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    Heart rate moniters?

    I just got a heart rate moniter, its a cheap $20 target-brand piece of junk, but it does tell me my heart rate (and max, low, and average!). anyway, so I have done a few rides with it, and I'm having two problems. I am now doing base training to start racing this febuary, and so I am trying to keep my heart rate between 120-160 (60 and 80%). however, going up hills almost always shoots my heart rate up to 160 or more, and i have to go like 10 mph up all hills which is a good 5 mph slower then I'm used to. then, on the way down the decent, i have to practically sprint becuase my heart rate then plummets to 100 or lower on the decent. Raleigh is almost all rolling hills, so I cant seem to find an area that will keep my heart rate at a constant 140-150.

    So, for you guys and gals using HRMs for base training, do you have any tips for keeping the heart rate in the target range in hilly areas? This is kinda getting on my nerves...will it hurt my base building later on in the season?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phatman
    I just got a heart rate moniter, its a cheap $20 target-brand piece of junk, but it does tell me my heart rate (and max, low, and average!). anyway, so I have done a few rides with it, and I'm having two problems. I am now doing base training to start racing this febuary, and so I am trying to keep my heart rate between 120-160 (60 and 80%). however, going up hills almost always shoots my heart rate up to 160 or more, and i have to go like 10 mph up all hills which is a good 5 mph slower then I'm used to. then, on the way down the decent, i have to practically sprint becuase my heart rate then plummets to 100 or lower on the decent. Raleigh is almost all rolling hills, so I cant seem to find an area that will keep my heart rate at a constant 140-150.

    So, for you guys and gals using HRMs for base training, do you have any tips for keeping the heart rate in the target range in hilly areas? This is kinda getting on my nerves...will it hurt my base building later on in the season?
    Got a link for said target-brand piece of junk.

  3. #3
    Castle Hill,NSW.Australia Dark Arrow's Avatar
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    Well as sick as this sounds, if your looking for a constant work out you could lift your bike on a trainer and spin for the exact time you want for your workout. Iin addition to that schedule you could ride your hills to develope your legs for the sprints and climbs.

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    Upgrading my engine DXchulo's Avatar
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    Maybe I'm crazy, but don't the 2 cancel each other out? In the world of statistics, yeah, but in the world of training? Who knows?

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phatman
    I just got a heart rate moniter, its a cheap $20 target-brand piece of junk, but it does tell me my heart rate (and max, low, and average!). anyway, so I have done a few rides with it, and I'm having two problems. I am now doing base training to start racing this febuary, and so I am trying to keep my heart rate between 120-160 (60 and 80%). however, going up hills almost always shoots my heart rate up to 160 or more, and i have to go like 10 mph up all hills which is a good 5 mph slower then I'm used to. then, on the way down the decent, i have to practically sprint becuase my heart rate then plummets to 100 or lower on the decent. Raleigh is almost all rolling hills, so I cant seem to find an area that will keep my heart rate at a constant 140-150.

    So, for you guys and gals using HRMs for base training, do you have any tips for keeping the heart rate in the target range in hilly areas? This is kinda getting on my nerves...will it hurt my base building later on in the season?

    If you were training base, there wouldn't be any hill training. Base is riding long, comfortable rides at low heart rates so that your body can recover from the stress of the season. Once your body recovers, then it's time to start increasing the intensity, and you'll move into endurance/tempo training rides.

    You may want to consider getting a trainer or an indoor cycle if you can't seem to find anyplace to ride that will allow you to keep your heart rate at a lower, steady rate.

    Koffee

  6. #6
    Maglia Ciclamino gcasillo's Avatar
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    With time, you should find your heart rate in the proper zone including moderate climbs. If you're starting out, your heart rate is going to rocket on you for a few weeks. During this time, focus on good pedaling fundamentals more than keeping your heart rate in a given zone. Remember, heels down while climbing. That helps.

    Just put out what effort you can. There's a little roll in the roads around here too, and I can't just keep to specific zones that much. Otherwise, like you, I'm crawling my bike up inclines at 5mph.

