 2 are in fact insulin resistant. And yes unfortunately there are those people that have a genetic component that causes them to have diabetes (either 1 or 2 or both) that has nothing to do with diet.
    "Ride lots." -- Eddy Merckx

  16. #16
    SSP
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    Quote Originally Posted by serpico7
    +1. I know several people who became diabetic after 40 or 50 years of age, but were not very fat or out of shape. Though apparently the symptoms (and effectively, the disease) can be kept in check with a controlled diet and exercise.
    I think our perception of what constitutes "not very fat" has become skewed over the last 20 years or so. With the increasing incidence of obesity in the US, it's really easy to deceive ourselves into thinking we're "not very fat", because nearly everybody we see is carrying around a spare tire (or two).

    The medical consequences of this self-deception and/or ignorance is obvious in the skyrocketing rates of diabetes and other fat-related disorders.
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    Senior Member serpico7's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SSP
    I think our perception of what constitutes "not very fat" has become skewed over the last 20 years or so. With the increasing incidence of obesity in the US, it's really easy to deceive ourselves into thinking we're "not very fat", because nearly everybody we see is carrying around a spare tire (or two).

    The medical consequences of this self-deception and/or ignorance is obvious in the skyrocketing rates of diabetes and other fat-related disorders.
    Are you suggesting that skinny adults cannot become diabetic?

  18. #18
    SSP
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    Quote Originally Posted by serpico7
    Are you suggesting that skinny adults cannot become diabetic?
    No. AFAIK, type 1 is not related to obesity, and some small percentage of type 2's is also unrelated.

    But the evidence is clear that excess body fat, especially visceral fat, is the primary cause for much of the increase in the rate of type 2 diabetes.
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    Senior Member slim_77's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NextLevelMentor
    Have any of you with type 1 looked into the latest research whereby they have successfully used stem cells to create the pancreatic cells that produce insulin and injected it successfully into trial subjects with productive results? Try googling this area... I hope this comes available for folks like you... That would be a huge blessing and restore your lives to full capacity...
    I knew a girl once (or twice) at one of the labs at the University of Chicago and when human testing came up she called me. The condition as she explained it was that I must then take protease inhibitors and I thought I remember her mentioning an immune suppressent to be taken for the remainder of my days. Diabetes ain't so bad...you know?

    ALL stem cell research is greatly inhibited by federal funding policy (see this article), and there is not much stem cell debate these days in the polls from what I hear...if it comes up they might try to propose a constitutional amendment to prevent gay people from forming civil unions with parrots as well as protect the traditional and sacred right to build a 4000 mile wall in the desert to prevent terrrorists from forcing our gay parrots to not sing so loud--in public anyway--with the ulitimate goal to mobilize vast yet untapped power of the American-American vote

    Seriously, I've heard the labs in Korea and China are moving ahead as fast as possible...
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    Sprockette wabbit's Avatar
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    My father developed type 2 in his 60s and he was skinny his whole life. I'm like him, so i worry a bit about developing it too. Autoimmune diseases seem to be in my family. My mother has a thyroid condition and I've inherited that. I wonder what other goodies await me....
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    Type II diabetes is known to be associated with several different things. Genetics does play a role but the fact remains that the VAST majority of Type II diabetics are overweight. Overweight meaning BMI over 24. Genetics does play a role... but it is unlikely that you're gene's caused you to develope Type II diabetes. If you are thin... BMI <24 then your risk of developing diabetes is very low. There are, however... several medications that can cause diabetes II to develope. Namely steroids. And not just the illegal kind. Prednisone, cortazone, asthma medications... ect...

  22. #22
    Riding Heaven's Highways on the grand tour ModoVincere's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by noahjwhite
    Type II diabetes is known to be associated with several different things. Genetics does play a role but the fact remains that the VAST majority of Type II diabetics are overweight. Overweight meaning BMI over 24. Genetics does play a role... but it is unlikely that you're gene's caused you to develope Type II diabetes. If you are thin... BMI <24 then your risk of developing diabetes is very low. There are, however... several medications that can cause diabetes II to develope. Namely steroids. And not just the illegal kind. Prednisone, cortazone, asthma medications... ect...
    Are you aware that some scientist are pursuing a theory that DM type 2 is what may actually be making some people overweight? That the DM in its earliest stages causes the pancreas to produce excessive levels of insulin, thus driving blood sugars low which results in increased hunger. This increased hunger results in overeating resulting in weight gain which causes worsening DM symptoms.
    I'm not saying that is the reason for all type 2's. Just a counterpoint to your post. The fact remains that no one knows what exactly causes type 2 DM. If it was just weight, then a lot more people would suffer this illness than actually do.

    Personally I think weight contributes to DM, not DM causes the weight gain, but scientist are pursuing both paths.
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  23. #23
    Faster but still slow slowandsteady's Avatar
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    Are you aware that some scientist are pursuing a theory that DM type 2 is what may actually be making some people overweight? That the DM in its earliest stages causes the pancreas to produce excessive levels of insulin, thus driving blood sugars low which results in increased hunger. This increased hunger results in overeating resulting in weight gain which causes worsening DM symptoms.
    I'm not saying that is the reason for all type 2's. Just a counterpoint to your post. The fact remains that no one knows what exactly causes type 2 DM. If it was just weight, then a lot more people would suffer this illness than actually do.

    Personally I think weight contributes to DM, not DM causes the weight gain, but scientist are pursuing both paths.
    Well it is actually more complicated than that, but your point is correct. The catch 22 of Type II is that obesity causes it, and it causes obesity.

    And we can clearly see that the egg come before the chicken so to speak. Basically the obesity comes first to some degree and then once Type II sets in somewhat, it further perpetuates the obesity by the destruction of the beta islet cells that produce glucagon like peptide 1, insulin, resistin, leptin and so on. These proteins/hormones are what help to regulate body weight, gastric emptying, satiety, and blood sugar.

    note: I am not saying that obesity causes ALL cases of type II just about 80%. Just generalizing for sake of simplicity.
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    Riding Heaven's Highways on the grand tour ModoVincere's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by slowandsteady
    Just generalizing for sake of simplicity.

    I understand the desire, perhaps need in some cases , but generalizations and simplifications lead to a great deal of misunderstanding amongs those with little to no science in their backgrounds. Case in point, I refer to the LC diet thread that won't die.
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  25. #25
    Senior Member garysol1's Avatar
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    Have you guys seen Team Type 1's website. These guys compete in the RAAM race and all team members have Type 1 Diabetes. They took 2nd overall in last year's RAAM.

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