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Old 01-31-09, 10:12 AM   #1
michaeldmanthey
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Your training Secret

What is your training secret? Maybe a special recovery drink or a stretching routine to get the legs feeling good again.

I do a lot of double workout days. If I am doing two hard workouts in a day then I use compression socks/tights to keep the blood and latic acid from pooling in my legs?

What do you do?
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Old 01-31-09, 02:10 PM   #2
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What is your training secret?
Lots of sleep
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Old 01-31-09, 03:07 PM   #3
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For me it's just plain old stretching.
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Old 01-31-09, 03:08 PM   #4
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Ride lots.
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Old 01-31-09, 04:17 PM   #5
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It's always better once you get out on the bike.
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Old 01-31-09, 05:22 PM   #6
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Its not much of one, but I've always taken protein supplements to help recovery. When I was younger I used amino acid supplements from Weider, recommended by some friends who were serious weightlifters. Now I just take spirulina.
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Old 01-31-09, 06:41 PM   #7
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I find that the less I exercise/exert myself, the less sore & tired I'm likely to be....

On a more serious note - I find consistency is my big downfall. Even if I'm not feeling it (busy/tired/stressed etc) if I just try to keep doing little bits, it makes things sooo much better.
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Old 01-31-09, 07:42 PM   #8
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can't tell you. it's a secret.
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Old 02-01-09, 08:08 PM   #9
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enter a race/sportive/charity ride. having a ride on the horizon is great for my motivation.
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Old 02-01-09, 08:30 PM   #10
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You can tell me

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can't tell you. it's a secret.
I promise that I will not tell another soul
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Old 02-01-09, 09:57 PM   #11
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Anna M.
She will work you to exhaustion and then some.
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Old 02-02-09, 09:12 AM   #12
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Here's the REAL secret:

For endurance sports like running and cycling, VOLUME is king. Run/ride 2x as much at low intensity, and throw in an occasional sprint/interval session once every 1-2 weeks, and you will be stronger, faster, and better at any distance lasting longer than 1 minute. All the talk about "train less, go faster" is fad training, and rarely works for the long haul. This is repeatedly proven by elite pros of both sports, yet time and time again, amateurs keep looking for "shortcuts" around it.

No special training program, recovery plan, protein drink, race fueling strategy, etc. will overcome a significant volume training difference upon race day. Not even close. Even for long races such as ironman and marathon - you can totally screw up all your nutrition, transitions, and pacing, and you'll still crush someone with similar genetic ability who trained 1/2 the volume you did, even if they trained at 2x the overall intensity you did.

If you want to get better for a really long time, HTFU and put in the volume.
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Old 02-02-09, 10:49 AM   #13
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Protein. If you're trying to do the volume but your legs hurt all the time, try more protein, a lot more.

Also a recording HRM. Food and drink, clothing, HRM, bike, in that order.
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Old 02-02-09, 01:14 PM   #14
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Quantity vs. Quality

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Originally Posted by agarose2000 View Post
Here's the REAL secret:

For endurance sports like running and cycling, VOLUME is king. Run/ride 2x as much at low intensity, and throw in an occasional sprint/interval session once every 1-2 weeks, and you will be stronger, faster, and better at any distance lasting longer than 1 minute. All the talk about "train less, go faster" is fad training, and rarely works for the long haul. This is repeatedly proven by elite pros of both sports, yet time and time again, amateurs keep looking for "shortcuts" around it.

No special training program, recovery plan, protein drink, race fueling strategy, etc. will overcome a significant volume training difference upon race day. Not even close. Even for long races such as ironman and marathon - you can totally screw up all your nutrition, transitions, and pacing, and you'll still crush someone with similar genetic ability who trained 1/2 the volume you did, even if they trained at 2x the overall intensity you did.

If you want to get better for a really long time, HTFU and put in the volume.
HTFU is great for long races. If you are training for the 7-21 day stage race, Iron man triathalon or marathon. Then volume is King. But if you are training for a 2 1/2 hour mountain bike race, a one hour criterium, a Cyclo-cross race, short track mountain bike race, Sprint or olympic distance Triathalon, Track racing, weekend stage race with TT, Road, and crit stages then getting on your bike and riding for 5 hours a day is not the answer. You must do Intervals, Hill repeats, core work, recovery and functional strength building exercises.

