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  1. #1
    One speed: FAST ! fordfasterr's Avatar
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    Am I working too hard? 160 bpm avg?

    Ok - before you read... be aware I am a total newb to this training thing.


    I did a solo ride today, 40 miles, 2.08hrs.

    heart rate was 160bpm avg, and 186bpm max.

    I forced myself to keep the pace in the 160's and only went higher for a few miles when I had a tail-gater against the wind (from memory, I was at 183 for a few miles, not sure of the exact amount, nowhere close to bonking.. I felt strong, like I could hold it there for much, much longer....) ...

    I am trying to get stronger for club rides which are typically 40 miles and at a high pace.

    I do not know the speed (cept I can calculate it), I did not install the cadence or wheel-speed sensors... I only monitored heart rate and time using the chronograph on the polar hr monitor.

    I am 30/yo and weigh 195 lb.


    Where should I be training ?
    Last edited by fordfasterr; 03-09-08 at 06:03 PM.
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    The answer to your training depends upon your personal physiology and your current level of fitness, so there's no direct answer to your question.

    The best way (well, the only decent way, actually) to determine training zones is through a field test. There's a sticky note in this forum that describes one way how to do it, or you can do a web search for the carmichael field test. Both give similar results, and are also a good way to track your training progress.

    Oh, and put the speed and cadence sensors on.
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    just another gosling Carbonfiberboy's Avatar
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    Your MHR is much higher than you think. Finding LTHR is easier. Do that. Like Eric says, you can't really start training without information. Heck, just go out and buy a Polar HRM/cycling computer with cadence and download link. Lots cheaper than a fancy bike, and in many ways, more important.

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    One speed: FAST ! fordfasterr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy View Post
    Your MHR is much higher than you think. Finding LTHR is easier. Do that. Like Eric says, you can't really start training without information. Heck, just go out and buy a Polar HRM/cycling computer with cadence and download link. Lots cheaper than a fancy bike, and in many ways, more important.
    Thats what I've got. lol
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    I guess I would say training is meant to target a specific goal, so the appropriateness of the training depends on your goals. Is your goal to keep up on a brisk club rides for 40 miles? I wouldn't focus on your heart rate so much. it can be a really poor indicator of your performance. How often a week are you riding? What might work for you is to do a variety of work-outs on days throughout the week.

    For instance, I structure my week like this. It might help you plan your week (you shouldn't need to ride this much. I'm racing every weekend):

    Monday: recovery (from weekend). 1.5h very easy, HR in the 120's (max HR 195, LT at 181)
    Tuesday: off or aerobic/base ride (2h easy/moderate, no intensity. HR around 135-145/150)
    Wed: Strength building. 45m of intensity broken up over 1.5 to 2h. The non-intensity is spent recovering.
    Thur: Tempo/Base 2h
    Friday: Tempo/Base 2h
    Sat: Race or 3h group ride at Tempo LT or Vo2 max
    Sun: Race or base ride 4h

    Also, the type of riding is based on the fact that it's very early in the season for me. my schedule will change as the season progresses.

    So you see, I build up to intensity on the weekends, using the rest of the week to recover, or do a sustainable work load on the bike. The important thing is to remain consistent. Also, I increase hours on the bike for 3 weeks and take the 4th week as a rest week (2/3 the hours of the 3rd week with no intensity)

    It's a pretty classic model. Sorry it's brief, but I should be studying for my midterms : )

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    One speed: FAST ! fordfasterr's Avatar
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    great info thanks !
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    I've ridden 32 times this year and my average heart rate for *ALL* rides is 151 bpm. I have a few that are over 160. 3/4ths of those were closer to the beginning of the year. Now if I hit over 160 I'm going significantly faster (because I'm fitter). I've seen my HR averages steadily go down over the last 2 months but my speed averages have stayed pretty much the same. Now I'm going to start doing regular intervals so I'll have to throw those days out and only log my HR data for my endurance rides.

