Sixty Fiver

You might be surprised.

Sixty Fiver

This is what humans are designed for... endurance.

A lower carb diet still allows for shorter intervals of intense activities like sprinting which is a good evolutionary adaptation for catching food or not becoming food... but we are much better at marathons.

I was joking with some vegan friends that the only reason we evolved to be able to eat fruit, vegetables, and grain was so that we might be able to catch our next meal and survive periods where we were not able to eat meat.

Sixty Fiver

After we have spent a good amount of time on a low and lower carb diet where my gorgeous wife has gotten curvier and curvier we have some real numbers.

This low carb / higher protein / higher fat diet that contains very little sugar or processed foods and almost no grains has given us both rather excellent numbers when it comes to LDL/HDL/total cholesterol and our lipid ratios are excellent. Our triglyceride numbers are also very low which is usually associated with a low fat diet and desirable if one is looking to reduce risk factors for coronary disease / stroke.

Thing is, we don't eat a low fat diet and my wife's C-Reactive levels have also dropped which shows a decrease in inflammatory issues that were elevated because of inflammatory issues related to an illness she is recovering from.

Machka 

So what do some of your usual meals look like?


When I think high protein/high fat McDonalds leaps to mind.

Sixty Fiver

We don't eat at McD's.

Breakfast is 2 scrambled eggs with a little cheddar for my wife or a small bowl of oatmeal for me as I consume more carbs, she is on a much lower carb diet than me. I put thick cream in my coffee and she adds a tablespoon of coconut oil.

If it is not eggs or oatmeal, we eat whole fat yogurt... low fat yogurt tastes like plastic.

I make bacon and eggs a few times a week.

Lunch is usually leftovers from dinner which is usually meat and vegetables and we don't shy away from fattier cuts, most times we roast or poach instead of frying, we make a lot of soups and stews, we love liver, but avoid organ meats like kidney, and purchase sausage and liverwurst and sauerkraut from our local Polish market which are also favourites.

I probably eat 1/3 to 1/2 a cup of almonds over the course of a day.

We love cheese.

It may be more important to note what we do not eat... most grains, hydrogenated oils, fruit juice, sodas, sugar, processed foods, pasta, and potatoes are not staple items here and my wife almost never snacks between meals. We limit fruit in favour of more low carb vegetables so we don't buy a lot of carrots.

Olive oil, coconut oil, and saturated fat like lard get used for cooking.

Tonight we will have a few 4-5 oz steaks served with a side of spinach... dinner never includes starches.

After that we might enjoy a finger of Scotch and every once in a while a little bit of dark chocolate is nice.

Saturday mornings I go to the Hungarian deli to grab some fried bacon and spicy sausage for my mid day meal.

I try to limit carbs to <100 grams a day... it does not bother me as much to go over as it does my wife but I have a higher metabolism and a normal thyroid.

Neither of us is diabetic or has any high risk factors for heart attack / stroke... my wife's lack of a thyroid causes metabolic issues as the synthetic hormone does not work like the real thing in regulating blood sugar.

We prefer savoury over sweet and it appears to be working based on those numbers.

Machka 

That list of food leaves me feeling a bit queasy!! I would hate a diet like that. My gallbladder aches just looking at it.


But if it works for you ...

It is a very Albertan diet.

Sixty Fiver

I forgot that we also have fish 1-2 times a week and should have pointed out we don't eat rice or rice pasta either.

I don't think that a diet that is void of grains, fruit juices, sodas of any kind, hydrogenated oils, margarine, processed foods, and sugar is very Albertan.

Machka 

After 13 years in Manitoba where many people I knew, including me of course, were vegetarian or semi-vegetarian, I returned to Alberta where meals consisted of meat.

As soon as I got to Alberta the "What would you like for dinner?" question became ... "What would you like for dinner ... steak or roast?"

It was a confusing question for me because I didn't want either steak or roast, and I was much more interested in what else might be served in the way of pasta, rice and veggies ... but in some cases, there wasn't much else ... just a big slab of meat.

