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-   -   Low Carb / Paleo Weirdos Check In Here (http://www.bikeforums.net/training-nutrition/930349-low-carb-paleo-weirdos-check-here.html)

Sixty Fiver 05-03-14 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lenA (Post 16659283)
Nice and energy dense. You got me moving on this but I decided to purchase some dessicated coconut and try to mix up some of my own concoctions

"The fresh meats are carefully dehydrated to retain the full natural flavor and white color. During processing of the coconut, nothing is added and only the moisture is removed."


Remember when the veggie oil peddlers went on an all out blitz to put up barriers against the use of coconut (and palm) oil? Their packaging screamed NO TROPICAL OILS!

A little tip on the creamed coconut... it can separate a little and if you are eating it straight up like we do, you can put it in a bowl of warm water (while it is still sealed) and re-blend the coconut and then chill it so that it becomes a solid block again.

We have laid in a pretty good stock here and I have put some in the vehicles as an emergency ration as it stores really well.

Sixty Fiver 05-03-14 08:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Machka (Post 16724321)
Just letting you know how it is used in the current sense.
Just suggesting that a more genuinely complimentary term could be found. :)

The compliment are genuine... my wife has this thing for language and knows exactly what I mean.

The world can get stuffed for taking all these perfectly good words and co-opting them to suit their own purposes.

bmc11 05-11-14 01:39 AM

Paleo Diet & Rides
 
So I pretty much follow the paleo diet with 0 to minimal carbs especially during summer time....I I feel like I'm bonkin a little and I'm sure my legs endurance isn't the greatest yet (just started a month or two ago). Just wondering what people eat the night before that tend to follow paleo lifestyle. I'm not completely against eating carbs the night before just figured i throw this up, Im sure someone else has to have dealt with this....open to suggestions. thanks

Rowan 05-11-14 02:26 AM

Maybe you should post in this thread:

http://www.bikeforums.net/training-n...heck-here.html

with your questions.

carnivroar 05-11-14 06:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver (Post 16658892)
Here is a really good snack... people re-constitute this for cooking but it can also be eaten like a candy bar without consuming a butt load of sugar and it costs less than a chocolate bar too.

http://www.caribbeangroceries.com/me...nut-200g_2.gif

I can see this as being perfect road food.

I love this stuff! I get the organic brand. If I were to eat during my rides, this would be my number 1 choice of snack.

bikebreak 05-12-14 08:50 AM

Did you guys catch the write up in the WSJ last week?

The Questionable Link Between Saturated Fat and Heart Disease - WSJ.com

bikebreak 05-12-14 08:56 AM

personally I eat low carb on days I am not biking, because when I ride I want to ride fast and need carbs for anaerobic efforts.
If you just started doing paleo or only do it in the summer it takes a while to adapt to fat burning.

lenA 05-12-14 09:49 AM

I did read that and other recent reports on the same topics.

The number of nutritional falsehoods we've been subject to the last 50 years in almost beyond belief.

carnivroar 05-12-14 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmc11 (Post 16747611)
So I pretty much follow the paleo diet with 0 to minimal carbs especially during summer time....I I feel like I'm bonkin a little and I'm sure my legs endurance isn't the greatest yet (just started a month or two ago). Just wondering what people eat the night before that tend to follow paleo lifestyle. I'm not completely against eating carbs the night before just figured i throw this up, Im sure someone else has to have dealt with this....open to suggestions. thanks

I eat 3/4 lb of grassfed liver the night before, and coconut oil in the morning. Those are my "key" foods.

And be careful, this forum is not friendly towards low-carb/paleo - my thread was closed because it was about low-carb: http://www.bikeforums.net/training-n...-low-carb.html

robabeatle 05-12-14 11:55 AM

Eat carbs: sweet potatoes, beets, etc.

Sixty Fiver 05-12-14 12:02 PM

Just want re-welcome any more LCHF folks who wish to share their thoughts, results, and ideas.

Went out on the weekend and visited the family and consumed more than my usual amount of carbohydrates and felt like death yesterday, after eating right all day yesterday and getting my day started right I feel much more like my usual self.