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    Headset-press carrier logdrum's Avatar
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    Instead of writing another thread, I thought I'd ask here too. I am totally new to this heart rate thing and I am wondering if I am the exception or I am doing it totally wrong or my unit is defective. I am 41 years old and 67 kg or so. male. Supposedly my max HR (not LT -- I am testing that today ) is 181. Just keeping the same pace I always do I am already at 94 to 96% MHR. And when I do my hill repeats (275 ft in 1/2 mile) I am hovering around 96 even upt to 101 at the steepest section. I am not really pushing myself that hard and I've climb those hills faster before or even done the flats or rollers at a faster speed.

    I would say I am an average guy, just getting back to racing road (I did race XC ski but that was 7 years ago). My resting hear rate is around 57 (when I wake up) and middlle of the day sitting at work at 63-70). Have I've been working too hard all these time?

    I'll read up on the LT measurement and try it tomorrow. Any help is appreciated?

    Thanks
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    peloton surfing HillMut's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fordfasterr View Post
    Ok - before you read... be aware I am a total newb to this training thing.


    I did a solo ride today, 40 miles, 2.08hrs.

    heart rate was 160bpm avg, and 186bpm max.

    I forced myself to keep the pace in the 160's and only went higher for a few miles when I had a tail-gater against the wind (from memory, I was at 183 for a few miles, not sure of the exact amount, nowhere close to bonking.. I felt strong, like I could hold it there for much, much longer....) ...

    I am trying to get stronger for club rides which are typically 40 miles and at a high pace.

    I do not know the speed (cept I can calculate it), I did not install the cadence or wheel-speed sensors... I only monitored heart rate and time using the chronograph on the polar hr monitor.

    I am 30/yo and weigh 195 lb.
    How did you determine your max heart rate? given your information you rode 2 hours at 86% of your max HR... I won't say its impossible.. but I know when I get up to 85%-90% of my max I'm not lasting long, usually that is during a sprint. And you rode a few miles at ~98% of your max - you animal! . I think you need to re-examine that.


    Quote Originally Posted by fordfasterr View Post
    Where should I be training ?
    That really depends on your goals; losing weight, training to race, etc.

    Find a stretch of road, flat or uphill that takes you about 20 minutes to ride, ride this like a TT - at a steady pace. Record your average HR from this and finish your ride. Do this several times and take the average of those recorded HR's, this is a rough estimate of your threshold heart rate (LTHR). If you're serious I think you should pick up the book "the cyclist training bible" by joe friel. It has a good section about training by heart rate and determining your 'training zones' based off your LTHR. And it really is a great source of information about periodization and planning for several months of training ahead of time.

    Hope this helps some, I highly recommend you pick that book up it is a GREAT place to start but there are several out there, read em' all .

  10. #10
    One speed: FAST ! fordfasterr's Avatar
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    I completed a group ride today, mx hr 199 when I pulled the group for a little while.. . average hr was 175 for 2 hours / 40 miles.
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    Quote Originally Posted by HillMut View Post
    How did you determine your max heart rate? given your information you rode 2 hours at 86% of your max HR... I won't say its impossible.. but I know when I get up to 85%-90% of my max I'm not lasting long, usually that is during a sprint. And you rode a few miles at ~98% of your max - you animal! . I think you need to re-examine that.
    I believe the OP was stating the max HR for the ride. MHR is not very useful in training, anyway, as mentioned.

    Also, most trained cyclists will have a threshold HR slightly above 90% of their MHR.

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    Senior Member Indyv8a's Avatar
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    You know, I'm still confused.
    Slow, but at least still moving...

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    One speed: FAST ! fordfasterr's Avatar
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    Last sunday I did another ride, AVG HR was 165 but max was 202 !!!

    =)
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    Senior Member Red Baron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HillMut View Post
    If you're serious I think you should pick up the book "the cyclist training bible" by joe friel. It has a good section about training by heart rate and determining your 'training zones' based off your LTHR. And it really is a great source of information about periodization and planning for several months of training ahead of time.

