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  1. #51
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    Whatever you decide to do to loose weight, make sure it is something you can do for the rest of your life. If you don't, you will gain the weight back as soon as you go off your program.

    For me it was fundamentally changing the way I eat.

  2. #52
    A tiny member bikeguyinvenice's Avatar
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    I think that is the key. As I said I've cut back on the bad carbs and have been eating more lean protein. This week I have been alternating work outs. One day in the gym doing full body strength training and a day on the bike, repeat. This is a routine I think I can live with.
    My cycling blog http://kcmjr.wordpress.com/
    "Normal" is just a setting on a washing machine.

  3. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spld cyclist View Post
    I think you're posting in the wrong place. We've recently flogged this dead horse in two separate threads.

    Now we're flogging a new dead horse regarding rest vs. exercise.
    Then, direct yourself to the poster in this thread who recommended that obomination.

    I love this forum, it is so friendly and inclusive.

    Thank you so much, have a nice day.

    Has the snow cleared off the roads up there? Maybe take a spin.

  4. #54
    Senior Member GeorgeBMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrtuttle04 View Post
    Whatever you decide to do to loose weight, make sure it is something you can do for the rest of your life. If you don't, you will gain the weight back as soon as you go off your program.

    For me it was fundamentally changing the way I eat.
    +1 on the eating...

    Except, well, for me it was a combination of things: Actually, I only partially changed my diet and partly, using a nutrition app on my IPhone opened my eyes to what I was REALLY putting in my body.

    But, perhaps more importantly was I changed my metabolism -- which had been pretty decimated by the statin I'd been taking. First, when I started taking CoQ10 I not only noticed a dramatic increase in strength and energy, but I started losing weight for the first time in 6-8 months. But now that I have not been taking the statin at all, I am seeing my weight drop even more...

    And, of course burning between 500-1,500 calories a day 5, 6, 7 days a week doesn't hurt either...

    p.s. I keep looking for a skinny guy on a Verve out on the Montour trail -- but haven't seen him yet!
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  5. #55
    Senior Member Spld cyclist's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Weatherby View Post
    Then, direct yourself to the poster in this thread who recommended that obomination.

    I love this forum, it is so friendly and inclusive.

    Thank you so much, have a nice day.

    Has the snow cleared off the roads up there? Maybe take a spin.
    Well, someone mentioned weight watchers a couple of times. Is that what bothered you? The OP had already mentioned a couple times earlier in the thread that s/he had cut back on carbs, so why make the snarky comment?

    Yes, all our snow is gone and I've been riding (although I was riding some before the snow was gone). Now we just need to deal with the sand accumulation until the city dispatches the street sweepers....

    Edit: I searched and now I see that one person mentioned the food pyramid once, in a respectful way.

    Edited again: I wrote more but I've deleted it because I don't want to potentially derail the thread even more....
    Last edited by Spld cyclist; 04-07-14 at 10:28 AM.

  6. #56
    Junior Member Petsamo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Weatherby View Post
    USDA food pyramid = diabetes, heart disease, and lots of profit for the grain industry.

    Long live high fructose corn syrup. Its victims? Not so much.
    If you're not gonna believe scientists, who're you gonna believe? For every quack advocate of high protein low carb, there's a quack vegan advocating the elimination of animal based foods.

    So you live only on high fructose corn syrup?

  7. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spld cyclist View Post
    Well, someone mentioned weight watchers a couple of times. Is that what bothered you? The OP had already mentioned a couple times earlier in the thread that s/he had cut back on carbs, so why make the snarky comment?

    Yes, all our snow is gone and I've been riding (although I was riding some before the snow was gone). Now we just need to deal with the sand accumulation until the city dispatches the street sweepers....

    Edit: I searched and now I see that one person mentioned the food pyramid once, in a respectful way.

    Edited again: I wrote more but I've deleted it because I don't want to potentially derail the thread even more....
    You tell me I am posting in the wrong place, and I am the snarky one.

    And for Petsamo: I don't blindly trust any scientist but I hope you are not suggesting the food pyramid had any real science behind it.

