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Training & Nutrition Learn how to develop a training schedule that's good for you. What should you eat and drink on your ride? Learn everything you need to know about training and nutrition here.

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Old 05-13-14, 07:05 AM   #351
lenA
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I guess if you look at training as being synonymous with improving competitive performance, then one might be reluctant to evaluate LCHFMP ( low carb, high fat, moderate protein) in that context based on the bulk of current scientific research into this way of eating. I hung up my cleats many years ago, but I probably would feel the same way if I was a competitive athlete.

I think what some of us are trying to point out is that we have been led down a nutritional path for years that has just plain not worked for many people and that there are better choices.


I read about and research this way of eating (WOE) every day, and every day there are scientists, doctors, athletes and other who realize, some reluctantly, that this is not a passing fad, but a potential paradigm shift away from a carbohydrate dominated diet.

I believe that there are just too many success stories for this WOE to be dismissed offhandedly as some do.

Last edited by PhotoJoe; 05-13-14 at 10:03 AM. Reason: Moderator Edit
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Old 05-13-14, 09:21 AM   #352
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Originally Posted by BigAura View Post
Written by somebody selling a book (DUH!):

Ms. Teicholz has been researching dietary fat and disease for nearly a decade. Her book, "The Big Fat Surprise: Why Butter, Meat and Cheese Belong in a Healthy Diet," will be published by Simon & Schuster on May 13.

Here's a rebuttal, written by a MD at Yale:


Wow, could you get any more ignorant? Since when does selling a book automatically disqualifies one's argument?

Oh, and for your record, the author of the rebuttal you linked, Dr. David L. Katz, "is the author of several editions of a nutrition textbook for healthcare professionals, author of a review article about best diets for health just published by Annual Review in Public Health, and President of the American College of Lifestyle Medicine."

Oh the irony!!!!!
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Old 05-13-14, 09:45 AM   #353
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As it applies to training... I have moved from being that guy who goes out and knocks down sub hour 40's on a whim to a rider who's focus is more on distance and endurance and consider a pace of 30 kmh to be more than adequate for that and even when the bike is loaded down for touring I can move along at a better pace than most.

Training isn't always about top speed and human beings are really not optimally designed as sprinters, as a predator a fit human can run many animals into the ground because of our excellent endurance.

This is about a whole life approach and see this as an excellent long term strategy for greater physical and mental health.
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Old 05-13-14, 11:56 AM   #354
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Wow, could you get any more ignorant? Since when does selling a book automatically disqualifies one's argument?

Oh, and for your record, the author of the rebuttal you linked, Dr. David L. Katz, "is the author of several editions of a nutrition textbook for healthcare professionals, author of a review article about best diets for health just published by Annual Review in Public Health, and President of the American College of Lifestyle Medicine."

Oh the irony!!!!!
There is a little bit of difference between writing for the popular press vs writing college textbooks and peer-reviewed scientific journal articles.
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Old 05-13-14, 05:44 PM   #355
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After some serious clean up this thread is back up and running and I'd like to keep it that way.
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Old 05-13-14, 09:03 PM   #356
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Training isn't always about top speed and human beings are really not optimally designed as sprinters, as a predator a fit human can run many animals into the ground because of our excellent endurance. This is about a whole life approach and see this as an excellent long term strategy for greater physical and mental health.
I couldn't agree more and it goes doubly so for a guy my age, 71.
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Old 05-13-14, 09:50 PM   #357
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I couldn't agree more and it goes doubly so for a guy my age, 71.
There is a lot of emerging and ongoing research showing how a lower carb diet can preserve and improve mental function as we age, one prominent LCHF adherent and doctor says that Alzheimers should be called type 3 diabetes as he has seen how a diet high in carbs also has detrimental effects on our brain.

Alzheimer rates are also on the rise with diabetes and being diabetic greatly increases your chances of developing this insidious disease.
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Old 05-14-14, 03:26 AM   #358
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Interesting stuff... It will remain to be seen what the actual study results and responses are

Edit: more interesting stuff http://www.onlinecjc.ca/article/S082...237-2/abstract

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Old 05-20-14, 02:56 PM   #359
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Hey guys I'm back. I was banned because I challenged the admin's decision to censor paleo/low-carb in this forum.

