Go Back  Bike Forums > Bike Forums > Utility Cycling
Reload this Page >

A folding Xtracycle in the works?

Notices
Utility Cycling Want to haul groceries, beer, maybe even your kids? You don't have to live car free to put your bike to use as a workhorse. Here's the place to share and learn about the bicycle as a utility vehicle.

A folding Xtracycle in the works?

Old 09-28-08, 11:22 AM
  #1  
Thunder Whisperer
Thread Starter
 
no1mad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NE OK
Posts: 8,847

Bikes: '06 Kona Smoke

Mentioned: 6 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 275 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 6 Times in 2 Posts
A folding Xtracycle in the works?

I just checked out bikecommuters.com. They are at Interbike, the latest booth was Xtracycle's. They spotted a Dahon folder that had been fitted w/ a Free Radical kit.
__________________
Community guidelines
no1mad is offline  
Old 09-28-08, 12:31 PM
  #2  
I spit hot fire
 
Diggidy_Dylan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 167

Bikes: IRO Jamie Roy--Stolen, Specialized SJ, ****-tons of beaters

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
That sorta sounds like a bad idea to me. Super small underbuilt wheels. Low bottom bracket. Folders usually have steep head tube angles giving it a twitchy ride. I dunno about this....
Diggidy_Dylan is offline  
Old 09-28-08, 04:06 PM
  #3  
Señor Mambo
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Fremont, CA
Posts: 1,406

Bikes: TST roadie, Cannondale CAAD 3, Surly Karate Stokemonkey Leap, Tern Cargo Node, Helix Alfine; 36er and 29er Triton Unicycles; a couple Bike Fridays; one Brompton; RadPower Radburro

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 54 Post(s)
Liked 28 Times in 12 Posts
It's a full-sized folding bike. Nothing wrong with the concept. Durability has yet to be tested.
spambait11 is offline  
Old 09-28-08, 05:57 PM
  #4  
Bicycle Utopian
 
bikinpolitico's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 787

Bikes: Bianchi Campione d'Italia, Softride Qualifier, Ritchey Breakaway Cyclocross

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I'm not sure whether this is a good idea, but it shows Xtracycle is moving main stream if Dahon is picking it up.

Here's a picture BikeHugger took of such a setup at Interbike:

Last edited by bikinpolitico; 09-28-08 at 06:02 PM.
bikinpolitico is offline  
Old 09-28-08, 08:05 PM
  #5  
I spit hot fire
 
Diggidy_Dylan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Portland, OR
Posts: 167

Bikes: IRO Jamie Roy--Stolen, Specialized SJ, ****-tons of beaters

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Ah, I didn't realize it was a full sized bike that folded. Seems pretty interesting.
Diggidy_Dylan is offline  
Old 09-29-08, 12:15 PM
  #6  
Hooligan
 
Abneycat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Base of the Rocky Mountains, Canada. Wonderous things!
Posts: 1,431

Bikes: 2010 Cannondale Hooligan 3

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
I don't think it implies anything, its just xtracycle showing the various bikes the freeradical is compatible with. That bike in particular is a Dahon Cadenza 8, which is a pretty nice bike.

There has been the odd day where I wanted to hang out with people who use cars, but the xtracycle won't fit inside the average small car without extreme measures. Taking some length off the front end would be a nice option, as long as the Cadenza had the moxie to still serve as a cargo bike - one thing I would be concerned about, as Dahon's bikes have pretty low maximum weight limits.
Abneycat is offline  
Old 09-30-08, 02:44 AM
  #7  
Acetone Man
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: PDX
Posts: 251
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Diggidy_Dylan
That sorta sounds like a bad idea to me. Super small underbuilt wheels. Low bottom bracket. Folders usually have steep head tube angles giving it a twitchy ride. I dunno about this....
Dude, the faults in your assumptions would make the San Andreas blush. Small wheels are significantly stronger than larger wheels, making them superior for cargo use. The bottom brackets on small wheeled bikes aren't any lower than other bikes; if they were, your pedals would hit the ground. Twitchier handling? Sure, but nothing that proper tire and handlebar selection, along with the stability of the longer wheelbase, wouldn't help plenty with.

I think a folding longtail is a terrific idea. A full on cargo bike that you can fit in a hatchback if need arises, thus eliminating one of their biggest drawbacks
Thasiet is offline  
Old 09-30-08, 01:22 PM
  #8  
Bicycle Utopian
 
bikinpolitico's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 787

Bikes: Bianchi Campione d'Italia, Softride Qualifier, Ritchey Breakaway Cyclocross

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Thasiet
Dude, the faults in your assumptions would make the San Andreas blush. Small wheels are significantly stronger than larger wheels, making them superior for cargo use. The bottom brackets on small wheeled bikes aren't any lower than other bikes; if they were, your pedals would hit the ground. Twitchier handling? Sure, but nothing that proper tire and handlebar selection, along with the stability of the longer wheelbase, wouldn't help plenty with.