    Wait, let's not derail this thread with real discussion.

  8. #58
    Junior Member Petsamo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Weatherby View Post
    I don't blindly trust any scientist but I hope you are not suggesting the food pyramid had any real science behind it.
    Apparently, the food pyramid is replaced by MyPlate, which Harvard School of Public Health modified into their own version. Harvard has a bunch of scientists, right?

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by bikeguyinvenice View Post
    So here is my plan, Two months ago I joined the local gym(again) and have been hitting the gym 5 days a week for both cardio on the treadmills and weight training. So far I have seen some ok results. I'm 5'6" tall and before the gym I was 168 lbs. and about 29% body fat and 27 bmi, now I am down to 159 lbs, 24% body fat and 26 bmi. I think that is somewhat reasonable for me. I have been going to the gym for 1 to 2 hours per day, splitting the time between cardio and weights. I have the ultimate goal in mind of about 15% body fat and or 145lbs and about a 30 inch waist. I am going to be spending more time on the bike to speed the fat loss, hopefully. I think I am going to try to get on the bike for at least 2 hours twice a week. Any feedback?
    I see a lot of hoping but no actionable items in your plan.

    15% will probably work out to more like 140#.

    9# loss is nothing to sneeze at and if you maintain the same trajectory, you will hit your target later in the Summer. I've lost almost 40# since the first of the year and have another 30-35 to go.....

    The only way to lose weight is to burn fat. A couple of long Zone 1 and Zone 2 rides per week coupled with reduced carbs/sugars will keep your fat burning engine going. 2# per week is not hard but it takes discipline and commitment. If you splurge on carbs/sweets, it takes a time to recover the fat burning cycle. Control your insulin response and keep overall calories down. I eat protein and fat for breakfast. Vegetable and salad for lunch. Light dinner with some lean protein and vegetables. No grains, sugars, potatoes, pasta, etc. My only source of carbs (unless on a very long ride) is veggies or the random half of banana. I aim for less than 100 g carbs per day but more than 50g. (All bets off on a long ride over 100 mi......but I will only fuel with carbs once into the ride in order to avoid an insulin spike that would kill off the ability to burn fat)

    GL with your weight loss.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Petsamo View Post
    Apparently, the food pyramid is replaced by MyPlate, which Harvard School of Public Health modified into their own version. Harvard has a bunch of scientists, right?
    Well done. You are now aware that the pyramid has been modified. Here is what the good folks in Cambridge have to say..........

    The good news is that these changes have dismantled and buried the original, flawed Food Guide Pyramid and its underwhelming MyPyramid successor. The bad news is that the new MyPlate icon, while an improvement over the Food Guide Pyramid and MyPyramid, still falls short on giving people the nutrition advice they need to choose the healthiest diets.
    Intense lobbying efforts from a variety of food industries also helped shape the pyramid and the plate......... The government seeks advice from a scientific panel, one that must include nutrition experts who are leaders in pediatrics, obesity, cardiovascular disease, and public health. Selecting the panelists is no easy task, and is subject to intense lobbying from organizations such as the National Dairy Council, the United Fresh Fruit and Vegetable Association, the Soft Drink Association, the American Meat Institute, the National Cattlemen’s Beef Association, the Salt Institute, and the Wheat Foods Council............The process, however, is less than transparent. And the folks who actually write the final guidelines don’t always hew to the scientific panel’s recommendations
    Other recommendations do not go far enough to reflect the latest nutrition science—or bury key messages:

    • Too lax on refined grains. The guidelines say that it’s okay to eat up to half of our bread, cereal, rice, pasta, and other grain foods in their fiber- and nutrient-depleted, refined forms. That’s unfortunate, because in the body, refined grains like white bread and white rice act just like sugar. Over time, eating too much of these refined grain foods can make it harder to control weight, and can raise the risk of heart disease and diabetes
    Food Pyramids and Plates: What Should You Really Eat? | The Nutrition Source | Harvard School of Public Health

  11. #61
    Senior Member GeorgeBMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Weatherby View Post
    ...