Also, did my first 100 mile bike ride on Sunday. The first 50 miles were 17.3 mph average. The entire ride came out to 15.4. The last 50 miles were a little harder.


The map: http://www.mapmyride.com/routes/view/412305466

Here are the results: https://fbcdn-sphotos-d-a.akamaihd.n...76924030_o.jpg

My bike: https://scontent-a-iad.xx.fbcdn.net/...25795906_o.jpg

What I ate during the ride: https://scontent-b-iad.xx.fbcdn.net/...00795434_o.jpg

My dinner: https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.n...80908372_n.jpg

Last edited by carnivroar; 05-20-14 at 03:04 PM.
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Old 05-21-14, 08:33 AM   #360
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigAura View Post
Written by somebody selling a book (DUH!):
...

[/I]
The NYT has an article by a a doctor at Boston Children’s Hospital and professor of pediatrics at Harvard Medical School, not selling a book:
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/18/op...-why.html?_r=1
He calls for more research, noting that the existing studies are marred by noncompliance with prescribed diet. But points out that carbs seem to be a problem for weight loss.


You know, if you step back, practically everyone is selling something.
Imagine if it turns out that the food pyramid was not the best nutrition advise for many of people, and that high carb diets actually contribute to obesity, diabetes, etc. A lot of "experts", talking heads, and politicians would be put out to pasture. Heads will roll. They have a vested interest in quashing any questioning of the standard diet advice. Can you imagine the class action lawsuits?
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Old 05-21-14, 08:38 AM   #361
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Imagine if it turns out that the food pyramid was not the best nutrition advise
Who uses a "food pyramid"? Not Canada. Not Australia. I don't think the USA uses it anymore either.
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Old 05-21-14, 08:39 AM   #362
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I find it interesting that more and more dr's and nutritionists seem to be realizing carbs can be an issue.
Well over 15 yrs ago, Dr. Barry Sears (PHd, not MD) was saying this very thing in the Zone diet books. He was specifically pointing out the role of insulin and it's cascading effects on metabolism.
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Old 05-21-14, 08:45 AM   #363
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Hey guys I'm back. I was banned because I challenged the admin's decision to censor paleo/low-carb in this forum.

Also, did my first 100 mile bike ride on Sunday. The first 50 miles were 17.3 mph average. The entire ride came out to 15.4. The last 50 miles were a little harder.
...
A Turkey bar, that would be a great Thanksgiving present for cyclists.

Very impressive. How many feet climbing?
I can ride 50 miles with ~4000 feet climbing at 17.7, but that is with a banana and doughnut as fuel.
In my limited experience, on rides with lots of climbing or sprinting I need carbs. With less climbing your fuel system can make do with fat and protein.
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Old 05-21-14, 08:47 AM   #364
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Who uses a "food pyramid"? Not Canada. Not Australia. I don't think the USA uses it anymore either.
The new "myplate" is basically identical to the food pyramid, but simplified. The biggest parts of the plate are grains and greens.
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Old 05-21-14, 08:50 AM   #365
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The new "myplate" is basically identical to the food pyramid, but simplified. The biggest parts of the plate are grains and greens.
That's good. Especially the vegetables.
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Old 05-21-14, 08:52 AM   #366
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I went out on the mountain bike on Sunday and started with a breakfast of bacon and eggs with a small side of hash browns... nobody passed me and I rolled up those hills like I was rocking a Cummings diesel.

Put down 25 km at some good intensity and was surprised at how easy it was to come up and out of the river valley... I don't think I touched that granny all day.

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Old 05-21-14, 09:12 AM   #367
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The new "myplate" is basically identical to the food pyramid, but simplified. The biggest parts of the plate are grains and greens.
It seems to be be missing something.



This is ours...

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Old 05-21-14, 09:17 AM   #368
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A little update as my wife is now down 60 pounds... she stalled a little while she was having her thyroid medications adjusted as without these levels being balanced her metabolism does not run properly and the new medication seems to have things running better than they have in 20 years.