I think a folding longtail is a terrific idea. A full on cargo bike that you can fit in a hatchback if need arises, thus eliminating one of their biggest drawbacks
I agree on the smaller wheels being stronger, but as I have to disagree with the handling statement. Smaller wheels are twitchier, but you can get used to it. I've also found they are considerably less twitchy under load, which makes them fine for a cargo bike.

As for a cago bike in a hatchback, the whole reason I want a cargo bike is to not own a car in any way, so I'm not sure the usefulness of a folder carries over to the application of cargo bike.
bikinpolitico is offline  
Old 10-02-08, 09:21 AM
  #9  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Charleston, WV
Posts: 1,768

Bikes: Trek Mountaineer modified with a NuVinci; Montegue Paratrooper folding mountain bike; Greenspeed recumbent; Surly Big Dummy with Stokemonkey

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Originally Posted by bikinpolitico
As for a cago bike in a hatchback, the whole reason I want a cargo bike is to not own a car in any way, so I'm not sure the usefulness of a folder carries over to the application of cargo bike.
What if it isn't your car, but a friend's? What if you're taking a trip out of town and renting a car and will be wanting to cycle at your destination?

Or what if you are travelling by train or bus? You can ride to the station, fold your bike and check it through, then at your destination, unfold it and ride off.

Last edited by Elkhound; 10-02-08 at 01:06 PM.
Elkhound is offline  
Old 10-02-08, 10:02 AM
  #10  
Part-time epistemologist
 
invisiblehand's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 5,870

Bikes: Jamis Nova, Bike Friday triplet, Bike Friday NWT, STRIDA, Austro Daimler Vent Noir, Hollands Tourer

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 122 Post(s)
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Funny, I kept thinking that a small wheel would be the greatest thing for a utility bike since

(1) Just like an ERTO 559 wheel is ~11% stronger than an ERTO 622 wheel, a 20" -- generally ERTO 406 -- will be much stronger. Oh ... if you don't believe me, take a peek at Brandt's book or Peter White's website.

(2) When loaded -- particularly the front -- the twitchier/faster steering of the small wheel is a perk in my experience. It makes the steering more "normal" if that makes any sense. And yes, one can adjust oneself to the smaller wheels -- it usually takes a 5 minute ride to get 90% of the "adjustment".

(3) Really easy to get low gears due to those very same small wheels. Of course, this means that you will have a harder time gettng really high gears. But this should be less of a concern with a utility bike.

(4) My understanding -- I am no physicist nor an engineer, so this is rejurgitating something from other sources -- that the small wheels result in less torque on internal hubs. So if you are worried about achieving super low gears with an internal hub -- say like the Alfine or I-Motion -- you can push the limits with smaller wheels relative to larger wheels with less worry.

(5) ERTO 406 stil has a good selection of tires. For instance, you can get Schwalbe Big Apples (50 mm) in the size.

Mind you, I have a bit of experience with folding bikes; so clearly my opinion has some bias. Anecdotally speaking, you probably do not want to extrapolate the behavior of small wheels from multi-mode folding bikes which often trade off comfort and rideability for compactness -- the geometry of these bikes are a bit weird but will still get you from point A to B.
__________________
A narrative on bicycle driving.
invisiblehand is offline  
Old 10-02-08, 10:05 AM
  #11  
Bicycle Repair Man !!!
 
Sixty Fiver's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: YEG
Posts: 27,272

Bikes: See my sig...

Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 67 Post(s)
Liked 128 Times in 95 Posts
I have a spare Twenty at the shop and have looked at it thinking that it would be a good platform for a folding extracyle.

hmmm...
Sixty Fiver is offline  
Old 10-02-08, 10:21 AM
  #12  
Part-time epistemologist
 
invisiblehand's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 5,870

Bikes: Jamis Nova, Bike Friday triplet, Bike Friday NWT, STRIDA, Austro Daimler Vent Noir, Hollands Tourer

Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 122 Post(s)
Liked 3 Times in 3 Posts
Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver
I have a spare Twenty at the shop and have looked at it thinking that it would be a good platform for a folding extracyle.

hmmm...
What would happen if you put a small wheel in Xtracycle dropouts? I would think that everything would be too close to the ground.
__________________
A narrative on bicycle driving.
invisiblehand is offline  
Old 10-02-08, 10:41 AM
  #13  
Bicycle Utopian
 
bikinpolitico's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 787

Bikes: Bianchi Campione d'Italia, Softride Qualifier, Ritchey Breakaway Cyclocross

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Elkhound
What if it isn't [I]your/I] car, but a friend's? What if you're taking a trip out of town and renting a car and will be wanting to cycle at your destination?

