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Old 09-30-04, 09:11 AM   #1
astompa
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post your squat weight and goal

Just started a weight program. Started squats with 50lbs plus bar, 15 reps. I know I can do more than that but I want to start light in the beginning so as to not injure myself. Hope to work up to over 200lbs by end of winter.
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Old 09-30-04, 10:02 AM   #2
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Back in the day my best squat was 425 for 3 reps (never crazy enough to go for a one rep best).

Squatting is fraught with danger. Form is so important, I would urge you to at least confer with a trainer or accomplished powerlifter to look after your sets. Setting the bar right across the shoulders is key, as is the alignment of the spine and resisting the urge to engage the spinal erectors on the way up. You're right to be starting out so light.

Another great piece of equipment is the 'legsled', the legpress that you sit on kind of upside down. It's very safe and isolates the quads for a good workout.

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Old 09-30-04, 10:15 AM   #3
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Yes my gym has the leg sled as well and I use that too. So far the squats I've done have been "assisted" by machines. There's one machine that has a bar attached to it and hooks on the bar that you flip onto pegs with a flick of the wrists. You can use it for bench press as well. It keeps the bar and weight moving in one plane. There's also a machine which has a big kind of harness thing that you step into and do the squat motion. Both of these machines are a lot less scary than the free-weight squat.
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Old 09-30-04, 11:58 AM   #4
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That's a Smith Machine. I would urge against it's use for squats. It can be very hard on your knees. If you do a squat properly the bar will not travel in a perfect vertical plane. The best thing to do is use the squat rack. Do a couple of reps without weight while watching your form. Perfect form is the key. Also go as deep as possible. Otherwise you're only doing half-squats. Most squat racks have catch bars on either side of you so if you can't handle the weight you can just sit down and let the bars catch it for you.

Also while you're over on the squat rack do Dead Lifts. They will build core strength faster than any other exercise out there. I do two leg days a week. Day one is 3 sets of dead lifts, 3 sets of straight leg deadlifts, 3 sets of calf presses, 3 sets of weighted lunges, plus ab work. Day two is 3 sets of Good Mornings, 3 sets of Squats, 3 sets of leg presses, plus ab work. I warm up by running a quick mile on the treadmill (@ 7 minutes) then doing a Yoga Sunrise Salute.

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Old 09-30-04, 01:42 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atl_hooligan
That's a Smith Machine. I would urge against it's use for squats. It can be very hard on your knees. If you do a squat properly the bar will not travel in a perfect vertical plane...
That's just one opinion. I use the Smith for squats and have had no problems.

Here's another opinion on the subject:

http://www.exrx.net/ExInfo/SmithSquat1.html
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Old 09-30-04, 03:21 PM   #6
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315 x 3 reps at age 13 (first time under a bar).

550 x 1 on smith machine age 17

450 x 12 (slow reps) on smith machine age 17

385 x 6 barbell age 35

Now I do 225 x 12 for three sets and ride the heck outa my bike. =) (age 37)
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Old 09-30-04, 04:25 PM   #7
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There are alot of different opinions when it comes to weight lifting. The main key is too educate yourself as much as possible.

Listen, watch and learn. Be careful because you will see alot of people using dangerous form and way too much weight.

Know and understand what you want to accomplish with weight lifting and work towards learning how to get there the right way


Personally I like to use low weight/high reps. I use weights mostly to build core strength and upper body condition as I can ride year round here in Az.
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Old 09-30-04, 05:53 PM   #8
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Me no squat. Too dangerous.

At 5'11 - 235 - I cut out lifting, for a few years. Don't need more muscle mass.

When I did lift, 6 sets 4 reps, about 80 % max.About 10 sets of real lite warm ups, gradually heavier.

Pumps em up, and calls in reinforcemants.

It was the, at the time, the Worlds Strongest Drug Free Man's program. Nice for benchin'. 3 month program. Go up every two weeks, lift three times a week.

Small increments. Powerlifting.

I like the bike, for a change.
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Old 09-30-04, 06:30 PM   #9
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What kinda squat?

The quarter squats people in gyms tend to do?

The parallel (to the floor) squat that powerlifters and many serious weight trainers do?

The butt-to-the-heels squat that olympic-style lifters do?

With or without knee-wraps and/or tight shorts?

