Cyclist1092309

Hi all,
I know this may not be the right category but it seemed the best, I cycled all my life but in the last three months taken up road cycling with a proper road bike and now I am getting some lower back problems, I can feel it constantly, not bad but it is there. I am mainly concerned as I am 19 and not something you hear about often. I went to a doctor who gave me some stretches and said heat treatment or massages may help it. I was wondering if any of you had this problem and what you do to help it?
I have also looked at a back-brace and would like to know if anyone has tried it and as stupid as it sounds, does it actually help?
Thanks,
Sam

Machka 

What is your saddle like? Does your saddle curve up in the back, or is it really flat?

I cannot ride a flat saddle because I end up with lower back problems. I need a saddle that curves up in the back. Perhaps you're experiencing something similar?

Carbonfiberboy 

My guess is that your core is weak, and the cycling is showing it up. Do core exercises twice a week, see if that helps. Situps, back extensions, leg lifts, Roman chair, barbell squats, deadlifts, good mornings, all that stuff. Start easy and gradually increase over a period of weeks. Biking demands a really strong core. One wouldn't think so, you're just sitting there, right? But your core is the base of all movement.

Oh . . . and a back brace is exactly the wrong thing.

Cyclist1092309

Thanks for your help I will try to do them.
Why do you say no to the brace, a doctor told me a good sport brace?

meanwhile

Doctors prescribe a lot of treatments with very poor statistical outcomes; braces are one of them. If you have a fundamental incurable problem that requires a brace to ride a roadbike, get a different type of bike.

For now:

- Make sure you have the right frame size

- Put a MUCH shorter higher stem on that bike - and if that doesn't work, stay off it until your is stronger

- Do core exercises. I'd consider kettlebells if you can find a coach or have the experience to learn safely from a book (which as a 19 year old with core problems you probably don't.) Do NOT do sit-ups: they're now considered an unsafe exercise even for people without health problems - as well as ineffective for the muscles people think they work. (People think they're an ab exercise, but they mostly work the hip flexors, which won't help you at all.) Consider Pilates and look at

https://www.mayoclinic.com/health/core-strength/SM00047

https://www.menshealth.com/fitness/core-workout-4

Re situps - and even crunches:

- They target the contractive core muscles, which aren't the ones you need to target

- Sit-ups target the hip flexors, which attach to your vertebrae in a scary way that can create misalignment of the vertebrae and intense wear spots on the lubricating discs between them. You do NOT want this!

- The repeated movements are bad for the vertebrae:

https://www.newsweek.com/blogs/the-hu...on-t-work.html

Most of all, gather knowledge first and exercise second. Read articles from good sources, then order the books referred to. Ideas about core strength have changed a lot in the past few years and we now know that a lot of the old advice was harmful. The ultimate book (literally) is probably this:

https://www.amazon.com/Ultimate-Fitne.../dp/0973501804

..Which is probably cheaper to order from the authors website:

https://www.backfitpro.com/

Carbonfiberboy 

Huh. That's very interesting, meanwhile. I think you're right and I'm going to change my whole ab routine. I've always done crunches on a crunch bench with legs at 90°, because that particularly targets the hip flexors, which are used a lot in cycling. But maybe better to target them with the back straight, as it is in cycling. I've also noticed that cycling hits the lower abs, right in front of the bladder, while having little effect on the upper abs over the stomach.

meanwhile

Carbon - I was just about to PM you this link, as I've noticed in the past that you're interested in sports-medicine and very "evidence based." Read this article by McGill:

https://www.backfitpro.com/pdf/select..._exercises.pdf

Re. kettlebells and core fitness, "The Kettlebell Bible" has made my jaw drop with its thoroughness. One of the authors was senior PTI for the Royal Marines and seems to have spent all his time reading biochemistry and physiology papers - there's lots of good stuff on metabolic threshold and training that should apply very nicely to cycling even if you never touch a k-bell. You might need to order this book from the author's website if you want it:

https://www.intensefitness.co.uk/index.html

A really nice bonus is that k-bells have the potential to replace plyo work at a much lower injury risk - I really hesitate to do plyo anymore now that I'm out of my 30s.

Obviously, if McGill and the above disagree at any point, I'd go with McGill (I just got round to ordering my own copy - in the past I have only surfed a friend's copy, notorious cheapskate that I am.)

Anyway, I stopped doing high-rep crunches several years ago - and my abs and core are probably better than they have ever been.