Sixty Fiver

Manitoba is also meat and potatoes country... vegetarians are their own smaller demographic there just as they are here.

Last night we had roasted chicken (legs and backs) with a smaller portion of peas (starchy little beasts), we usually make extra chicken for the next day's lunch but today we enjoyed some liverwurst.

I became a vegetarian after a long stint working in the restaurant business... part of our employment was a staff meal every night that could be prime rib or a nice strip loin with a full side of baked potatoes and veggies.

Now I can enjoy that prime rib from time to time and love a good steak.

Our favourite meatless meal is Greek salad which is very complete nutritionally save for starches which we don't eat much of anyways.

Machka 

There just seemed to be more variety in Winnipeg ... more variety in restaurants etc. Not as many steakhouses. Not such an emphasis on meat.

So ... why did you stop being a vegetarian?

Sixty Fiver

The people in the support group pissed me off so I ate them.

Sixty Fiver

Seriously... my body seems to prefer my omnivorous diet and I like my steak cooked rare.

Machka 

Well, like I said ... if it works for you ...


Personally, the less meat I eat, the better I feel. For me ... bring on the whole grains, veggies, fruit, and a limited quantity of nuts. And chocolate ... I do like my chocolate.

On that type of diet, I have lost a lot of weight and my blood numbers are good.

Two years ago, I lost 13 lbs in 13 weeks by eating fruit for morning snack, a bowl of veggies for lunch, a small quantity of crackers and cheese for afternoon snack, and usually a veggie and whole grain dinner.

When this thread started, I made some modifications to my diet (more veggies and whole grains, less meat and high fat foods) because of high trigycerides ... and I've dropped a little over 2 kg.

Sixty Fiver

Food for thought...

The most effective way for most people to decrease triglycerides is to lower the amount of carbohydrates in their diet as these are the biggest culprit in the western diet... not fat, which has been demonized.

The surge in diabetes and metabolic syndrome started when we were told that a low fat diet that was high in fruit and grains was healthy for us and along with the reduction in dietary fat, we saw a huge increase in the amount of sugar in all kinds of foods.

Does anyone actually like low fat yogurt or skim milk ?

Butter and lard (which has a better lipid profile than butter) were replaced by hydrogenated oils which are used in the production of all kinds of food... these are high in bad Omega 6 fatty acids while a diet that includes saturated fats and oils like olive oil is high in Omega 3's which is what the Mediterranean diet is all about.

I am not a strong believer in the lipid hypothesis but lean toward the theory that a diet that has a lot of refined foods, sugar, and an excessive amount of grains is the reason we are in the place we are now.

For as much as you don't like to hear it, there is more and more evidence showing that diet sodas cause many long term health issues... a person who drinks a few glasses of diet soda a day is 5 times as likely to become obese... apparently the zero carbs aren't the problem but it is how the artificial sweeteners fake out the brain.

A higher protein diet is more filling and digesting protein also requires more energy to convert than sugars and fats which our bodies are very good at processing... that protein does not have to be animal based but it is a little harder to pull off if you are a pure vegetarian and do not eat eggs or cheese.

We are all different so I only speak to this is general terms in that for most it seems that reducing the carbs and realizing that all carbs are not the same will lead to better health... one potato will cause blood sugar spikes that last for hours as those complex starches convert to sugar and then the body has to figure out to do with that and whatever else went along with it. Bread does the same thing and it does not matter of it is whole grain or Wonderbread

Potatoes are of course, most often served at dinner and consuming excess starches late in the day tends to be bad for everyone... my morning oatmeal is the most significant amount of carbs I take in during the day and that is done early.

I was quite fascinated by my recent blood work as was my physician as he is aware of the dietary changes we have made.

We also have friends who have been struggling with weight issues and related health problems and they have adopted a lower carb diet and seen marvelous results... I know Markets and his 50 pound weight loss is rather excellent.

