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  1. #1
    has a Large Member Campag4life's Avatar
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    Upright TT bike?...

    Hi,
    I am stopping over from the road bike forum to ask those focused on TT bikes and knowledgable about TT bike geometry and fit...if they would recommend a more upright TT bike? I know this maybe considered by some a silly question but less flexbile riders ride a bit more upright on all genres of bicycle and I thought perhaps there is a TT model bike out there postured more toward a slightly more forgiving position? I ride a Roubaix SL3 roadbike in a stretched out and not slammed position but can't tolerate big drop. I can however scoot out onto the saddle tip of my Roubaix and place my forearms on the handlebars and ride the bike in a quasi TT position. I believe on the right TT bike I could be comfortable for many miles and relatively fast. So I am looking for a TT bike with a relatively tall head tube to top tube ratio.
    Any suggestions?
    Many Thanks.

  2. #2
    7-speed doomsday prepper ThermionicScott's Avatar
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    TT bikes are fast because of the positioning -- you'd be best off installing aerobars on your roadbike. And working on your flexibility/core strength.
    Quote Originally Posted by chandltp View Post
    There's no such thing as too far.. just lack of time
    RUSA #7498

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    has a Large Member Campag4life's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ThermionicScott View Post
    TT bikes are fast because of the positioning -- you'd be best off installing aerobars on your roadbike. And working on your flexibility/core strength.
    Thanks...but no morphing my road bike into a TT bike. Want to keep it purpose built for road biking.
    We all constantly work on our position and I have throughout my life and perhaps even you do as well. My guess is you don't ride as slammed as Zabriskie as few do...even pros.
    So will ask again. I am looking for a Tri bike with a recreational fit.
    Perhaps this bike doesn't exist. To draw an analogy, road bikes come in all different geometries and I presume TT bikes do as well. So for somebody looking to ride a bit more upright, any suggestions?
    Anybody?

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    Any particular brands yuo prefer? Some brands do have models with taller headtubes (i.e. P2C compared to P3C), but neither would I suggest have a 'recreational' fit.

    Having said that, with an upward angled stem many bikes can be set up with minimal drop. Just check some of the bike photos from various IM's.
    http://climbinglama.blogspot.com.au

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    has a Large Member Campag4life's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dalai View Post
    Any particular brands yuo prefer? Some brands do have models with taller headtubes (i.e. P2C compared to P3C), but neither would I suggest have a 'recreational' fit.

    Having said that, with an upward angled stem many bikes can be set up with minimal drop. Just check some of the bike photos from various IM's.
    Thanks and understood. Kind of wanted to start directionally with a tallish frame aka longer head tube before resorting to a riser stem. There is a parallel universe in fit as you know...guys with short legs versus long legs have different fit requirements. I am long legged for my height and need a narrow-tall frame. I like Cervelos but may consider a Cannondale Slice because of its geometry.
    This article does a nice job explaining how different geometries work better for specific riders:
    http://www.slowtwitch.com/Bike_Fit/C...arrow_613.html

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    Bikes like the Shiv and Slice are 'tall and narrow' which means more headtube and shorter toptube. Bikes like the P5 and P2 are somewhere in the middle.

    But intentionally going upright on a TT bike is just silly, you're basically negating any benefit the geometry and design gives. Just stick with the road bike.

    Scott Plasma, BH GC Aero, Blue Triad, Speed Concept, and some of the Felts are all Tall/Narrow bikes as well.
    Last edited by rpeterson; 08-09-12 at 03:37 PM.

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    I'm in the same category. I bought another road frame with a taller head tube installed aerobars and barend shifting on a bullhorn. I'm not cruising upright, but I'm not slammed either. With the saddle moved forward my seat angle is about 75.

    It's true it's not as fast as a dedicated TT bike, but I'm not fast on TT bike because I'm so uncomfortable. This is the best bet for me. The aero bar + shifting goes along way to being aero...