The difference in performance can be quiet dramatic.

About 30 years ago I could do the butt-to-the-heels squats with 270lbs for about 3 reps. I weighed 150.
A couple years later, after I was out of shape, I did about 10 almost-quarter squats with 600.

Now I don't do squats because I don't have a squat rack and my back doesn't hold up well. But when I do squat for a couple weeks I can go almost as deep with about 170 pounds for 5-10 reps. If I go at it much harder than that my back locks up. And I'm fat now.

And yes, some people think full squats are bad for your knees, and other people will cite research that says parallel squats are bad for your knees.

I'm only a commuter/tourist type of rider, and there really isn't much need for me to do more than a few leg exercise like leg presses or a squats with light weights.
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Old 10-01-04, 04:16 AM   #10
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BAck and knee injuries are forever. Use good judgement and coaching.
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Old 10-01-04, 08:13 AM   #11
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I prefer the deep "butt to heels" squats. You get a great range of motion, and really build your core and stabilizer muscles.

As for the Sumo Squat I think you mean Sumo Dead Lift. You take a wide stance and grab the bar between your legs using a reverse grip. That's an awesome exercise! If you want to up your squat weights then focus on dead lifts. It will make a huge difference.

I change my program every 12 weeks. I'll do 12 weeks of base strength training. Low reps (5-7), and high weight. Try and increase the weight a little each week. You can make big gains strength wise. Then I go to 12 weeks of endurance training where I do high reps (10-12), and use the weight I began the previous 12 week program with. Again raise the weight each week. The idea is at the end of the 24 weeks you'll be able to do 10 or 12 reps of a weight you could only accomplish at 5 or 6 reps at the beginning of the program.

For example.
Week 1 Squat is (135 lbs X 5 reps) (155 lbs X 5 reps) (165 lbs X 5 reps)
Week 2 Squat is (155 lbs X 5 reps) (175 lbs X 5 reps) (185 lbs X 5 reps)
Week 3 Squat is (175 lbs X 5 reps) (195 lbs X 5 reps) (205 lbs X 5 reps)
Week 4 Squat is (195 lbs X 5 reps) (215 lbs X 5 reps) (225 lbs X 5 reps)
Week 5 Squat is (215 lbs X 5 reps) (235 lbs X 5 reps) (245 lbs X 5 reps)
Week 6 Squat is (235 lbs X 5 reps) (255 lbs X 5 reps) (265 lbs X 5 reps)
Week 7 Squat is (255 lbs X 5 reps) (275 lbs X 5 reps) (285 lbs X 5 reps)
Week 8 Squat is (275 lbs X 5 reps) (295 lbs X 5 reps) (305 lbs X 5 reps)
Week 9 Squat is (295 lbs X 5 reps) (315 lbs X 5 reps) (325 lbs X 5 reps)
Week 10 Squat is (315 lbs X 5 reps) (335 lbs X 5 reps) (345 lbs X 5 reps)
Week 11 Squat is (335 lbs X 5 reps) (355 lbs X 5 reps) (365 lbs X 5 reps)
Week 12 Squat is (355 lbs X 5 reps) (375 lbs X 5 reps) (385 lbs X 5 reps) (400 lbs X 1)

Week 1 Squat is (135 lbs X 10 reps) (155 lbs X 10 reps) (165 lbs X 10 reps)
Week 2 Squat is (155 lbs X 10 reps) (175 lbs X 10 reps) (185 lbs X 10 reps)
Week 3 Squat is (175 lbs X 10 reps) (195 lbs X 10 reps) (205 lbs X 10 reps)
Week 4 Squat is (195 lbs X 10 reps) (215 lbs X 10 reps) (225 lbs X 10 reps)
Week 5 Squat is (215 lbs X 10 reps) (235 lbs X 10 reps) (245 lbs X 10 reps)
Week 6 Squat is (235 lbs X 10 reps) (255 lbs X 10 reps) (265 lbs X 10 reps)
Week 7 Squat is (255 lbs X 10 reps) (275 lbs X 10 reps) (285 lbs X 10 reps)
Week 8 Squat is (275 lbs X 10 reps) (295 lbs X 10 reps) (305 lbs X 10 reps)
Week 9 Squat is (295 lbs X 10 reps) (315 lbs X 10 reps) (325 lbs X 10 reps)
Week 10 Squat is (315 lbs X 10 reps) (335 lbs X 10 reps) (345 lbs X 10 reps)
Week 11 Squat is (335 lbs X 10 reps) (355 lbs X 10 reps) (365 lbs X 10 reps)
Week 12 Squat is (355 lbs X 10 reps) (375 lbs X 10 reps) (385 lbs X 10 reps) (450 lbs X 1)

