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Winter Cycling Don't let snow and ice discourage you this winter. The key element to year-round cycling is proper attire! Check out this winter cycling forum to chat with other ice bike fanatics.

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Old 03-07-10, 08:50 PM   #1
cupcrazy4
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the elusive bootie

Hi Folks,

My feet are always cold, and I've never quite found a booties that does the trick. I did some online research, and found the "Pro Endure H2O" has received rave reviews. But I can't find it online anywhere!

Anyone know about this bootie? And are there any other cool-footers like me out there? What booties do you recommend?

thanks
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Old 03-07-10, 08:58 PM   #2
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on second thought, this should probably be in the winter cycling forum. Oh well.
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Old 03-07-10, 10:14 PM   #3
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Your wish is my command. Moving to Winter Cycling.
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Old 03-07-10, 10:39 PM   #4
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Your wish is my command. Moving to Winter Cycling.
many thanks.
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Old 03-08-10, 01:25 AM   #5
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i know a lot of this depends on conditions and time outside; for my needs, the Pearl-Izumi Amfib pros, with some extra silicone spray, over my touring shoes (and not overly snug in fit), with some quality wool socks, did it for me. my conditions? 1 hour, coldest was -10F (by the end of that ride my feet were "cool" but nothing worse than walking). however, i would not attempt a century in those mid-state NY conditions with my old set up. some might be braver, but not i.

others in extreme temps swear by big boots and flat pedals. for the real cold, i think that might be the only way go, since any bootie over a clipless shoe is basically a shoe with a vent hole in the bottom (although i have also seen some mods of this, e.g., an extra plate above the cleat).
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Old 03-08-10, 03:05 AM   #6
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In colder temps cleat is a heat sink. Adding layers on top of the shoe will not address that problem. You'll also need more insulation between your feet and cleat. For me, this was one of the reasons to move to platform pedals and "real" winter boots, years ago. YMMV.
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Old 03-08-10, 05:46 AM   #7
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You'll also need more insulation between your feet and cleat.
This is why winter cycling boots, like the Lake MXZ302, have an insulated mid-sole and insulated insoles. You get to keep the heat and the clipless.

To the OP: You'll note that the review you linked to raves about the water resistance and says nothing at all about warmth. Dry means dry, not necessarily warm. Are you reading too much into the reviews?

Keep in mind too that for most reviewers, 50F, 10C is considered cold. They ride the trainer when temps dip below that.

In northern climes, there's not much you can do to convert shoes designed to keep your feet ventilated and cool into something to keep them warm. Booties help, but in my experience, only to around 5C. Below that, I need shoes designed to keep my feet warm, instead of shoes designed to keep my feet cool.

Finally, tight-fitting shoes, as roadies are encouraged to wear, can restrict blood flow and the accompanying warmth. You may find that all you need for warm feet are shoes that fit more loosely and let blood flow normally.
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Old 03-08-10, 08:54 AM   #8
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To the OP: You'll note that the review you linked to raves about the water resistance and says nothing at all about warmth. Dry means dry, not necessarily warm. Are you reading too much into the reviews?

Keep in mind too that for most reviewers, 50F, 10C is considered cold. They ride the trainer when temps dip below that.
haha true, I have been reading a lot of reviews, but I thought it said somewhere it was good for up to 0C or thereabouts. I don't plan on doing much riding under freezing temps, but my feet get cold easily so I was looking for something in the zero range and waterproof is an added bonus. Also, I'm moving to the Rockies for a year (SW Alberta) and I've heard the weather can be unpredictable, including raining on a dime.

New shoes aren't practical, because I want booties for Road + Mtb riding and two new pairs of shoes is not in my budget unfortunately

Are cleats really a heat sink even at freezing?
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Old 03-08-10, 05:11 PM   #9
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Are cleats really a heat sink even at freezing?
Yes, but not too bad. To -5C I ride my winter shoes with felt insoles and midweight wool socks from mec, below that i switch to thiner insoles and heavyduty wool hunting socks from basspro that come upto my knees. Basspro rocks for woolsocks. Extreme cold -20C I wear hunting boots with felt soles, think woolsocks and switch to platforms and powergrips. I made my own for $15 as buying 2 sets was too much for me.
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Old 03-08-10, 07:58 PM   #10
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This review is in a UK website. In the UK, wet is the problem, -5C is a very cold day. At -10C everything stops. People still riding their bikes would risk incarceration at the nearest Mental health facility. MEC's simple packcloth overshoes while looking terrible in comparison, would probably give similar insulating properties.
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Old 03-08-10, 08:13 PM   #11
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Larger shoe, larger oversock... The MEC overshoes are actually fine, not too hip and provide no insulation but you will stay dry. Anyways, using the cold shoe as an insulating layer is doing it backwards which is why booties aren't as warm as an overshoe and shoes which can accomdate larger socks without cutting off your circulation. Another bootie discussion to browse. You will also want to cover your ankle with something because cold ankles mean cold feet... again heavier socks work here.