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    Consider the Cannondale Slice. I ride a Roubaix compact and a Slice Force. Early this season I bought a 2012 Slice from a guy who hurt his knee and wasn't going to be able to compete this year. The bike came with a Zipp cockpit, but without wheels (installed Reynolds Assaults). I had a professional fit and had no problem getting into a comfortable aero position. I raced the Slice in both sprints and olympics as well as doing a number of training rides. This bike is stable on straights and corners. Over the same 15 mile training loop on back-to-back runs, the Slice is faster. However, I continue to ride my Roubaix for training and for sprints that have more turns or hills. Last year I installed aerobars on the Roubaix. I didn't change the set up because the fitter who installed the bars said my position and saddle angle is what he would recommend for a starting point for me. I recommend you try aerobars on your Roubaix before you buy a TT bike. I believe the experience I had with the aerobars allowed me to work more effectively with my fitter on the Cannondale. I also was able to get comfortable more quickly on the TT bike because of my experience with the aerobars.

  9. #9
    has a Large Member Campag4life's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DocC3 View Post
    Consider the Cannondale Slice. I ride a Roubaix compact and a Slice Force. Early this season I bought a 2012 Slice from a guy who hurt his knee and wasn't going to be able to compete this year. The bike came with a Zipp cockpit, but without wheels (installed Reynolds Assaults). I had a professional fit and had no problem getting into a comfortable aero position. I raced the Slice in both sprints and olympics as well as doing a number of training rides. This bike is stable on straights and corners. Over the same 15 mile training loop on back-to-back runs, the Slice is faster. However, I continue to ride my Roubaix for training and for sprints that have more turns or hills. Last year I installed aerobars on the Roubaix. I didn't change the set up because the fitter who installed the bars said my position and saddle angle is what he would recommend for a starting point for me. I recommend you try aerobars on your Roubaix before you buy a TT bike. I believe the experience I had with the aerobars allowed me to work more effectively with my fitter on the Cannondale. I also was able to get comfortable more quickly on the TT bike because of my experience with the aerobars.
    Thanks Doc,
    Can you tell me what model aerobar you went with on your Roubaix? Also what model handlebar you have for adaptation of the aerobar? I run FSA Kwing carbon handlebars and don't believe they are conducive to mounting aerobars so would likely need to change to another drop bar.

    From a fit standpoint, it seems having a comfortable roadbike and a comfort aero bar position would be mutually exclusive. Reason I say that is...the sta seems completely wrong for aerobars. Is there much fore/aft adjustability of the forearm pads on the aero bars? Perhaps they would be OK if moved aft a fair amount, provided not mounted too low. Are you running a straight seatpost on your Roubaix?
    Thanks for any further perspective.

  10. #10
    has a Large Member Campag4life's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rpeterson View Post
    Bikes like the Shiv and Slice are 'tall and narrow' which means more headtube and shorter toptube. Bikes like the P5 and P2 are somewhere in the middle.

    But intentionally going upright on a TT bike is just silly, you're basically negating any benefit the geometry and design gives. Just stick with the road bike.

    Scott Plasma, BH GC Aero, Blue Triad, Speed Concept, and some of the Felts are all Tall/Narrow bikes as well.
    Nope...you miss the point. Cyclists purchase TT bikes for different purposes. Some don't race them. They purchase them as a fast bike for training.
    They solve the simple riddle of riding a roadbike in the drops for 3 hours versus riding in the same drop bar position with elbows supporting the torso which many will find more comfortable than riding in the drops. That is what an upright TT bike will give you.

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    Yes, but simply putting aerobars on your road bike does that just fine. In fact it does it far cheaper, far easier, and you don't have to deal with the geometry designed for riding steep and aggressive. It just seems like a very complicated workaround.

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    No problem Campag4. I installed Profile Design Carbon Strykes. My bars are stock Specialized aluminum as is my saddle and seat post. As you note, your carbon bars may not allow you to install aero bars. I heard similar comments from several cyclists who ride with our Multisport group.

    I had a professional fit on my Roubaix. My saddle is angled down about 2 degrees and is forward to almost end of the rails. My stem is angled up so I am not in an aggressive position. I had the aerobars mounted by a LBS fitter who races TT bikes. He measured my bike and me on the bike with the idea to adjust my position to a compromise for the aero's. After measuring the bike and me on the bike, he said my set up was what he would recommend as a starting point. I haven't changed anything because it works and I'm comfortable on the aero's, drops and hoods.