    I don't blindly trust any scientist ....

    ... .
    Most physicians would agree... It is commonly accepted practice among them that any and all new "scientific" / medical evidence or findings are "Peer Reviewed" before they even begin to be accepted. They have seen too many examples of even legitimate scientists using legitimate science coming up with the wrong answers... And, then we get to the results obtained through intentional bias (such as to please the people funding the "study" -- but bias can take many forms...)...

    I agree: caution -- and taking the broad view (and even then realizing that it can be wrong) is the best approach to nutrition.

    p.s. I agree that the stuff coming out of the USDA has been filtered through multiple biases. Sort of a frankenstein monster developed by committee... It contains equal parts science, bias and corporate agendas... It's probably better than nothing -- but far from perfect.

    But, it's a committee and they did their best. I wonder what I would have done if I had two scientists each giving me completely opposite answers based on equally valid science...
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  12. #62
    Junior Member Petsamo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Weatherby View Post
    Well done. You are now aware that the pyramid has been modified. Here is what the good folks in Cambridge have to say..........

    Food Pyramids and Plates: What Should You Really Eat? | The Nutrition Source | Harvard School of Public Health
    That was a nice read. It's been a while since I read into the official recommendation. Thanks.

  13. #63
    Senior Member GeorgeBMac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Petsamo View Post
    That was a nice read. It's been a while since I read into the official recommendation. Thanks.
    +1
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  14. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Weatherby View Post
    Then, direct yourself to the poster in this thread who recommended that obomination.
    .
    Which poster, which abomination and what "recommendation"?

  15. #65
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    I think the best way to lose weight is to find a balance between eating healthy and exercising. The best weightloss I achieved was when I started going to body combat classes, going from doing no exercise to doing 5-6 hours of exercise each week. I didn't really change my diet all that much, but attempted to add more fruit and vegetables and reduced the amount of sugar. I didn't see any change really for a while, until people around me started telling me that I'd lost weight. It didn't really take much effort and soon the exercise became a part of my daily routine. I didn't lose a huge amount of weight but I did tone up and looked more slender, which was great!

  16. #66
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    If I may add (I know it's a long thread, but I wanted to add this). First of all - losing weight does not automatically mean losing body fat.

    It could mean losing body fat, but it also mean losing water from your body and losing muscle mass. You want to avoid these two as much as you can. Body always wants to get rid of muscles first, because muscles burn the most energy. Body is a very economic "device" and a bit stupid, too
    My point is - losing lbs must not be your primary goal - don't pay all attention to figures. A better way is to watch your progress in a mirror!!

    In order to lose weight and not lose too much muscle mass one should adapt their diet - without going to much into details (as there really is no need for that) - lower the carbs intake and maintain or even increase protein intake, while intake of fat can be the same (but it is a good idea to consume less trans fat and try to maintain 3 : 1 omega3 : omega6 ratio).

    The "big secret" in losing weight (body fat) is no big secret at all. The amount of calories you consume every day must be lower than the amount of calories you burn every day. So you can eat 9000 calories every day - if you burn them than no problem (a bit more on this can be read in this article on how many calories should you eat every day).

    So without complicating too much: if you're now 159lbs and want to reach 145lbs than you need to burn roughly 57000 calories. 1 hour of cycling (for your weight) is about 281 calories. Do a little math now. Combine cycling with a little lesser calorie intake via food and you're on faster lane to weight loss. But don't over do this. Eating to less can do your body harm.
    Last edited by jzbob81; 05-15-14 at 01:22 PM. Reason: typo

  17. #67
    Senior Member bmontgomery87's Avatar
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    ^^ Pretty good advice directly above me. It's not terribly complicated, eat less, burn more calories, lose weight.
    If you want to lose the right kind of weight (fat) and preserve your lean body mass, lift some weights while dieting.