Or what if you are travelling by train or bus? You can ride to the station, fold your bike and check it through, then at your destination, unfold it and ride off.
These are good points. I just don't know if you can build a folder cargo bike that will still be strong enough to haul as much as a unified frame. If you can't do that, its utility becomes much more limited, and I'm not sure worth it.
bikinpolitico is offline  
Old 10-02-08, 11:25 AM
  #14  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Charleston, WV
Posts: 1,768

Bikes: Trek Mountaineer modified with a NuVinci; Montegue Paratrooper folding mountain bike; Greenspeed recumbent; Surly Big Dummy with Stokemonkey

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Originally Posted by bikinpolitico
These are good points. I just don't know if you can build a folder cargo bike that will still be strong enough to haul as much as a unified frame. If you can't do that, its utility becomes much more limited, and I'm not sure worth it.
Perhaps it couldn't haul as much as a X-enhanced nonfolder, but it could certainly haul more than a non-X-enhanced folder. It is all in how you look at things.
Elkhound is offline  
Old 10-02-08, 01:01 PM
  #15  
Bicycle Utopian
 
bikinpolitico's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Austin, TX
Posts: 787

Bikes: Bianchi Campione d'Italia, Softride Qualifier, Ritchey Breakaway Cyclocross

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Elkhound
Perhaps it couldn't haul as much as a X-enhanced nonfolder, but it could certainly haul more than a non-X-enhanced folder. It is all in how you look at things.
Yeah, but it seems like the hauling capacity is what makes these bikes so appealing.
bikinpolitico is offline  
Old 10-02-08, 05:46 PM
  #16  
Hooligan
 
Abneycat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Base of the Rocky Mountains, Canada. Wonderous things!
Posts: 1,431

Bikes: 2010 Cannondale Hooligan 3

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by invisiblehand
What would happen if you put a small wheel in Xtracycle dropouts? I would think that everything would be too close to the ground.
Possibly not too close quite yet although the freeloaders could sink quite low and I would certainly forget about wideloaders for safety reasons, i'm simply not certain that the chainstays on most 20" folding bicycles would be long enough to accept the Xtracycle at all (even some 26" wheeled bicycles don't have enough room, such as many full suspension designs and super short chainstay bikes). I wonder if anyone has ever cut the front of the Xtracycle shorter..
Abneycat is offline  
Old 10-02-08, 09:15 PM
  #17  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Charleston, WV
Posts: 1,768

Bikes: Trek Mountaineer modified with a NuVinci; Montegue Paratrooper folding mountain bike; Greenspeed recumbent; Surly Big Dummy with Stokemonkey

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 2 Times in 2 Posts
Perhaps they will come up with a mini-freeradical for the small-wheel set.
Elkhound is offline  
Old 11-01-08, 07:20 PM
  #18  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 165

Bikes: Trek 1400, Raleigh 20

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Originally Posted by Sixty Fiver
I have a spare Twenty at the shop and have looked at it thinking that it would be a good platform for a folding extracyle.

hmmm...
Hey, please post if you do start something up for your 20. I've been thinking about trying to convert mine--the frame is obviously pretty solid as compared to other folders, so it might lend itself to a really cool xtracycle (xtra20?).
Jagee is offline  
Old 11-02-08, 01:25 AM
  #19  
Senior Member
 
badmother's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 3,720
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 317 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
I made one, I know I need to have some more pix taken. This is made from an old solid detatchable bike, 24" they came in 20" and 24" wheels, I`we got two of each. This is detatchable bikes, not folders.

Did this as becouse i took my first msde longtail with me on holyday this summer. Carryed it across a small car and realised it was 80-100 cmswider than the car. Decided I needed something easyer to carry since I like to take the bike on the car and go somewhere to ride.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg
Dogbike2-3.JPG (19.4 KB, 38 views)

Last edited by badmother; 11-02-08 at 01:26 AM. Reason: spelling
badmother is offline  
Old 11-02-08, 09:11 AM
  #20  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 165

Bikes: Trek 1400, Raleigh 20

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
I did see your bike when I searched--it gives a really good idea of what an "xtra20" would look like. Very cool. Is the back wheel 26"?
Jagee is offline  
Old 11-02-08, 11:19 AM
  #21  
Senior Member
 
Rob_E's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Raleigh, NC
Posts: 2,709

Bikes: Downtube 8H, Surly Troll

Mentioned: 7 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 303 Post(s)
Liked 22 Times in 21 Posts
Originally Posted by bikinpolitico
I agree on the smaller wheels being stronger, but as I have to disagree with the handling statement. Smaller wheels are twitchier, but you can get used to it. I've also found they are considerably less twitchy under load, which makes them fine for a cargo bike.