My wife has dropped over 30 pounds without even thinking about it... as a celiac she does not eat wheat and avoids most grains and her weight loss really started when she adopted what is a very low carb and ketogenic diet.

Now she feels ill if she eats too many carbs as her body has switched gears and burns fat... she has never looked better or felt better in her adult life and she has always been active and healthy. Other people she knows who have had thyroid cancer and rely on synthetic hormones are now starting to see the benefits of a low carb diet as they watch the extra pounds fall away.

elcruxio

Being low carb is... well, functional for some. I would say it very largely depends on the person, genetics and interestingly, regionality.
I mean I'm the type who advocates good balance of everything with carbs amounting to about 1.5-2 grams per ideal weight kilo. With me that would amount to about 150g per day. I don't get there very often but then again beggars can't be choosers (student cafeteria food is by no means low or even medium carb).
a few thoughts
1) Ketogenic diets are very good for short periods of time for generally healthy people looking to lose weight. By no chance would I advocate them for a lifestyle choice in general even if there are people doing it and remaining healthy. Because as current science would have it, it might be good for you, it might not have an affect or it could destroy your health in short order. It quite wholly depends on personal qualities. Hence short periods of time for most.

2) low carb is cool as a lifestyle choice. But what seems to be in the heads of most low carbers is that they can eat all the meat they want. This is wrong. Firstly meat is not very environmentally friendly. It requires a lot more resources than growing veggies. Secondly too high meat consumption has been linked to various kinds of cancer, especially with fried meat. Hence the short periods of time in the ketogenic diet. As with all stuff moderation should be key with meat consumption. Proteins can be had from plant matter quite easily and with those one gains other cool stuff aka. antioxidants, vitamins etc.

3) medium carb is cool also if the low carb is too stressful. This again depends on the person. Some people just get cranky if they don't get the carbs they need. Low carb does affect people differently and it doesn't suit everyone whatever anyone says. Saying the crankiness will end over time is not sound advice for everyone. Best way is to just try it. Trying nutritional stuff can be fun and doesn't require much.

4) High carb should be reserved for those who really need it and can handle the carbs. This means those who really train hard and/or are amateur or pro racers. For a normal person a high carb diet can be damaging and in the end can result to damage in the insulin metabolism system and type 2 diabetes. Insulin sensitivity need to be maintained if high carb doses are consumed regularly as not to stress the pancreas too much. Best way to do this is by a lot of training with a noticeable part of it in extremely high intensities. High carb needs to be seen as fuel and you musn't fill the tank if you're not going to drive hard. Carbs are required during the exercise event and after it during recovery. Muscles depleted of fuel need to be filled before proper recovery can begin.

The dangers of cholesterol have been linked to high carb consumption and the inflammatory reaction in the blood system caused by chronic high blood glucose levels. Also to me it feels right now quite unclear what are the true effects of cholesterol, serum lipid levels etc. I would like to believe that high cholesterol is bad and low is good but then again some controversial research has come up. What seems to be the best course at this point is to stay conservative until something with real traction comes up. AKA high LDL with low HDL is bad. If the overall cholesterol is high it does not matter if the ratio of HDL and LDL is in order. And keeping your blood glucose on high levels is bad as is unnecessary spikes to that system (read, sodas, candy, pastries etc.)

Saying that the human body was "designed" for some diet or the other is flawed in so many ways. There are regional changes in diets for which the local populace has adapted to. The Japanese fare well with white rice, the mediterranean people do well with pasta. Americans seem to have the capability for meat which would make me puke. There are so many variations to people that one particular diet can in no way satisfy all variables. That is the reason I particularly don't like the paleo diet since it has more ideology than actual nutritional sense. People ate what they could back in the day. Saying that food is optimal for us now is a logical fallacy which mixes causality and correlation.