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    umm...as for indoor training...thats not an option. riding on the trainer blows after 15 minutes, I think that 4 hours would suck so much...

    And, trust me, there is no road around here that has more then a few miles of flat.

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    Senior Member late's Avatar
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    The answer is as plain as the nose on your face. You already know it, you just don't like it. If you want to do base training, do base training. The monitor is the Boss. If it says whoa, slow down or walk. WHen it says go, pedal faster. Base training is like watching paint dry. What sucks even worse is that it works.

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    Senior Member JavaMan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phatman
    I just got a heart rate moniter, its a cheap $20 target-brand piece of junk, but it does tell me my heart rate (and max, low, and average!). anyway, so I have done a few rides with it, and I'm having two problems. I am now doing base training to start racing this febuary, and so I am trying to keep my heart rate between 120-160 (60 and 80%). however, going up hills almost always shoots my heart rate up to 160 or more, and i have to go like 10 mph up all hills which is a good 5 mph slower then I'm used to. then, on the way down the decent, i have to practically sprint becuase my heart rate then plummets to 100 or lower on the decent. Raleigh is almost all rolling hills, so I cant seem to find an area that will keep my heart rate at a constant 140-150.

    So, for you guys and gals using HRMs for base training, do you have any tips for keeping the heart rate in the target range in hilly areas? This is kinda getting on my nerves...will it hurt my base building later on in the season?
    So let me get this straight...you bought a heart rate monitor so you could stay in a certain range, but you don't want to do what's necessary to stay in that range??? If your heart rate goes over 160 on hills, then SLOW DOWN. When you weren't "training", you used to ride at a certain speed. But now you ARE training, and if you have to go 5 mph uphill to keep your heartrate in the proper range, what's wrong with that? Downhill, OK sprint if you have to. Remember, you are training.

    The frustrating thing about heart monitors is the delayed reaction. It's not like your speedometer, which is instantaneous. Sometimes your rate will continue to rise even after you have slowed down. It keeps rising on hills even if you back off. And you can't keep it up on downhills. You will get used to that after a time. Everyone does.

    By the way, going very slowly uphill and very fast downhill will help develop better balance, high cadence smoothness, and general bike-handling skills you will use later when you race.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phatman
    umm...as for indoor training...thats not an option. riding on the trainer blows after 15 minutes, I think that 4 hours would suck so much...

    And, trust me, there is no road around here that has more then a few miles of flat.

    I feel for you- we have the same problems in Chicago, but just on the opposite scales. We have plenty of flats, but no hills! If there is a "hill", it's just a few meters in height and length, which sucks big time. So when it comes time to do strength training, I HAVE to go to a trainer. It sucks, but that's how it works.

    Actually, base training is all about heart rate, just like you indicated, and the reason why base cannot be performed when riding hills is because of the problems you are having- heart rate goes too high. So, you're not doing base, you're really doing intervals... or strength training, depending on how many hills you're hitting.

    Is it possible you could find a gym and use the indoor cycles? I was more thinking about getting on an indoor bike like at a gym or something along those lines, than getting on a cycle ops trainer and peddling away for hours on end. At the end of the day, I had to go to a gym to get in my strength training. It is not the best thing in the world, but it's better than nothing, and it keeps me on track with keeping up a good, solid training program that isn't compromised because of my circumstances.

    Koffee

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    Quote Originally Posted by late
    The answer is as plain as the nose on your face. You already know it, you just don't like it. If you want to do base training, do base training. The monitor is the Boss. If it says whoa, slow down or walk. WHen it says go, pedal faster. Base training is like watching paint dry. What sucks even worse is that it works.
    damn. I suppose thats it then. I guess I'll just have to slow down a pinch. maybe get a huge cassette for base training so I can just spin up hills.

    and koffee, dont you find indoor bikes to be just as bad as a trainer? Ive never tried an indoor bike for any length of time, however, I have used trainers and treadmills, I had a hard time doing more then about 30 minutes on each one, not becuase of fatigue, just becuase I was just staring at a wall.