I will also vouch for cleats sucking heat out of your sole(soul?), it is not so much the cleat as it is the cleat and the pedal... spd i bet would transfer heat faster since your cleat is in contact with a large cold steel pedal, while eggbeaters wouldn't be as bad since it is only two steel springs. I haven't tried my hypothesis out though.
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Old 03-08-10, 08:31 PM   #12
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Larger shoe, larger oversock... The MEC overshoes are actually fine, not too hip and provide no insulation but you will stay dry. Anyways, using the cold shoe as an insulating layer is doing it backwards which is why booties aren't as warm as an overshoe and shoes which can accomdate larger socks without cutting off your circulation. Another bootie discussion to browse. You will also want to cover your ankle with something because cold ankles mean cold feet... again heavier socks work here.

I will also vouch for cleats sucking heat out of your sole(soul?), it is not so much the cleat as it is the cleat and the pedal... spd i bet would transfer heat faster since your cleat is in contact with a large cold steel pedal, while eggbeaters wouldn't be as bad since it is only two steel springs. I haven't tried my hypothesis out though.
Meh, I haven't ridden SPD for a while, but eggbeaters seem to do quite well at removing heat.
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Old 03-10-10, 08:21 AM   #13
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chemical toe or hand warmers fixed my problem
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Old 03-10-10, 10:16 AM   #14
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powergrips
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winter boots
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cover your ankle
Nothing less has ever worked well for me below -5C. With winter boots and Powergrips I threaten clipless for efficiency and can ride all the way down to about -20C but watering eyes and fogging eyewear effectively limit me to -10C. I suspect a dedicated winter cycling shoe would do just as well but 90% of my winter riding is commuting and they're just too garish to wear at work. I'd rather deal with the Powergrips than bring a second pair of shoes.

I found wearing Sealskinz over a Smartwool snowboard sock works better than a shoe cover for keeping my ankles warm when I'm still in the clipless temps but I also have a pair of Lake MX255 shoes with waterproof uppers that were intentionally purchased a full size large to accomodate such an arrangement. They really make the amount of heat lost through the cleat obvious in spite of two pair of socks and the Superfeet Red Hot insoles they've been set up with.

I absolutely hate dealing with shoe covers for anything remotely resembling a commute. You look like a total Fred walking around in the grocery store in them and pulling them on and off is a major headache. They only get pulled out for cyclocross, snow and ice biking, and late/early season distance work on the the roadie bike.
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Old 03-10-10, 01:01 PM   #15
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+1 for winter boots and flat pedals. Works for me in New England. Occasionally I have to push or walk the bike in the snow. I use low sorrel winter boots good to -25 F, why try to reinvent the wheel. They work good for walking around too.
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Old 03-11-10, 02:36 PM   #16
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I use these even though they're for Mountain bikers, they work fine with my road shoes.




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Old 03-11-10, 07:36 PM   #17
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haha true, I have been reading a lot of reviews, but I thought it said somewhere it was good for up to 0C or thereabouts. I don't plan on doing much riding under freezing temps, but my feet get cold easily so I was looking for something in the zero range and waterproof is an added bonus. Also, I'm moving to the Rockies for a year (SW Alberta) and I've heard the weather can be unpredictable, including raining on a dime.

New shoes aren't practical, because I want booties for Road + Mtb riding and two new pairs of shoes is not in my budget unfortunately

Are cleats really a heat sink even at freezing?
There would only be a few lucky riders who's feet would stay warm to 0C with those Endura shoe covers. If your feet get cold easily they definately will not work for you for more than 5-10 minute rides at that temperature. At least not unless you have some oversized shoes with thick wool socks under them.

I would recommend getting a pair of winter mountain bike shoes and some good shoe covers. Ride the mountain bike when it's really cold and when it's cool but not too cold ride the road bike with the shoe covers on.
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Old 03-11-10, 08:47 PM   #18
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I absolutely hate dealing with shoe covers for anything remotely resembling a commute. You look like a total Fred walking around in the grocery store in them and pulling them on and off is a major headache. They only get pulled out for cyclocross, snow and ice biking, and late/early season distance work on the the roadie bike.
Yes, they look dorky. The fleece lined ones I have work pretty well though. I keep my work shoes at work and the covers on my cycling shoes. I just unzip the back of the shoe covers and pull the whole shoe off leaving the covers in place. When putting them back on, I need to roll the covers down a bit to get my foot in but that's it. Roll them down, put my foot in, roll them back up and zip.
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Old 03-12-10, 09:16 AM   #19
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My attempts this winter failed. Systems that had worked okay in previous warmer winters where my commute was 1/3 the length that it is now, didn't work this year, and I got tired of blue feet that took a hour in a heating pad to thaw out.

I commute on a recumbent, which I think made the problem worse. I need a solution that is good down to about 15 degrees F. I'm guessing that heavy boots and thick socks are the way to go. The circulation on my feet isn't very good, so spot fixes like warmers I suspect won't work well. I need to start with warm feet and keep them that way.
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