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Old 01-26-15, 10:59 AM
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buy cheap or buy good

So I'm in the market for a trainer for my recumbent. I had one for my trike that I only used once, but that was due to a foot injury.

I'm trying to decide between buying a cheaper one from Nashbar and seeing if I can tolerate it day after day in the winter or just spending the money and buying something like a CycleOps.

So what did everyone else do? Buy cheap and upgrade or go all the way and buy a good one initially? If you bought an expensive one did you have any regrets?
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Old 01-27-15, 11:18 AM
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Right now I'm leaning toward this one.

Ascent Fluid Trainer

Any down sides?
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Old 01-28-15, 12:10 PM
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Originally Posted by chandltp
Right now I'm leaning toward this one.

Ascent Fluid Trainer

Any down sides?
You mean aside from availability in late March?

Check Craig's List. People sell barely used trainers all the time when they find out that indoor training sucks rocks.

Edit: fwiw, I have 900+ miles on my trainer this Winter, so it's not as though I'm out to discourage anyone.

Last edited by no sweat; 01-28-15 at 03:00 PM.
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Old 01-28-15, 12:42 PM
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you never regret buying quality
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Old 01-29-15, 10:31 AM
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Originally Posted by chandltp
So what did everyone else do? Buy cheap and upgrade or go all the way and buy a good one initially? If you bought an expensive one did you have any regrets?
Got a CycleOps Fluid2 for Christmas and don't regret it a bit.

If you have something to occupy your mind, using a trainer doesn't suck that much. I have a TV and a DVD player in my basement and I watch DVDs of my favorite TV shows when I'm using the trainer or my elliptical.
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Old 01-29-15, 12:17 PM
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Originally Posted by no sweat
Check Craig's List. People sell barely used trainers all the time when they find out that indoor training sucks rocks.
I think I've seen 2 trainers in my area over the last year, neither of which interested me.
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Old 01-29-15, 12:19 PM
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Originally Posted by rumrunn6
you never regret buying quality
I agree.. unless I find out I just don't want to use it.
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Old 01-29-15, 12:20 PM
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Originally Posted by no sweat
You mean aside from availability in late March?

Check Craig's List. People sell barely used trainers all the time when they find out that indoor training sucks rocks.

Edit: fwiw, I have 900+ miles on my trainer this Winter, so it's not as though I'm out to discourage anyone.
Although you did make me think.. if I buy quality I should be able to sell it pretty easy if I end up not wanting to use it. And I'd still be out less than the cost of a cheap trainer.
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Old 01-29-15, 04:05 PM
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My Winter 2014-2015 Bike Trainer Recommendations | DC Rainmaker
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Old 01-30-15, 11:36 AM
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Thanks for the comparisons.
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Old 01-30-15, 11:37 AM
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I've been throwing around the idea of getting rollers instead of a trainer as well. What about the Nasbhar Reduced radius rollers? Those seem like they get pretty good reviews.
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Old 02-05-15, 11:54 AM
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So I've been shopping around and my budget won't afford a CycleOps fluid trainer. Of the following, should I avoid any of these? Any one have a personal prefernce? Ascent Fluid trainer, Nashbar Fluid Trainer, Cyclops Wind Trainer, CycleOps Mag, or Kurt Kinetic Mag?
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Old 02-05-15, 03:18 PM
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Originally Posted by chandltp
So I've been shopping around and my budget won't afford a CycleOps fluid trainer. Of the following, should I avoid any of these? Any one have a personal prefernce? Ascent Fluid trainer, Nashbar Fluid Trainer, Cyclops Wind Trainer, CycleOps Mag, or Kurt Kinetic Mag?

Erie, PA? My recommendation would be this: Bike Trainer

Rugged as an anvil, you'll never wear it out.

Edit: plus you can add this https://www.amazon.com/Kinetic-Kurt-i.../dp/B00LRAGJQ6

for power info if you have an iOS device.

Last edited by no sweat; 02-05-15 at 03:25 PM.
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Old 02-06-15, 08:58 AM
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What is your budget?