We picked up a small milk frother for making our morning bullet proof coffee and this makes it even better.

bmc11 05-12-14 01:30 PM

@bikebreak ... My bad I meant I just started cycling, not paleo... Pretty athletic played soccer my whole life and been lifting weights for years... I follow paleo year round but I am def a lot stricter around summer time for ladies...haha I know kinda dumb but I'm in my prime gotta live these years up as well!
@robabeatle ...beets I never really eat but I eat sweet potatoes daily, maybe just not enough w new routine ill make sure start eating more of em... Cycling is a whole new ball game then what I'm used to

IronHorseRiderX 05-12-14 04:13 PM

Dragging from another thread http://www.bikeforums.net/training-n...l#post16749832
Quote:

Originally Posted by carnivroar (Post 16749304)
The higher the intensity, the more glycogen is used. I'm not arguing that.

So what are you arguing then?

No one cares about subpair performance.
As many stated here there's nothing special about riding slow for that long and many done that without any issues.

If you want results you have to go fast/faster than competition.

There's not much clear evidence suggesting that HF/Paleo diet help with that, if it did ALL top athletes in endurance sports would switch to such diet right away!
The current level of competition is very high and if such advantage would be feasible it would simply allow one to wipe out the rest of the competition field.

Shifting metabolism towards better fat utilization seems to be not easy to do and there's not many studies done on that.

Here's the link Joe Friel - Becoming a Better Fat Burner
Notice that he mention Paleo diet along with fasted training but gains are not that great to brag about.

It looks like there's some well know athletes already following HF diet Cream Diet | biomac so perhaps soon there will be more evidence.

carnivroar 05-12-14 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IronHorseRiderX (Post 16752513)
Dragging from another thread http://www.bikeforums.net/training-n...l#post16749832

So what are you arguing then?

No one cares about subpair performance.
As many stated here there's nothing special about riding slow for that long and many done that without any issues.

If you want results you have to go fast/faster than competition.

There's not much clear evidence suggesting that HF/Paleo diet help with that, if it did ALL top athletes in endurance sports would switch to such diet right away!
The current level of competition is very high and if such advantage would be feasible it would simply allow one to wipe out the rest of the competition field.

Shifting metabolism towards better fat utilization seems to be not easy to do and there's not many studies done on that.

Here's the link Joe Friel - Becoming a Better Fat Burner
Notice that he mention Paleo diet along with fasted training but gains are not that great to brag about.

It looks like there's some well know athletes already following HF diet Cream Diet | biomac so perhaps soon there will be more evidence.

I'm arguing that low-carb is perfectly fine, if not better, for this type of endurance training.

I used to train for powerlifting (I squatted 405lbs, deadlifted 455lbs, and benched 275lbs), so I know what's it's like to be glycogen depleted and how it affects anaerobic performance. However, it's not an issue with long distance cycling (say, a century at 15 mph average).

But then again, I have only been doing these long rides once a week. Which is all I have time for anyways, with my job and school. I'm not aspiring to be an athlete and I never argued that MY approach (very low carb) is ideal for pro atheletes.

He's a top endurance athlete who follows paleo: Timothy Allen Olson Ultra Trail Mountain Runner

He says he eats more carbs (from sweet potatoes) before a race.

There are many reasons why other athletes in his class don't follow his example, and it's NOT because it's a bad regimen. It's just that there's too much misinformation out there.

--

I just bought a bike computer thing so I can track my speed more accurately. Hope I get it by Friday.

IronHorseRiderX 05-12-14 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnivroar (Post 16753022)
I'm arguing that low-carb is perfectly fine, if not better, for this type of endurance training.

I used to train for powerlifting (I squatted 405lbs, deadlifted 455lbs, and benched 275lbs), so I know what's it's like to be glycogen depleted and how it affects anaerobic performance. However, it's not an issue with long distance cycling.

I do not know much about powerlifting but those are some serious numbers, especially BP - what was your own weight at that time?
My best ever deadlift was 320lbs @ 160 lbs own weight and I was able to benchpress my own 160lbs for 7 times max (180lbs for 1 rep max which is a joke - I know :) ).
I had decent results following this Intermittent fasting diet for fat loss, muscle gain and health and generally stay on low-carb for days when I'm not riding.

Thru my own experience I can tell that anything under 1h of max effort can be done with no food at all.
I do rides like this one Bike Ride Profile | 5/3/14 Danville, CA. Diablo #38 with the wind at my back! I predict lot's of PR on Strava today :) near Danville | Times and Records | Strava with no food at all.
Drink some latte to wake up and go.
Entire ride is done on one 16oz Gatoaid and 10gr of BCAA.
There's only an hour of actual hard riding - climbing to Strava Segment | Athenian School (South Gate) to summit W/O the piddle paddle in the parking lot at the top!!! the rest is easy/moderate riding.
Eating anything (especially fat/protein) before that ride is very counter productive - that is a fact for me.