On the bright side, every time she has had to adjust her thyroid medications or got a bad batch she has always gained weight and during this period she maintained what is already a healthy weight and she has pretty much hit her goals to be back at her pre-surgery weight.

She turned 41 today... she looks 31 and was killing it on the bike yesterday.
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Old 05-21-14, 10:48 AM   #369
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A Turkey bar, that would be a great Thanksgiving present for cyclists.

Very impressive. How many feet climbing?
I can ride 50 miles with ~4000 feet climbing at 17.7, but that is with a banana and doughnut as fuel.
In my limited experience, on rides with lots of climbing or sprinting I need carbs. With less climbing your fuel system can make do with fat and protein.
Ooops, looks like the map I linked above didn't work. Here's a static version: https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hpho...14488468_o.jpg

It was only 230 ft of elevation. NYC is overall very flat. This was with a single speed bike and there was just one hill that I had to walk my bike.

I did 20 miles yesterday without much of a problem. I was tired, yes, but it felt good.

I'm not saying that low-carb gives me cycling super-powers or something... no. But it's definitely doable at this intensity, and it's evidently a very healthy diet.

Yes, you do need carbs for high intensity stuff such as climbing. Still, a low-carb diet is very beneficial for this because it spares glycogen and utilizes it more efficiently. This book explains that: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/098...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I'm going for a full physical next Thursday, will report back the results.

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Old 05-21-14, 11:05 AM   #370
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A little update as my wife is now down 60 pounds... she stalled a little while she was having her thyroid medications adjusted as without these levels being balanced her metabolism does not run properly and the new medication seems to have things running better than they have in 20 years.

On the bright side, every time she has had to adjust her thyroid medications or got a bad batch she has always gained weight and during this period she maintained what is already a healthy weight and she has pretty much hit her goals to be back at her pre-surgery weight.

She turned 41 today... she looks 31 and was killing it on the bike yesterday.
It's almost frightening how fast someone can gain weight when they are hypothyroid.
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Old 05-26-14, 04:18 PM   #371
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53 miles today, only 16 mph average though. It was the first time I went to this trail and I got lost a few times. I reached 33 mph on a sprint at around 14 miles.

Only had coffee for breakfast, 6PM now and I'm still not hungry.

Anyone here does jump roping? I started again, it's such a great exercise.
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Old 05-26-14, 04:49 PM   #372
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It's almost frightening how fast someone can gain weight when they are hypothyroid.
Although you will find more articles on diabetics developing hypothyroidism, there is also an increased risk for those with thyroid issues to develop diabetes because of issues with glycemic control and impaired insulin responses.

The fact that my wife was able to maintain her weight during this transition speaks volumes about how a lower carb diet can benefit people with thyroid issues and she participates in a number of support groups where people with thyroid issues have experienced the very same thing after adopting a lower carb diet.

She is still adjusting to the new dosage and medication and we went on a 20km ride the other day and she was climbing hills she had to walk up before... in the middle ring of her bike.

A friend of ours has recently transitioned from being a practicing vegan for the past 4 years to a lower carb diet that includes a fair amount of meat... as a former advocate for raw vegan diets she has turned around 180 degrees as she realized that this diet was slowly taking a toll on her mental and physical health and we have never seen her looking better than she does now and she is in a much better place mentally.
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Old 05-26-14, 08:12 PM   #373
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I went low carb once. My ride times suffered, but I lost weight! Sooooo not worth it.

To each his own!
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Old 05-26-14, 11:10 PM   #374
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Here is an interesting article on why calorie restricted diets don't work...

Why counting calories probably won't help you lose weight - Thrive Health
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Old 05-27-14, 09:14 AM   #375
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Here is an interesting article on why calorie restricted diets don't work...

Why counting calories probably won't help you lose weight - Thrive Health
In a nutshell: Yet healthily and losing weight will be easier. You do realize this has been known for at least thirty to fourty years already. There is nothing new in this article. And btw. there is also evidence that weight can be lost with McDonalds even though that should be the evillest of evil. It has all to do with carbs in/carbs out. Thermodynamics man, thermodynamics.
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