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    I totally understand. But does your gym have a spin class they offer? Not like I do what they ask in class, since I've never taken a class in the last 4 years where the instructor knew squat about training, but sometimes, I need the stimulation, so I'll take class. Then I'll bring my monitor and just tell the instructor I'm working on my own training plan and sit in the back and do my strength training. It's better than nothing.

    Indoor bikes seem to be worse than trainers, since it just never feels like my bike! But if you have to do something, it's better than nothing. It could be the variety you need. Sometimes, you can do a spin class, sometimes, you can ride the trainer, and sometimes, you can ride on an indoor bike. Anything, but you have to get the base training in there. Otherwise, if you're looking for true base training, I am sad to report that you're not doing it as long as you have hills.

    I wish I had your problem. Seriously. Chicago is about as flat as it gets. Bleah.

    Koffee

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    Livin' in God's Country.. JarodArmstrong's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phatman
    I had a hard time doing more then about 30 minutes on each one, not becuase of fatigue, just becuase I was just staring at a wall.
    Well then don't stare at the wall. Either figure out a way to make it work or quit your whining. Trainers aren't nearly as fun as riding out in the real world. But when the snow flies or it was like today, 40 degrees, misty and 30+mph winds... then the trainer is just fine. I have mine set up in front of the tv, watch CMT for 1/2 hr, then maybe a movie. But you gotta keep the legs going or I'll be toast next spring.

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    Well, I think what I might do is just ride outside and try to take it easy on the hills. I have a 11-32 cassette and an XT derailleur chillin' at home (from a touring bike i converted to fixed gear), I think I might put that on so I can just spin up hills at 8 mph. My cassette needs replacing anyway.

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    Why don't you forget the monitor, until you ride enough that your heartrate doesn't skyrocket when you take moderate hills?

    As of right now, that heartrate monitor is a stupid POS, and is only holding back your training, IMHO. Use it later.

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    Senior Member late's Avatar
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    Actually, Crunk old boy, he needs the monitor now more than later.
    Training is a series of adaptations to gradually increasing stresses. Untrained individuals are less able to cope with bigger jumps in stress levels that those in good shape.
    Your advice would slow his progress down.

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    Ink-Stained Wretch pinky's Avatar
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    why not just throw on a cassette with a 25 or 27 on the top, you're gonna have to slow down for the hills but at least you'll keep going

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    Stegosaurus Crunkologist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by late
    Actually, Crunk old boy, he needs the monitor now more than later.
    Training is a series of adaptations to gradually increasing stresses. Untrained individuals are less able to cope with bigger jumps in stress levels that those in good shape.
    Your advice would slow his progress down.
    Thats funny, because the most rapid improvements that I've ever made in cardio capacity is when I do interval training after not doing anything for a while. If he can't conquer the terrain in his area without seriously pumping blood, then I doubt he has in enough miles that training so specifically will do any good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by pinky
    why not just throw on a cassette with a 25 or 27 on the top, you're gonna have to slow down for the hills but at least you'll keep going
    i've got a 27 cog, there are still 2-3 hills around here (not many, but a few) that shoot my heart-rate up, even with the 27T cog.

    BTW, I've been riding for quite a while, I'm doing about 200 miles per week, at about 17-18 mph...I've got about 4000 miles for the year, I dont think its a question of me not having enough miles.

    one of the guys in the club here suggested that possibly I have a really high natural heart rate, I wonder if thats possible. I hammered up this hill the other day, and hit 200 surprisingly easy, I felt as if I could have gone harder (the hill ended). How do I find my max HR? I had been using 220-my age, and that puts me at 202, but that seems low, especially when I ride with other people, and I get dropped, and they say their heart-rates are only at 160. these are the people I kept up with easily without my HRM.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crunkologist
    Thats funny, because the most rapid improvements that I've ever made in cardio capacity is when I do interval training after not doing anything for a while. If he can't conquer the terrain in his area without seriously pumping blood, then I doubt he has in enough miles that training so specifically will do any good.
    The point is that he needs to build a base first. In order to build a base, he needs to put in much time on the bike in low HR zones ONLY. Doing intervals sans a good base is a recipe for disaster ... and injury.