Now it is quite different if I try to ride solo or with fast group at my lunch time.
Example Bike Ride Profile | . Very windy Palomares. near Pleasanton | Times and Records | Strava the ride is essentially same as far as total time & distance goes, with 1,000ft less of climbing yet due to faster pace I usually start running our of gas on the way back.
If I eat half a bagel some 3 hour before that ride and in the middle of the ride one GU Energy Gel Amazon.com: GU Original Sports Nutrition Energy Gel, Variety Pack, 24-Count: Health & Personal Care which is only 100 cal and has 40mg of caffeine it makes very noticeable difference. I can sustain comparable power thru entire ride (even it drops some 5-10% on the climb back) which was not possible before.
Therefore I could not care less for all the science - my own experience clearly tells me that for continuous moderate to max effort rides I need some carbs.
Simple as that.

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnivroar (Post 16753022)
He's a top endurance athlete who follows paleo: Timothy Allen Olson Ultra Trail Mountain Runner
There are many reasons why other athletes in his class don't follow his example, and it's NOT because it's a bad regimen. It's just that there's too much misinformation out there.

Still too few examples.
I'll wait to see until some high paid pros do that - those guys usually do their homework very well.

cvskates 05-12-14 08:07 PM

I'm down 50 pounds since I got married, 30 of those in the last 6 months . Tried a lot of diets, and so far wheat free is working great for me. I didn't try to get on a specific LCHF or paleo diet, but based on reading here that's pretty close to what I'm doing.

Can't get over how great I feel, and how my cravings disappeared. Wife says her skin is clearer. Love this diet.

Weatherby 05-12-14 08:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnivroar (Post 16753022)
I'm arguing that low-carb is perfectly fine, if not better, for this type of endurance training.

I used to train for powerlifting (I squatted 405lbs, deadlifted 455lbs, and benched 275lbs), so I know what's it's like to be glycogen depleted and how it affects anaerobic performance. However, it's not an issue with long distance cycling (say, a century at 15 mph average).

But then again, I have only been doing these long rides once a week. Which is all I have time for anyways, with my job and school. I'm not aspiring to be an athlete and I never argued that MY approach (very low carb) is ideal for pro atheletes.

He's a top endurance athlete who follows paleo: Timothy Allen Olson Ultra Trail Mountain Runner

He says he eats more carbs (from sweet potatoes) before a race.

There are many reasons why other athletes in his class don't follow his example, and it's NOT because it's a bad regimen. It's just that there's too much misinformation out there.

--

I just bought a bike computer thing so I can track my speed more accurately. Hope I get it by Friday.


He is not a Paleo.

Quote:

I donít like labels and would not call myself low-carb, paleo, etc. I would say that I follow a diet with more protein & fat and less carbs than most people and that it has helped me recover faster, reduce inflammation and overall just feel healthier......[ During a race I stick to 100-200 calories an hour with gels and at the later stages of a race I might drink some Sierra Mist or Coke................/
Nutrition Timothy Allen Olson

carnivroar 05-12-14 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IronHorseRiderX (Post 16753157)
I do not know much about powerlifting but those are some serious numbers, especially BP - what was your own weight at that time?
My best ever deadlift was 320lbs @ 160 lbs own weight and I was able to benchpress my own 160lbs for 7 times max (180lbs for 1 rep max which is a joke - I know :) ).
I had decent results following this Intermittent fasting diet for fat loss, muscle gain and health and generally stay on low-carb for days when I'm not riding.

I was 200 lbs and pretty fat at my peak when I set those records. That was 3 years ago, now I'm back down to ~150 lbs, my regular weight (I'm 5'8).

Back then I was already in the paleo bandwagon but performance was my number 1 priority. Somedays I used to get 4 double cheeseburgers at MacDonald after lifting (and throw out half of the bread, if course :p).

carnivroar 05-12-14 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weatherby (Post 16753272)

Close enough. Low-carb, high-fat, grass-fed meat, etc; he is "paleo" for all practical purposes. I'm not paleo either (I eat tons of dairy) but it's what I identify with the most.