Well. This grew into a rant. Maybe a wrong topic but then again I can always copy paste this to other threads

Machka 

Love it! Well, not the milk ... my digestive system doesn't like milk in general ... but if I do drink milk it is often low fat or skim. I also like low fat cheese. I prefer it to regular cheese. And when I choose low fat things, I check to make sure that they are also low sugar. In fact, I'm looking forward to a small bowl of low fat, low sugar strawberry yogurt for evening desert in an hour or so.

I don't like consuming excess sugar in my food (unless it is a specifically sweet item, like chocolate). For example, I would drink soy or rice milk, but they put sugar in it, and I'd rather not drink my sugar. And I don't eat much in the way of refined foods. When I talk about whole grains, I'm talking about whole grains. I'm not talking about some sort of highly processed substance which indicates on the packaging that it might have been a whole grain at one point in its life. As I said in an earlier post, there is a difference between processed & sweetened foods and real whole grains.

I rarely eat potatoes, although the occasional meal consisting of a baked potato topped with tuna, melted cheese and salad is nice. Mashed potatoes topped with melted cheese can be nice once in a while too. But the potato dishes tend to be once-a-month treats, which is just fine.

When I choose bread, I prefer something a little higher quality ... with actual grains and sometimes even seeds and nuts in it.

And contrary to popular belief ... I don't drink only diet pop. It's one of many low fat, low sugar things I drink.


As I've already mentioned, if the high protein, high fat diet works for you .... that's great. To me it looks like a recipe for bowel cancer, and I know I'd be sick on that sort of diet, but evidently you've found a winning combination.

I'll stick to my delicious grains and veggies and low-fat food.

Happily, the angiogram I had done on Monday showed that my heart and surrounding arteries are in great condition ... among the best my cardiologist has ever seen. Not a speck of artery clogging and it appears that my valves have improved over the past 8 years too. Must be doing something right.

elcruxio

I have not noticed such an effect from either bread or potato. Carbs are digested fairly quickly and more so when talking about potato which just melts right away. What does slow carb digestion is high fat and protein within the meal.
I would say a potato has an effect of max 2 hours. Less even but I rarely eat just the potato so it's hard to tell. I am willing to accede that it does create a spike in blood sugar since it has a very high glycemic index but that spike can be blunted with other foodstuffs (like protein, fat and lost of veggies which level out blood sugar levels) Dark bread has a longer tail but also a lower spike as it consists of long carb chains. I find the longer tail a good thing as I don't go hypo immediately after the effect stops.

Also the human insulin system is very effective in handling blood sugar spikes in well balanced meals. But as I stated in my earlier post, the insulin system needs to be taken care of. Pure carb snacks and very high carb meals are going to stress the system needlessly. A well balanced diet of lots of veggies, moderate to low amounts of carbs and normal amounts of protein and good fats are good starting points for everyone I feel.

I think we can all agree that processed foods are just the worst. Too much salt, bad fats etc.

Carbonfiberboy 

That's good to hear! Bravo. I never heard of valves improving.

We eat about the same as you. My bedtime snack is straight whey or whey/casein protein. The yogurt would be good, too. We have 2 little squares of 70%+ chocolate for dessert every night. Not sweet. We drink no soda. Wine with dinner guests, one beer/week. We drink herb tea instead of soda. All sorts of herbs for variety. Rooibos (The No. 1 Ladies' Detective Agency) is nice, camomile, mints, etc.

GeorgeBMac

Let me join Carbon' in saying congrats on the good news! That is not only good news, it is unusual news -- we seldom hear that!

And, I just received some good news myself. I just got the results of the lipid panel I took last week and:
Total: 125
LDL: 56
HDL: 59
TriG: 78

I have been taking a statin since 1996 when my total was 290+ and the LDL was 195 -- so this was quite a drop.

My previous score in July was a total of 158, LDL of 78, and HDL of 65 which I thought was pretty respectable. But, following that I switched to a whole foods, plant based diet which brought it down even more.