All professionals having training secrets and special things they do other than ride their bikes 5 hours a day. If you do not believe me then I would suggest you follow my blog and watch how I train and see how I become Professional Mountain bike racer this year without doing any single day rides over 5 hours and a total volume not exceeding 15 hours per week with many training weeks under 12 hours. I was a weekend warrior and never trained over 7 hours a week until I got sick of racing in the Sport class and decided to take my cycling to the next level. I started my training program in October of 2007 and moved quickly from Cat 4 in cyclo-cross to Cat 2 in cyclo-cross. I went from Sport in Mountain biking to winning Expert races in 9 months. This year I am Cat 1 in Mountain biking and am shooting to be Pro by June.
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Old 02-02-09, 07:48 PM   #15
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HTFU is great for long races. If you are training for the 7-21 day stage race, Iron man triathalon or marathon. Then volume is King. But if you are training for a 2 1/2 hour mountain bike race, a one hour criterium, a Cyclo-cross race, short track mountain bike race, Sprint or olympic distance Triathalon, Track racing, weekend stage race with TT, Road, and crit stages then getting on your bike and riding for 5 hours a day is not the answer. You must do Intervals, Hill repeats, core work, recovery and functional strength building exercises.
+1/QFT.

Volume/base miles are a great foundation but if that's all you focus on with intervals only every 2 weeks at the least, you're going to get smoked on the track or in a cross race. Agorarose2000 is mistaken in saying cycling is an "endurance" sport; sure, the most publicized race in the world is an all-out endurance event, but cycling is broad faceted and hits all ends of the spectrum. Going long and slow makes you really great at going long and slow, but it won't win you a match sprint.
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Old 02-02-09, 07:59 PM   #16
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If you do not believe me then I would suggest you follow my blog and watch how I train and see how I become Professional Mountain bike racer this year without doing any single day rides over 5 hours and a total volume not exceeding 15 hours per week with many training weeks under 12 hours.
Blah blah blah. You keep blathering this all the time but until you have a contract, shut up about how you are "gonna be" a pro.

Btw, I don't necessarily disagree with what you are saying, it's just that this "I'm going to be a pro" shtick is a little silly.

It also depends on what your discipline is. You are talking about being a pro mountain biker. I know many pro road racers and I can promise you none of them train less than 15 hours per week.
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Old 02-02-09, 08:32 PM   #17
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Specificity
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Old 02-02-09, 09:21 PM   #18
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Get weird illness with fancy French name. Have attacks of vertigo and 12 hours of puking and dry heaves, and can't eat for a day or two. Repeat 20 times in 10 months or so and lose 20 pounds of fat. Get better and suddenly hills are way easier. I strongly DON'T recommend this method.
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Old 02-03-09, 08:29 AM   #19
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Blah blah blah. You keep blathering this all the time but until you have a contract, shut up about how you are "gonna be" a pro.

Btw, I don't necessarily disagree with what you are saying, it's just that this "I'm going to be a pro" shtick is a little silly.

It also depends on what your discipline is. You are talking about being a pro mountain biker. I know many pro road racers and I can promise you none of them train less than 15 hours per week.
Sorry man! I didn't mean to get on your nerves.
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Old 02-03-09, 08:31 AM   #20
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Sorry man! I didn't mean to get on your nerves.
Just not sure why you are so confident that you are going to be a pro. You post about it like it is a foregone conclusion.
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Old 02-03-09, 11:00 AM   #21
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HTFU is great for long races. If you are training for the 7-21 day stage race, Iron man triathalon or marathon. Then volume is King. But if you are training for a 2 1/2 hour mountain bike race, a one hour criterium, a Cyclo-cross race, short track mountain bike race, Sprint or olympic distance Triathalon, Track racing, weekend stage race with TT, Road, and crit stages then getting on your bike and riding for 5 hours a day is not the answer. You must do Intervals, Hill repeats, core work, recovery and functional strength building exercises.