    There is a fair amount of adjustment in the pads on my aero bars. I believe my pads are back to the limit, my elbows are behind the bars and the extensions approximately 2 inches in front of the brake levers. Check out pictures of the bikes men and women triathletes raced in the Olympics. This will give you an idea of what the set-up looks like except for extension length. In draft legal Tri's the extensions cannot be beyond the brake levers.

    Random thoughts, I bought the Slice to race in Olympic and longer distance triathlons. Frequently the bike leg in those race have long straight stretches and few turns. Perfect for this type of bike. You use different muscles riding a TT bike and I am faster in my runs with then Slice. However, riding in the aero position puts a lot of strain on your neck. Finally, there are only two positions for your hands on a TT bike, on the extensions or on the bull by the brakes. I miss being able to move my hands from the bars to the hoods to the drops on 3 hour training rides. Hope this helps.

  13. #13
    has a Large Member Campag4life's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rpeterson View Post
    Yes, but simply putting aerobars on your road bike does that just fine. In fact it does it far cheaper, far easier, and you don't have to deal with the geometry designed for riding steep and aggressive. It just seems like a very complicated workaround.
    The issue with aerobars on a roadbike is the position ends up being a compromise. A roadbike position with nominal sta of 73 deg is not conducive to a more open hip angle helpful if riding with forearms supported by pads. But...given a good compromise as Doc explained, it can and often is done with success as you say. I have to decide whether I want a dedicated bike with forearm pads with a more forward pelvis position...or outfit my Roubaix with aerobars and strike a decent balance in positions between aero and drop bars on my road bike.
    Thanks
    Last edited by Campag4life; 08-14-12 at 06:54 AM.

  14. #14
    has a Large Member Campag4life's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DocC3 View Post
    No problem Campag4. I installed Profile Design Carbon Strykes. My bars are stock Specialized aluminum as is my saddle and seat post. As you note, your carbon bars may not allow you to install aero bars. I heard similar comments from several cyclists who ride with our Multisport group.

    I had a professional fit on my Roubaix. My saddle is angled down about 2 degrees and is forward to almost end of the rails. My stem is angled up so I am not in an aggressive position. I had the aerobars mounted by a LBS fitter who races TT bikes. He measured my bike and me on the bike with the idea to adjust my position to a compromise for the aero's. After measuring the bike and me on the bike, he said my set up was what he would recommend as a starting point. I haven't changed anything because it works and I'm comfortable on the aero's, drops and hoods.

    There is a fair amount of adjustment in the pads on my aero bars. I believe my pads are back to the limit, my elbows are behind the bars and the extensions approximately 2 inches in front of the brake levers. Check out pictures of the bikes men and women triathletes raced in the Olympics. This will give you an idea of what the set-up looks like except for extension length. In draft legal Tri's the extensions cannot be beyond the brake levers.

    Random thoughts, I bought the Slice to race in Olympic and longer distance triathlons. Frequently the bike leg in those race have long straight stretches and few turns. Perfect for this type of bike. You use different muscles riding a TT bike and I am faster in my runs with then Slice. However, riding in the aero position puts a lot of strain on your neck. Finally, there are only two positions for your hands on a TT bike, on the extensions or on the bull by the brakes. I miss being able to move my hands from the bars to the hoods to the drops on 3 hour training rides. Hope this helps.
    Thanks for the explanation Doc...appreciate it. I may just try the aero clip on bars on my Roubaix...understanding that the two positions will be a bit of a compromise. With more rearward saddle position to satisfy drop bar reach, if I choose the right clip on aero bars, perhaps I can find a more rearward arm pad position such that I am not sitting on the tip of the saddle. May give this a try during ensuing cold months tuning in fit on a trainer.
    Thanks again.

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    So what did you end up doing, Campag4life? I'm in the same boat. Doing a lot of TT's on a road bike with clip-on aerobars. It helps but not the same as a dedicated TT bike. Also requires too many changes in setting up bike for road to TT to road. IMO, aerobars do not belong on road bikes. They're unwieldy and the pads get in the way. No top of bar position for your hands. I am looking for the exact same thing as you described in your original post and follow-up replies. I don't want to bastardize my road bike or suffer on a standard TT bike. Did you find a solution?

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