    Hope this helps some, I highly recommend you pick that book up it is a GREAT place to start but there are several out there, read em' all .
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    I to get confused with this LT testing to set up zones. I did a 30 min ride on a fire road going uphill like the mountain bikers training bible said to do. My average heart rate was 178. On my last 3 XC races it was around 178 with a max HR of 184. I know there is no way I am able to be doing 96-97% of max heart rate which is what it comes to. Just wanted some help so I could get my zones figured out and set them for training properly.

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    One speed: FAST ! fordfasterr's Avatar
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    Today's 12 overpass ride yielded a 210 bpm max.

    average was 175.

    I suppose I am gaining some kind of fitness, but not sure how much. I won the sprints on 10 of the climbs, the other 2 I just stayed in the middle to recover a bit.

    =)

    Max speed was 31 mph (this was up-hill, with the fastest lead-out that I could find). Avg speed was 21 mph.

    Total ride length came out to 44 miles on my computer.
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  17. #17
    just another gosling Carbonfiberboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fordfasterr View Post
    Today's 12 overpass ride yielded a 210 bpm max.

    average was 175.
    That's still probably not your MHR. That doesn't matter much, anyway. If we say your true max is 215, your average for this ride is a very similar percentage of max to what I get on group rides. And we might think that your LT would be somewhere around 194. Since you apparently live in Florida, try getting out front on a flat and see if you can hold 194 for 15 minutes or so. And at the same time, see if your buddies can hold your wheel while you do that. That will give you some kind of a marker. Then use Friel to design training zones, plan, etc.

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    just another gosling Carbonfiberboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by logdrum View Post
    Instead of writing another thread, I thought I'd ask here too. I am totally new to this heart rate thing and I am wondering if I am the exception or I am doing it totally wrong or my unit is defective. I am 41 years old and 67 kg or so. male. Supposedly my max HR (not LT -- I am testing that today ) is 181. Just keeping the same pace I always do I am already at 94 to 96% MHR. And when I do my hill repeats (275 ft in 1/2 mile) I am hovering around 96 even upt to 101 at the steepest section. I am not really pushing myself that hard and I've climb those hills faster before or even done the flats or rollers at a faster speed.

    I would say I am an average guy, just getting back to racing road (I did race XC ski but that was 7 years ago). My resting hear rate is around 57 (when I wake up) and middlle of the day sitting at work at 63-70). Have I've been working too hard all these time?

    I'll read up on the LT measurement and try it tomorrow. Any help is appreciated?

    Thanks
    Not necessarily working too hard. Your MHR is higher than you think it is. I had a MHR of 184 at 55. I'd guess your MHR is closer to 195 and LT around 175. Your cruising HR will come down with training, about the time your resting HR comes down to around 50. You're normal. . .

  19. #19
    One speed: FAST ! fordfasterr's Avatar
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    I had a peak of 213 bpm today on the group ride.

    Crazy, but feeling good !
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    just another gosling Carbonfiberboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fordfasterr View Post
    I had a peak of 213 bpm today on the group ride.

    Crazy, but feeling good !
    So have you tried pulling at 194 yet? C'mon, kick some butt!

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    I had a mtn bike race this weekend at around 6000 feet. I had a peak HR of 188 and averaged 177. 41 years old. It seems that in all my races I average either 177 or 178. Although my highest before was only 184.

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    Dan J chinarider's Avatar
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    I gather from some of the questions that people are still using 220-age ( or some varient) to determine MHR. DON'T! The formulas are worthless. At best they represent an average that can be way off for any particular individual. If you are going to use MHR to determing zones, you need an accurate number to start with.
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    Quote Originally Posted by chinarider View Post
    I gather from some of the questions that people are still using 220-age ( or some varient) to determine MHR. DON'T! The formulas are worthless.
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    One speed: FAST ! fordfasterr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carbonfiberboy View Post
    So have you tried pulling at 194 yet? C'mon, kick some butt!
    I can't hold 190+ for too long without feeling like I'm going to blow up.


    Actually, I almost blew up last Sunday after I went up the hill and passed the entire peloton (but I did not manage to pass the leader, but I was close behind him =) )
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