I just got a CycleOps Fluid2 from DicksSportingGoods for $259. (saw one in store and was able to use a coupon also for another $10 off). just checked and unfortunately it appears to no longer be on sale (sorry). I did get one and like it. I have been watching spin classes on GCN and whatever youtube I can find so that the workout isn't boring. Seems to pass rather quickly. The only thing I find is that I cannot stand up on the pedals even with a 50 x 11 gearing. Feels way to jerky and am afraid I will do damage. Besides, I can sit down and still do pretty well. Nice and quiet. Not whisper but compared to other types, it is easy to hear a youtube video at 60% volume over the whir sound on a Galaxy Tab 3.

Even at regular price, it would be well worth it. Just a side item, you may want to think about resale should you become disinterested or with the summers decide it didn't get much use. A better one with a good name will be able to be sold at a higher price.

Then again, if you were me, you'll be keeping it.

Frank

Last edited by Fly2High; 02-06-15 at 09:53 AM.
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Old 02-06-15, 10:15 AM
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Originally Posted by Fly2High
What is your budget?
I'm looking around the $200 price range.

As for standing and riding, I have a recumbent so that's not a concern.
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Old 02-06-15, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by no sweat
Erie, PA? My recommendation would be this: Bike Trainer

Rugged as an anvil, you'll never wear it out.
I'll give that guy a call.

No need for power info, I just want to keep my legs in shape for long miles
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Old 02-06-15, 10:17 AM
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So are the fluid trainers that much better than the mag or wind trainers? I'm in a garage with headphones on a computer so noise isn't really a concern.
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Old 02-06-15, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by chandltp
So are the fluid trainers that much better than the mag or wind trainers? I'm in a garage with headphones on a computer so noise isn't really a concern.

Look Here:
Turbo trainer buying guide | Wiggle Buyers Guides

Buyers Guide to turbo trainers - finding the best indoor trainer for you | road.cc

Also, I think I have heard that with magnetic trainers some can drop the resistance which could be dangerous for you. Not sure where in BF I saw it but I will post if I can find it.
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Old 02-06-15, 11:06 AM
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Thanks, I've read quite a few buyers guides, and I just can't seem to reach a conclusion about which one is the best choice for me.

Last edited by chandltp; 02-06-15 at 11:38 AM.
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Old 02-06-15, 01:30 PM
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I wonder if a bike shop would put a trainer on a bike for you to try?

Couldn't hurt to ask.

IF you feel no difference and if the resistance is high enough for you then you'll have your answer.

Picking a reputable brand like CycleOps or Kurt Kinetic will also ensure quality.

For me, the CycleOps Fluid2 was right and I got lucky with the price.

IMHO.

Best of luck

Frank
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Old 02-06-15, 01:46 PM
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A few links to read:

https://www.bikeforums.net/road-cycli...l#post15309842

Magnetic trainers do this as well. The difference is that magnetic trainer resistance goes linearly with speed, where with fluid, it's just like air (another fluid), and goes as the square of the speed. This air-like progression makes the trainers significantly nicer to use than magnetic.
good comments here in the above thread

Post 31
https://www.bikeforums.net/road-cycli...l#post15319189


Originally Posted by kraftwerkI am in the market for an indoor trainer. I have usually just ridden in all kinds of weather and enjoyed it. Right now though, I have JUST had a hip re-surfacing (last week) and good news #1. it went well, good news #2. the Dr. WANTS me to get on a trainer ASAP. Thats cool. He is cool. So please keep me from hopping on my road bike and point me in the direction of the best low resistance trainer. Keep in mind it would be a plus if it was something I could "grow with" and use year after year... My normal riding habit is between 10 and 35 miles per day with 70 mile ride tossed in now and again. I am a 47 yr old former/occasional racer.. and am currently flat on my back on heavy pain medication. I would also appreciate any link to threads where this has been dealt with thoroughly.
search / spelling are not so easy on my current medication.

Thanks!

Rollers are fun but are not allowed as of yet. I am a bit skeptical about putting my carbon bike on a stand, In which case I have other lesser frames I could use ...