Remember form is key! You can do squats safely is long as you maintain good form.
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Old 10-01-04, 08:20 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chop
That's just one opinion. I use the Smith for squats and have had no problems.

Here's another opinion on the subject:

http://www.exrx.net/ExInfo/SmithSquat1.html
I started out with the Smith Machine for safety reasons. After several weeks it aggrivated an old knee injury so I moved to the Hammer Strength Squat machine. You could only load 450 lbs of weights on it, and I quickly maxed it out. So I started doing free weight squats using only 135 lbs. At first I was doing the wimpy quarter or half squats that you see most people doing. I didn't have the confidence to go deeper. I added Sumo Dead Lifts to my routine and it really built up my core and stabilizer muscles that gave me the confidence to do deep squats. I lowered the weight the first week to 95 lbs to get my form right. It only took 4 or 5 weeks to get to 225 lbs.
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Old 10-01-04, 11:12 AM   #13
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In regards to the smith machine...

When I started lifting, a few years ago, I was not comfortable with squatting in the rack. It hurt the back of my neck and I thought I'd get hurt. So I stuck with the leg press, and the smith machine. After 6 months I could put up 850 pounds on the 45 degree leg press sled. I thought I had strong quads/glutes.

Then a friend turned me on to squatting with a barbell. Immediately I realized that with the machines I had been neglecting all the stabilizers that you use when you squat with a barbell. I could barely put up 200 for reps. The soreness I got out of free squatting was GREAT, and much more intense than the machines. My progress in terms of strength and quad development increased greatly, as did my lower back strength.

Whats more, my knees stopped hurting. When squatting on the sled or a smith machine, the pressure of the weight would be felt HEAVILY on my knees. It was more evenly divided among knees, calves, back, abs, glutes and quads when squatting with a barbell.

In short: the body was designed to lift weight freely against gravity. If you use it as it was intended, you will see better results.

Squatting is important not just because it hits quads and glutes. It is important because it is a compound exercise. Compound exercises like squatting, bench pressing, and deadlifting cause hormonal secretions that cardio and machines/isolation exercises do not. Namely: testosterone and Human Growth Hormone release. These hormones will benefit all aspects of your physical fitness. You'll get stronger, leaner, and meaner. Which will make you a better rider.

I'm not saying that you won't benefit from any hormonal changes using a machine... but it stands to reason that if compound movements elicit more positive hormonal changes than isolation movements, then the more muscle groups you involve, the more hormonal changes you will see. This is why you rarely see anyone who is serious about resistance training using a machine for squats.

Above all else... squatting a barbell feels GREAT once you're into a routine. No machine can ever give you that feeling of triumph when you make the ugly face and give it all that you've got to get that weight back up that last time before you slam it on the rack. The high from free squatting cannot be beat.

I'd compare the leg press machine or the smith machine versus free squatting, to a stationary bike versus the real deal. It feels that much better.

Last edited by Crunkologist; 10-01-04 at 12:19 PM.
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Old 10-01-04, 11:16 AM   #14
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BTW: it has been noted here that people not going deep enough on their squats is a problem. Thats why I always box squatted when I was on a serious routine. I'd set a milk crate, or a flat bench, behind me and I'd go down until I sat on it. Then I'd go back up. its hard to do, and instruction would be a good idea, but I found that it helped me to be strict with every rep, and if I had to dump a squat, it was easy.
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Old 10-01-04, 12:51 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crunkologist
....Squatting is important not just because it hits quads and glutes. It is important because it is a compound exercise. Compound exercises like squatting, bench pressing, and deadlifting cause hormonal secretions that cardio and machines/isolation exercises do not...
You're saying that a Smith squat, or any other excercise using any type of machine, is not a compound excercise. Can you explain why?
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Old 10-01-04, 10:40 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chop
You're saying that a Smith squat, or any other excercise using any type of machine, is not a compound excercise. Can you explain why?
A machine isolates the movement to a specific muscle group. So while that muscle group may be stressed more it isn't as beneficial as a compound movement. Compound movements cause the core and stabilizing muscles to come into play.