  18. #68
    Long Distance Cyclist Machka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bmontgomery87 View Post
    ^^ Pretty good advice directly above me. It's not terribly complicated, eat less, burn more calories, lose weight.
    If you want to lose the right kind of weight (fat) and preserve your lean body mass, lift some weights while dieting.
    +1

  19. #69
    <riding now> BigAura's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jzbob81 View Post
    Body always wants to get rid of muscles first, because muscles burn the most energy.
    Untrue, a body wants to use fat before burning muscle. After depleting it's storehouse of glycogen, fat is where your body wants to get its energy, assuming it has a intake calorie deficit. Fat is the way a body stores excess calories for long term future use, that's its purpose.
    Last edited by BigAura; 05-06-14 at 06:02 AM. Reason: typo

  20. #70
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigAura View Post
    Untrue, a body wants to use fat before burning muscle. After depleting it's storehouse of glycogen, fat is where your body wants to get its energy, assuming it has a intake calorie deficit. Fat is the way a body stores excess calories for long term future use, that's it's purpose.
    Not quite true either.

    That really depends in which "gear" your body is at the time. If you are doing low intensity workout your body will (after depletion of glycogen) use mainly fat as energy source.
    But if you're doing high intensity workout your body will tear down muscle mass as it can obtain energy from muscle tissue much faster than from fat.

  21. #71
    Senior Member bmontgomery87's Avatar
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    Your body can be catabolic during low or high intensity exercise.

    There is a reason marathon runners typically look like crap, long distance low intensity exercise burns muscle tissue as well as fat.

  22. #72
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    Yes, low intensity burns fat and muscle, but more fat than muscle. Marathoners look like crap because they run extra long distances.

    In high intensity more muscle is burn than fat.

  23. #73
    Senior Member bmontgomery87's Avatar
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    It depends on how you define intensity I suppose.

    Sprinting is high intensity, but football players don't appear to be facing a lot of catabolism. (I was actually my biggest and leanest when I did high intensity intervals). Again look at track sprinters versus distance runners.

    And lifting/operating at a high percentage of your maximum capacity is commonly referred to as high intensity. Guys who lift heavy also aren't dealing with a lot of muscle loss.

    Everything I've ever come across has pretty much stated the exact opposite of what you're saying.


    Edit:
    People who primarily do "cardio" workouts of jogging for an hour several times a week typically get referred to as "skinny fat" because they have very little muscle mass, are small, and still have a moderate bodyfat percentage.
    People who do sprints/intervals and high intensity lifting typically get leaner, and carry muscle mass.
    Last edited by bmontgomery87; 05-06-14 at 06:22 AM.

  24. #74
    <riding now> BigAura's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jzbob81 View Post
    Not quite true either.

    That really depends in which "gear" your body is at the time. If you are doing low intensity workout your body will (after depletion of glycogen) use mainly fat as energy source.
    But if you're doing high intensity workout your body will tear down muscle mass as it can obtain energy from muscle tissue much faster than from fat.
    You are correct in that after hours of high intensity exercise your body's ability to keep up using fat stores will fail. The fat stores are really more for hibernating than hunting

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    Quote Originally Posted by bmontgomery87 View Post
    It depends on how you define intensity I suppose.

    Sprinting is high intensity, but football players don't appear to be facing a lot of catabolism. (I was actually my biggest and leanest when I did high intensity intervals). Again look at track sprinters versus distance runners.

    And lifting/operating at a high percentage of your maximum capacity is commonly referred to as high intensity. Guys who lift heavy also aren't dealing with a lot of muscle loss.

    Everything I've ever come across has pretty much stated the exact opposite of what you're saying.


    Edit:
    People who primarily do "cardio" workouts of jogging for an hour several times a week typically get referred to as "skinny fat" because they have very little muscle mass, are small, and still have a moderate bodyfat percentage.
    People who do sprints/intervals and high intensity lifting typically get leaner, and carry muscle mass.

    You are right. I didn't define intensive well.

    I was referring to cardio, yes. Intensive cardio for me is running long distance at higher heart rate than usual (lets say more than 85% of max hr).
    Low intensity for me is running long distances at lower intensity (lets say 60% max hr).

    In first case your body is more catabolic than in second case.

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