As for a cago bike in a hatchback, the whole reason I want a cargo bike is to not own a car in any way, so I'm not sure the usefulness of a folder carries over to the application of cargo bike.
I have two bikes, a Marin hybrid with 700c wheels and an old, Sears Tote/Cycle with 20" wheels that splits apart in the center. Of the two, the Tote/Cycle gives a more stable ride, is far less "twitchy" and handles pretty much the same whether I've loaded it up or not. Based on my limited experience, I find small wheels no more twitchy than larger one, or at least there are other factors that can effect handling much more then wheel size.

I can see where a folding cargo bike would have limited utility, or would appeal to a smaller cross-section of people, but can still see that it might be quite useful to some. I don't plan on getting a cargo bike in the near future because I live in an apartment, and it's already a little crowded in here. A folding cargo bike could be stashed somewhere and only taken out for the rare occasions when I need to haul more than I can carry on my other bike. We're also not car-free here, and occasionally I've found it useful to split my Tote/Cycle in two and toss it in the car. I think that's a very useful aspect of my bike even though it goes for weeks, sometimes months, without being split.

Definitely a cool idea. And a folding cargo bike might be the work around I need to get a cargo bike into the apartment. Although what I'd really like to see is not a folding bike with an Xtra-Cycle attachement, because that seems like it would create an awkward, less useful, fold. I'd like a folding bike that was designed as a cargo bike that was made to fold more efficiently.
Rob_E is offline  
Old 11-02-08, 05:09 PM
  #22  
Senior Member
 
badmother's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 3,720
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 317 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by Jagee
Is the back wheel 26"?
In the picture yes, it is a bit old. Could not decide on 24" or 26". Now it is 24" w.a Nexus 7 and hub brakes front and rear.
badmother is offline  
Old 11-02-08, 05:16 PM
  #23  
Senior Member
 
badmother's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 3,720
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 317 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by Rob_E
I can see where a folding cargo bike would have limited utility, or would appeal to a smaller cross-section of people, but can still see that it might be quite useful to some. I don't plan on getting a cargo bike in the near future because I live in an apartment, and it's already a little crowded in here. A folding cargo bike could be stashed somewhere and only taken out for the rare occasions when I need to haul more than I can carry on my other bike. We're also not car-free here, and occasionally I've found it useful to split my Tote/Cycle in two and toss it in the car. I think that's a very useful aspect of my bike even though it goes for weeks, sometimes months, without being split.

Definitely a cool idea. And a folding cargo bike might be the work around I need to get a cargo bike into the apartment. Although what I'd really like to see is not a folding bike with an Xtra-Cycle attachement, because that seems like it would create an awkward, less useful, fold. I'd like a folding bike that was designed as a cargo bike that was made to fold more efficiently.
I am sure that for some peopel a bike with a trailer is the best solution. Could be easyer to transport and store than a folding longtail.
badmother is offline  
Old 11-02-08, 07:52 PM
  #24  
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 165

Bikes: Trek 1400, Raleigh 20

Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times in 0 Posts
badmother--I noticed the title of the thumbnail pic you attached was "dogbike." I found the thread with the picture (at the bottom of page) that explains the title:

https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...hlight=dogbike

That's a great shot! Have you been able to do as much with the detachable as with the original "dogbike"? I'd consider building up an xtracycle as a catbike, but they wouldn't stand for it.
Jagee is offline  
Old 11-03-08, 05:37 AM
  #25  
Senior Member
 
badmother's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 3,720
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 317 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 1 Time in 1 Post
Originally Posted by Jagee
badmother--I noticed the title of the thumbnail pic you attached was "dogbike." I found the thread with the picture (at the bottom of page) that explains the title:

https://www.bikeforums.net/showthread...hlight=dogbike

That's a great shot! Have you been able to do as much with the detachable as with the original "dogbike"? I'd consider building up an xtracycle as a catbike, but they wouldn't stand for it.
Not really, but only becouse I am slow, anth has got too many bikes /projects, and the snow came, and...

I am absolutely sure I can do the same with this one, just need to finish it, I`ll get better pics soon.

Was out yesterday with the dog, studded tyres + me with a fewer made it a short ride. Used the winterbike (MTB) and the trailer I posted two different places (sticky + hsean`s two trailers tread. He did not need to ride, but he waited outside a shop and outside a gallery. He spent the time innside the trailer with his coat on and sitting on this foam sleepingmat thing. Cannot make myself just leave him in the snow and not at home, he need to run.

I am thinking maybe it is easyer to leave him alone in the trailer than in a longtail unless I invent a really sturdy kickstand. We`ll see.

Cats is difficult animals, they do not obey. I just leave mine at home w a window open, food innside.

I am sure a cat can get used to travel in its cage, protected from wind and sun.

Last edited by badmother; 11-03-08 at 05:39 AM. Reason: more
badmother is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.