There's nothing wrong with using a Smith Machine, but try free weight squats on the squat rack sometime and tell me you don't see a difference. Start with a weight about 1/2 of what you would put on the Smith Machine and see if it isn't harder. Squat racks are very safe is you use proper form.
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Old 10-02-04, 06:22 AM   #17
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post your squat weight and goal

My weight when I squat is exactly the same weight as when I am standing up.

Kidding aside, I squat light. ABout 200 pounds. No sense putting my body at risk at 65yo, and it accomplishes what I want. My goal is to stay about 200 pounds of weight.
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Old 10-02-04, 03:06 PM   #18
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when you squat on any machine or aparatus make sure that your knees never track out in front of your feet watch this and you should be fine. back strait knees behind your feet and parallel to the floor with your quads
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Old 10-02-04, 04:11 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DnvrFox
post your squat weight and goal

My weight when I squat is exactly the same weight as when I am standing up.

Kidding aside, I squat light. ABout 200 pounds. No sense putting my body at risk at 65yo, and it accomplishes what I want. My goal is to stay about 200 pounds of weight.
What I have read, and what I believe in now, is 20 rep squats.

Start out with body weight and work your way up, don't go crazy.
Using a pilates ball against a wall is a good workout too when squatting with a weight vest or dumbells.
My 2 cents
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Old 10-03-04, 07:25 AM   #20
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The squat is an excellent overall lower body exercise, but for some variation try a body weight one-leg squat. As a strength coach, I have come across MANY athletes that can squat 300+ pounds, but lack the functional stabilization and strength to perform ONE single leg squat with their own weight. As far as specificity, the pedaling motion is one limb at a time, so single leg squats, split squats and step-ups (paying attention to knee flexion) are among my favorites.

Not to downplay the sacred squat, but incorporate some variation with your lower body strength work.

Just my 2 cents.

Dan
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Old 10-04-04, 02:37 PM   #21
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Good point about cycling motion involving one leg at a time! I tried the one-legged 45 degree sled and hurt my left leg, probably too much weight. But pain was gone in two days so I'm heading back to the gym. I'm going to get trainer to look at my form for the squats. It does seem to be true about free weights versus the hammer machines. I've noticed the free weight bench press is more difficult than the hammer press and different muscles are sore the next day. I don't think I agree about 20 reps. Most of the books say start with a high number, about 15, then increase the weight and lower the reps to about 6, then work back up to 10 with that weight.
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Old 10-05-04, 02:31 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by MERTON
one leg squat? your joking??? ???

*i'm scared*
You should try the Bulgarian Split Squat then. Those things are downright evil.

http://www.menshealth.co.uk/videos/s...split/mov.html
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Old 10-05-04, 09:03 PM   #23
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My current squat is about 250-275 Lbs.

I'm 5' 10" and weigh 155 LBs. I can usually get in 3 sets of 10, and I do it twice a week with my leg workout. I am hoping to get over the 350 mark sometime soon. I'm taking a few supps, so hopefully those'll kick in here pretty soon

The good news is, I'm almost up to 200 on the flat bench press, and 160 on the chest press.

-Matt
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Old 10-16-04, 10:47 AM   #24
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Has anyone tried squats on the exercise ball. 3 sets of fifteen of those feels like 300 pound squats. It takes a while to work your core strength up to the point where you can do them, but when you do, you will never feel better.
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Old 10-17-04, 08:54 AM   #25
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I'm 6'0, 149lbs...

I can currently squat 2.3x my own bodyweight (1RM), deadlift 2.8x my own bodyweight (1RM) and as mentioned in an earlier thread I am currently doing One-Legged squats (Bulgarian Dips) with 46kg on each dumbell... My legs IMO look better than Bruce Lee's when I'm cycling... Not looking for mass, just strength & power (7 reps max), not the mass (8-12 reps max).

At this time I'm also performing, Romanian Deadlifts, Reverse Hypers, Hyper extensions, Jump Squats (Dumbells) etc etc...
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