All professionals having training secrets and special things they do other than ride their bikes 5 hours a day. If you do not believe me then I would suggest you follow my blog and watch how I train and see how I become Professional Mountain bike racer this year without doing any single day rides over 5 hours and a total volume not exceeding 15 hours per week with many training weeks under 12 hours. I was a weekend warrior and never trained over 7 hours a week until I got sick of racing in the Sport class and decided to take my cycling to the next level. I started my training program in October of 2007 and moved quickly from Cat 4 in cyclo-cross to Cat 2 in cyclo-cross. I went from Sport in Mountain biking to winning Expert races in 9 months. This year I am Cat 1 in Mountain biking and am shooting to be Pro by June.
12-15 hours per week of cycling - I don't know too many people (anybody?) who could do high-intensity hillwork, intervals, and other intense work for all of that volume. To me, that implies higher volume/lower intensity training with mixed intervals/sprints, and is likely not too different than what I had in mind. (I myself sprint sessions as I taper for race day, but still never exceed 25% of total weekly miles on the fast stuff.)

To put it somewhat in perspective, professional elite marathon runners train similar hours as you. Granted, cycling requires more hours, but still, 12+ hours per week of one discipline is substantial, and definitely not what I'd characterize as a "hi-intensity lo-volume training plan."

Also: in track and field (I know, somewhat different from cycling, but there's overlap), MORE MILES is the key coaching concept from all race distances over 800meters. So basically, for anyone running a race that lasts over 2mins, more miles is the key. Aside from pure cycling track sprints, most crits and road races last well over this duration, and thus volume is likely to have a similar role (hence lots of miles by the pros.) Rahsaan Bahati, the US 2008 elite national crit champion is doing almost nothing but big long miles, 5hrs or so a day during the nonrace season. And he's a SPRINTER.
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Old 02-03-09, 11:06 AM   #22
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Just not sure why you are so confident that you are going to be a pro. You post about it like it is a foregone conclusion.
Why TF does it bother you about his "confidence". (note you did not use the term arrogance. Confidence in sport is a necessity).
Also he posted a blog with his training.
If you want to question his training (though hopefully with the intention of constructive criticism) go ahead, but if a guy POSTS he is going pro, time will tell but don't let it get your panties in a bunch.

THEN we can learn if he succeeded and congratulate him or if not, what in his conditioning, physical traits/limitations held him back and what he plans to do differently to make it next year.
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Old 02-03-09, 11:12 AM   #23
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Why TF does it bother you about his "confidence". (note you did not use the term arrogance. Confidence in sport is a necessity).
Also he posted a blog with his training.
If you want to question his training (though hopefully with the intention of constructive criticism) go ahead, but if a guy POSTS he is going pro, time will tell but don't let it get your panties in a bunch.

THEN we can learn if he succeeded and congratulate him or if not, what in his conditioning, physical traits/limitations held him back and what he plans to do differently to make it next year.
I'm not necesarily questioning his training, only his insistence that he is "going to be" a pro. Confidence is one thing, but consistently saying it like it is already happened when it clearly has not is delusional. When/if it happens, I would congratulate him, I have no ill feelings or desire to see him fail.
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Old 02-03-09, 03:17 PM   #24
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Back on topic... they say a secret is something the other guy doesn't know. So, I may know and do lots of little training tips that to me are mundane common knowledge, but when I go ride with the 3's and 4's in my club, they aren't doing it.

But, in the spirit of the thread, here's one that I have had success with and I see almost nobody on the internet talking about: block training. In my case I'll do 2 days on, 2 days easy for 4 cycles, then throw in a rest cycle of 2 extra days, then shift to 3 / 3 cycle. There are some very specific tips to how you're supposed to do it, but when done right I get big gains.

The only place I commonly see it used is in training camps, but those are once or twice a year deals.

Anyway, there you go.
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Old 02-03-09, 06:01 PM   #25
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enter a race/sportive/charity ride. having a ride on the horizon is great for my motivation.
That's mine, for sure. Sign up for something that scares you.
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