Carbonfiberboy 

Thanks, meanwhile. My Golds doesn't have them, and I'm not going to buy them a set of kettlebells myself. But I will stop the crunches and start doing more pushups and Roman chair work. I can hold a plank until I get bored, so my core isn't too bad, but hard work does make my back feel better. My MRIs show old-man disc thinning, arthritic facets, and lumbar stenosis - the usual culprits. No bulging or herniated discs. Instead of 6-pack abs, I have 6-pack lower back muscles. Strong muscles to hold it all in column do seem to help.

Richard Cranium

Gee-whiz!

Get a clue - you "cycled all your life" - but now your back is hurting from your "proper road bike."

Give me a break. Clue number 1 - go get a bike that is half way [in fit comfort] between your "all my life" bike and "proper road bike." If pain persists, quit riding and restart riding in a month with your "all your life bike."

Instant message me with the results.

Cyclist1092309

Ahh thank-you, I have just thrown my brand new bike away and am going to buy a new one as I type, what a brilliant suggestion.
Good job you suggested that, I was going to waste my time doing some of the exercieses people had suggested with actual results which may help the problem, not put it off!

late

First, core exercises. I liked where that bikefitpro article was talking about butt
exercises.
https://www.youtube.com/user/Performa...92/gztBydYNEMk
https://www.youtube.com/user/Performa...93/E_coZsl0OLE
https://www.youtube.com/user/Performa...42/R7DBEjqNo8Y

Second, makes sure the bike fits properly

Third, Raise Dat Stem!

by Bob Gordon

A flat back is one of the hallmarks of an experienced cyclist, particularly a racer, and over the years I have seen the prevailing attitudes towards rider positioning devolve to the point where if you don't cycle with your back parallel to the ground, you're cast off as a beginner.

But like many other concepts recreational riders adopt, the low back originated in the professional ranks after extensive research in aerodynamics proved this would help the fast go faster. Competitive athletes routinely sacrifice both their short and long term health for the express purpose of winning, but you may have a different agenda.

Lower back disc problems peak the ages of 30 and 50. There are many causes, but if your back pain is exacerbated by riding, it's a good bet the cause is bouncing around on your bike while your lower spine is extensively flexed (loss of lower back arch). A low, forward torso causes the inner portion of the disc (the nucleus purposes) to press back against the outer restraining fibers (the annulus fibroses). This pressure eventually causes the disc to bulge or herniate. The nearby nerves get squeezed, and the next thing you know, someone like me is telling you you have sciatica.

Cycling mitigates some of the problems of a habitually flexed lumbar spine because of the "bridge effect" that's created by resting some of your weight on your hands. But the lumbar region and its soft tissues are still at risk just by being continuously hyper flexed, and if you sit all day at your job, the danger is compounded.

On the flip side, cycling entirely upright does not solve the problem either. True, the inter-vertebral discs and spinal ligaments are in a more neutral position and absorb shock better, but the load is now transmitted axially, which is fatiguing and jarring. Also, in a bolt-upright position you can't use your gluteus or hamstrings to great advantage, which means your thighs (quadriceps) get overworked, you lose a lot of power, the unused hamstrings and gluteal muscles go flabby, and you catch all that wind. It's hard to be happy about all that, racer or no.

There is, however, a position that allows good performance while minimizing risk of lower back injury. I like a stem height and length that puts your back about 50 degrees from horizontal, while your arms and legs bend slightly at the elbows, as shown in figure 2 up there. To achieve this, you'll probably have to raise your bars, and assuming you want to keep the same bar style (as opposed to riding with stingray bars or something), that usually means getting another stem, one with a taller quill or a steep rise to it. If you hit the sweet spot, a photo of you from the side will reveal a nice pyramid composed of top tube, torso and arms.'

meanwhile

Also: you can get most of the benefits of that comfort-fit road bike by fitting that shorter and higher stem that I mentioned. In the UK I'd suggest that you buy a Cammish flippable TT stem - flipped in the up position these give a 55 degree angle. The reduction in reach and back stress is considerable, you can fit one in a couple of minutes with an allen key, and they cost only $50, compared to, say, $2000 for a comfort fit Trek Madone...

Richard Cranium

Sure. You deserve bad advice. "work your core" - yeah, that works best when you are ready to ride your "proper road bike."

Luckily, you have pretty time to get things right, and trying new exercises while having back issues is just what Doctor Dick Cranium thinks you deserve.