Every resistance trainer in the world is "low resistance" if you ride it in a low gear.

It's worth knowing how each type of trainer generates resistance to make your choice.

With a wind trainer (See: Kurt Kinetic Cyclone or CycleOps Wind), it's really straightforward. You have basically a small centrifugal fan (impeller) that you spin and the act of blowing air is the resistance. These obviously don't have problems with heat in the resistance unit but they tend to be very loud. They do have a fairly versatile resistance curve, although the power curve won't be quite realistic, you can still reach very high resistance at high speeds. Again, these are durable, simple, and LOUD.

With a mag trainer (See Computrainer, Tacx i-series, CycleOps Mag and Magneto, etc), you have various methods of generating resistance. There are electronically controlled units that use eddy-current braking to alter the resistance, but these are extremely expensive (think Computrainer, Tacx i-series, etc). Then you have simpler units that just have magnets passing each other (Examples of these are getting harder to find). The problem with this setup is the resistance is 100% linear. If the magnets are fixed-distance, the total power is based on how many interactions per time unit and so resistance starts out too high at low speed but then at high speed isn't high enough. For many people this is fine but particularly for stronger riders, they find themselves over-running the resistance curve at higher speeds. Most mag units (CycleOps Mag+, Kurt Kinetic Magnetic) include a manual adjustment (moving the magnet poles closer together to increase resistance) but again this will still be a linear resistance (just steeper slope). More advanced mag units (CycleOps Magneto, Giant Cyclotron Auto) have centrifugal based progressivity that allows the magnets to get closer based on centrifugal force, creating a more outdoor-like curve. So as the speed increases, the magnets get closer together so you have not only the rate-based increase but also the distance-based increase. Still though, the range of these is limited and after the initial ramp, you'll be out of the progressive portion of the range into a more linear part and it'll act like a normal high-resistance linear mag unit. See Novinky Cycleops for a detailed look at how each style will act. Also, moving parts mean potential failures. My 6 year old Giant Cyclotron Auto has started to have problems. Not sure what's going wrong but i'm running out of gear on workouts where I need to go higher than FTP. I'm guessing the magnets have stopped moving inside the unit and are stuck in a lower resistance position.

With a fluid trainer (Kurt RoadMachine, CycleOps Fluid2, etc), the resistance is based on an impeller rotating through a viscous fluid. Like a wind trainer, these will have naturally progressive resistance curves more closely approximating the speed vs resistance feel of outdoor riding. A significant improvement fluid trainers offer over wind is the sound of silence. They can be very quiet depending on how they are made. The main things to look for on a fluid unit are going to be build quality (leak-prevention features) and cooling (keeping the resistance curve stable). Depending on the design, the main failure mode of a fluid resistance unit might be leaking. Certain trainers have long warrantys to allay this fear or they have a design that inherently eliminates this possibility (Kurt Kinetic). Also, since many viscous fluids will change viscosity with respect to temperature (and generating resistance generates heat), and heat can also deteriorate bushings/bearings/etc, you need a model that will reject heat as fast as you can make it. I think all the CycleOps models have small fans to blow air over the cooling fins on the resistance unit while the Kurt models just have much larger cooling fins. Generally though, you're going to have a big ****ing fan blowing on YOU to keep you cool during the workout so as long as the resistance unit has lots of large cooling fins, it should be fine. I mentioned leak-proofness as a selling point for the Kurt Kinetic fluid trainers. I think they have a cutaway at the Seattle REI that demonstrates this but basically the fluid and impeller are 100% enclosed with no axles or any other penetrations into the casing. The drive torque from your tire is coupled through strong rare-earth magnets. Having no o-rings or labyrinth seals to worry about means this fluid trainer cannot possibly leak. Somebody posted here just the other day that they had another brand trainer that magically lost all its fluid.