So, now I'm waiting for a call from my cardiologist hoping he will tell me to stop taking the Crestor I am on. And, that will be very good news because I have had far too many bad affects from those drugs and, the only good thing they have done for me is keep me alive and keep my heart in fairly good shape (so I'm not complaining). But I will be glad to be rid of them.

bobthib

I think the days of the low fat/cholesterol myth are coming to an end. It takes a long time for the stodgy medical community to change, but change it will. Statins have a place, but probably 1/10 of what is not scripted.

To the OPs question, the calculator is fraught with poor assumptions, and fails to consider vital factors. The only good thing I can say about it is that it may get some people to wake up and do something. Unfortunately, I doubt if most of the medical community really knows what to tell them to do. And wholesale statins are not the answer.

wolfchild

I eat tons of fermented dairy such as kefir, yogurt, different types of cheese and I also drink milk. I only use full fat and I don't like anything low fat. I also enjoy making my own yogurt at home. I've been eating saturated fat from animal products all my life and I never get overweight. Animal fat is good stuff.

springs

Sixty Fiver, would you mind posting your cholesterol and trig numbers? After all that good detail on what you eat, it would be interesting.

Fat Boy

In truth, his total cholesterol number really doesn't matter. Total cholesterol is a poor measure of cardiovascular health and if you're looking at health as a whole, a number that is clinically 'high' is probably better. Those with higher cholesterol tend to have fewer cognition problems later in life (dementia, alzheimer's, etc.). The HDL number is worthwhile to look at (higher is better). The LDL number must be a measured number (it's generally calculated) and that number should include a way to measure average particle size. The LDL particles that are large and buoyant do not appear to be a problem where as the small hard particles cause inflammation and are very much a problem. Triglycerides are very good predictor of cardiovascular health.

For me, if a trig. number is over maybe 85 (definitely by 100), then you need to back off the carbs. The clinical 'normal' range goes to 150, though.

I think 65er is spot on for his diet. He might be running ketogenic, maybe not. I know if I go that low, my riding goes to hell (although I feel good and I can lift weights no problem). Any workout that goes down the glycolyic path, though, suffers. This really isn't too big of a surprise.

For breakfast this morning I had a 6-7 oz. piece of salmon left over from last night with a little salsa on the top and a small handful of walnuts. Whether you're on the low-carb bandwagon or not, I think most people would be hard pressed to throw too many stones at this. It's a pretty common style of breakfast for me.

Sixty Fiver

George is beating me on the LDL number but I don't take any medications that would take that lower that.

LDL: 3.2 (125 US Scale)
HDL: 1.63 (70 US)
TriG: .73 (30 US) Probably one of the most important measurements.
Total: 5.27 (225 US)
Ratio: 3.2

All of these numbers are considered to be ideal to excellent for a person with no risk factors for heart disease (Canada Guidelines)... under other circumstances my LDL might get some doctors to prescribe Statins but my doctor isn't worried at all and I'm not worried.

The other important stuff...

My BP is 99/70 and fasting blood sugars are right in the middle of normal, resting pulse is usually around 55.

People also tell me I look like I have been working out a lot... and the cholesterol numbers are really not that important unless you actually suffer from hyperlidosis and have contributing risk factors for heart disease / stroke. When I have been at the gym my stamina for weight repeats (80% of max) has been nearly endless.

Tonight we are having stewed beef heart and braised spinach for dinner... I will toss some roasted almonds into the spinach to kick it up a notch and we will make a little rice for the girls.

I had a busy day today as I had to go for medical tests this morning and into the afternoon... I have not eaten since 7am (eggs and a little bacon) and am only now feeling a little peckish but won't be eating until about 7.

My 12 hour fasting results would indicate that this is not an issue for me... I simply don't bonk since I adopted this lifestyle and shouldn't if I am doing things right.

Sixty Fiver

When we consume excessive carbohydrates these get converted into saturated fat... this is how our bodies roll and develop rolls.

Our brains are made up of saturated fat.

Saturated only means that the fat is a stable one.