IronHorseRiderX 05-12-14 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnivroar (Post 16753281)
I was 200 lbs and pretty fat at my peak when I set those records. That was 3 years ago, now I'm back down to ~150 lbs, my regular weight (I'm 5'8).

I trust those are impressive numbers for 200lbs athlete, may be not very competitive but impressive for many gym-goers for sure.
May I ask you why you decided to stop lifting?
I bet you can still lift some serious weight - in relation to you own weight.

Btw best way to track your performance is to get free strava.com account.
They have free apps for your Android/Apple phones to record rides and show realtime speed and many other gps-derived data.
Still I would definitely get hart rate monitor (HRM) since you so concerned with endurance it may very helpful for you.
You can get HRM for iPhone / Android for $50, like this one Amazon.com: Wahoo Blue HR Heart Rate Monitor for iPhone and Android: Sports & Outdoors

carnivroar 05-12-14 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IronHorseRiderX (Post 16753316)
I trust those are impressive numbers for 200lbs athlete, may be not very competitive but impressive for many gym-goers for sure.
May I ask you why you decided to stop lifting?
I bet you can still lift some serious weight - in relation to you own weight.

Btw best way to track your performance is to get free strava.com account.
They have free apps for your Android/Apple phones to record rides and show realtime speed and many other gps-derived data.
Still I would definitely get hart rate monitor (HRM) since you so concerned with endurance it may very helpful for you.
You can get HRM for iPhone / Android for $50, like this one Amazon.com: Wahoo Blue HR Heart Rate Monitor for iPhone and Android: Sports & Outdoors

I got too busy with school and I was finding very hard to maintain my strength, let alone improve. Then some ******* stole my lifting shoes and that was the straw that broke the camel's back. :p

Slowhead 05-12-14 10:15 PM

I made some dietary changes about two years ago. It was obvious I was at least wheat intolerant and had an auto immune disease. Things became better after I went wheat-free and dialed way back on corn, dairy and soy. I was still eating too many carbohydrates. Meals were built around rolled oats, sweet potatoes and brown rice. I cut back on the carbohydrates and added more quality meat to my diet. The meats and coconut products (creamed, oil and milk) has raised the amount of fat in my diet and my overall health has slowly continued to improve. I try to eat most of my fruits and vegetables in season and fresh.
Planning ahead is very important so I don't have to rely on convenience food while away from home. I have been able to train and exercise with more intensity.
On the downside, I drink a fair amount of caffeine. I roast coffee beans at home and enjoy quality teas. I do eat semi sweet chocolate baking chips and cheap natural peanut butter (with palm oil) in small quantities.

CbadRider 05-12-14 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rowan (Post 16747632)
Maybe you should post in this thread:

http://www.bikeforums.net/training-n...heck-here.html

with your questions.

The threads have been merged.

Please keep all of the low carb/paleo posts in this thread instead of starting new ones. Thanks for your cooperation.

CbadRider
Forum Admin

Weatherby 05-13-14 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carnivroar (Post 16753294)
Close enough. Low-carb, high-fat, grass-fed meat, etc; he is "paleo" for all practical purposes. I'm not paleo either (I eat tons of dairy) but it's what I identify with the most.

Fair enough. I avoid dairy and all grains getting most of my carbs from vegetables. Grass fed meat, fish, local farm eggs, and various meat that I shoot myself.

Interestingly, I was losing 3 pound per week when on a 50g carb per day regimen and riding exclusively in Z1 and Z2. I upped the intensity and distances, which required carbs to fuel. Weight loss stopped. I lost 42 pounds from Jan 1 until around April 13. I have not lost anything since then although I have gotten fitter. It is because I replace what I lose on rides. Long and steady Z2 rides in a mild state of ketosis melts the fat right off your body. I am soon going to stop the intensity rides and work on getting the remaining 25 lbs off. On a "Paleo-like" diet and LSD, it will be gone in 2 months.

BigAura 05-13-14 06:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bikebreak (Post 16750882)
Did you guys catch the write up in the WSJ last week?

The Questionable Link Between Saturated Fat and Heart Disease - WSJ.com

Written by somebody selling a book (DUH!):

Ms. Teicholz has been researching dietary fat and disease for nearly a decade. Her book, "The Big Fat Surprise: Why Butter, Meat and Cheese Belong in a Healthy Diet," will be published by Simon & Schuster on May 13.

Here's a rebuttal, written by a MD at Yale:




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