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    Just ride. roadbuzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phatman
    BTW, I've been riding for quite a while, I'm doing about 200 miles per week, at about 17-18 mph...I've got about 4000 miles for the year, I dont think its a question of me not having enough miles.
    How long have you been doing 200 miles/week? That's a lot of weekly saddle time, and if your yearly mileage is at 4000, I'm thinking you haven't been logging that kind of mileage very long. Don't write off the possibility that you're overdoing it... trying to rush training is the best way to slow it down.

    one of the guys in the club here suggested that possibly I have a really high natural heart rate, I wonder if thats possible. I hammered up this hill the other day, and hit 200 surprisingly easy, I felt as if I could have gone harder (the hill ended). How do I find my max HR? I had been using 220-my age, and that puts me at 202, but that seems low, especially when I ride with other people, and I get dropped, and they say their heart-rates are only at 160. these are the people I kept up with easily without my HRM.
    Heart rates vary significantly, and % of Max HR doesn't mean much by itself. I'd recommend basing your training intensity on your Anaerobic Threshold (take the test in the sticky thread at the top of the T & N forum to get a ball-park), which is a better measure of your fitness and doesn't require knowing your MHR. I don't recall the percentage zones based on AT (I'm at work, books at home), but you can search the web, or somebody else around here probably knows.

    Finally, don't sweat the HR numbers too much. The point of base is to stay mainly aerobic. Yes, you have to slow down on the climbs, and group rides will invariably go too fast. You have some latitude, just be sure to mainly stay aerobic.

  22. #22
    Stegosaurus Crunkologist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bac
    The point is that he needs to build a base first. In order to build a base, he needs to put in much time on the bike in low HR zones ONLY. Doing intervals sans a good base is a recipe for disaster ... and injury.
    I always did them from the beginning, but perhaps I was at significant risk of injury? Sure feels like you're gonna die the first few times you do em

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    Quote Originally Posted by roadbuzz
    How long have you been doing 200 miles/week? That's a lot of weekly saddle time, and if your yearly mileage is at 4000, I'm thinking you haven't been logging that kind of mileage very long. Don't write off the possibility that you're overdoing it... trying to rush training is the best way to slow it down..
    I've been at 200 miles per week since the beginning of august (10 weeks), and I started working up to it from may and late april. before that, I was busy running track, and just riding a few miles on the weekends. but I followed the rules for building mileage, not a whole lot more then 10% per week.

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    Just ride. roadbuzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phatman
    I've been at 200 miles per week since the beginning of august (10 weeks), and I started working up to it from may and late april. before that, I was busy running track, and just riding a few miles on the weekends. but I followed the rules for building mileage, not a whole lot more then 10% per week.
    That's cool. I'm just jealous. It's all I can do to get in 125 miles a week this time of year. And with 2 weeks of daylight savings left.... arghh. Maybe it's time to try morning work-outs again. Just can't face the trainer yet.

    I looked up the HR range for aerobic training as % of AT in The Cyclist's Training Bible. It says 82 - 88%. Just from experience, you probably have some idea of when you're riding at your AT. So do some riding at that intensity and see what the HR says. Now you've got a ballpark number, and you can use that as a starting point. It's also a good approximate target intensity for the first time you do the 2x20 AT test.

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    rats, I have to still do that 2x20 test. does the area I do it in have to flat? or would that screw things up?

    I had a pretty good day today, and I think it might be due to some changes i made. First, I think the most important, was the coffee machine was out of regular, and I had decaf, no caffiene. also, I raised the seat a pinch, and moved my cleats forward a pinch to have the spindles directly below the balls of my feet. (before they were a bit back)

    I was able to climb some of the hills I couldn't do before at a lower heart rate, faster...i wonder if the changes I made had any effect? or was this just an odd (good) day?

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