There are some feature considerations that concern all types of trainers too. Frame stiffness, ease of use, and flywheel weight. Generally, frame stiffness is 'good enough' with all but the crappiest department store trainers. It could be argued that a too-stiff trainer frame could just move those stresses into your bicycle frame and stress the frame in ways it wasn't built to resist. Indeed, there are trainers out there that allow for lateral rocking motion to prevent the possibility of hurting your bike frame. Ease of use varies. I don't think it gets any easier than the enormous quick-cam lever on the Giant Cyclotron, but the CycleOps and Kurt units are pretty good too. One thing that you'll feel every time you ride is the flywheel. The flywheel is what keeps the trainer turning through your pedal-stroke's dead spots. If for example you are doing one-leg drills, doing it on a trainer with no flywheel will be very difficult while doing it on a trainer with a big flywheel will be relatively easy. One thing is for certain, larger diameter and heavier flywheels feel more like real outdoor riding because they create more of that coasting feeling. I suspect though that having the smaller flywheel may also train your legs to pedal through the deadspots more effectively, developing a rounder pedal stroke. You'll find detractors of this idea too. The nice thing about the Kurt Road Machine is they give you the option of using the standard flywheel (still a relatively effective 6+lb large-diameter disk, more rotationally momentous than most, 15-second coast down from 20mph) or add on their additional "Pro Flywheel" (60-second coast-down from 25mph).

Someone posted this here:
Indoor Trainer. Advice! - Adelaide Cyclists

I have a (cheap) mag trainer.
The common complaint with mag trainers is that you can overpower them, and the resistance drops off. I've found that does happen, but not often enough for it to be a huge problem. But I did mostly use it last winter, when I was (very) unfit.
I suspect if you are doing a structured program with hard intervals it could be a real issue (and let's face it: if you are on a trainer you probably are doing intervals - sitting on it for long periods of time is pretty horrible).
Wind trainers are really noisy. That's actually a big problem - you'll probably want to listen to music or watch something to survive long periods on a trainer, and the nosier the trainer the higher you'll need to volume.
If your budget stretches high enough, there are intelligent trainers that will give you power feed back, or you can hook up to an phone/computer/internet connection to simulate Strava segments/race other people/ride famous mountains.
Otherwise, get a fluid trainer.
https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2012/10/my-2012-trainer-recommendations-... is a good place to read more about your options at different price points.


Still looking to see if others complain about magnetic units have issue when overpowered and resistance drops off.
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Old 02-06-15, 02:14 PM
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Originally Posted by Fly2High
That's awesome thanks. My LBS will let me go in and try them, but they want me to do it during the day.

Right now I'm leaning toward expanding my budget and just getting the Kurt Kinetic from Amazon. They have an older model for close to $300.

Amazon.com: kurt kinetic: Sports & Outdoors (it actually went up in the last 15 minutes)

Based on that, I might get the 2.0.

It looks like the Kurt is reviewed a little better than the CycleOps fluid trainer.
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Old 02-06-15, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Fly2High
I suspect if you are doing a structured program with hard intervals it could be a real issue (and let's face it: if you are on a trainer you probably are doing intervals - sitting on it for long periods of time is pretty horrible).
Really, I'm just looking to keep my endurance up over the winter. I did pretty well on an exercise bike last year, but it didn't translate 100% come spring due to the differing ergonomics. I'd to 2-3 hour sessions on the exercise bike at a pretty stead state with no intervals or anything of the sort. I don't ever really train, I just ride.
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Old 02-06-15, 02:29 PM
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After reading some of those reviews, it seems the mag trainers might be analogous to the exercise bike. This may be good enough for my intended uses, since I'm not doing intervals or anything of the like.

Need to read some more and think on it.
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Old 02-06-15, 02:46 PM
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I have both the cyclops magnetic and a cyclops fluid trainer...for my personal use, there is not much difference... I use them just to keep the legs going and the wind up... no heavy intervals...there is a slight noise difference, but not enough for me to pay any attention....I also have two sets of rollers, they are where I put in the work if that is what I want to do... the trainers are kept at the office and my son and I use them at lunch time and the rollers are in my bike shed at home and the wife and I use them there.
If you are just looking to keep loose and sort of stay in shape, buy what best fits your budget...and loose the whole I might not like them idea, that is negative and defeatist...
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