Advertise on Bikeforums.net



User Tag List

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 30
  1. #1
    Socrates Johnson AngrySaki's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Waterloo, Ontario
    Posts
    490
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Skiing vs. biking

    My brother got into cross country skiing this year and i've tried it a few times myself. I've only been to a couple of skiing trails, but they were both seemed fairly well groomed. I've also done quite a bit of riding on various types of snow this year, and would consider the groomed cross country trails to be "top notch" for snow biking. (I don't ride on them because I don't want to ruin them for the skiiers)

    When I was watching bits of the olympics, I wondered if a pro cyclist would beat the skiiers if he was riding with them on the same trail. So I'm wondering if on a groomed traill (i'm thinking skate ski trail), is skiing faster than biking?

    I've also never ridden a "real" snowbike (like a pugsley), so I wonder if you could challenge a classic skiier through deepers now on a proper bike.

  2. #2
    Born Again Pagan irclean's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Southwestern Ontario
    My Bikes
    Schwinn hybrid, Raleigh MTB
    Posts
    2,242
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Only one way to find out - go buy a Pugsley and challenge your brother to a race!
    Gettin' my Fred on.

  3. #3
    Senior Member tjspiel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Location
    Minneapolis
    Posts
    6,836
    Mentioned
    9 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I think alot would depend on how firm the snow is. If the Pugsley starts to break through at all, it's game over.

    Did you happen to catch that a number of skiers where also competitive cyclists? There was one woman who has been in both winter and summer olympics, - as a cyclist and either a skier or skater. I can't remember which.

  4. #4
    Socrates Johnson AngrySaki's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Waterloo, Ontario
    Posts
    490
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Only one way to find out - go buy a Pugsley and challenge your brother to a race!
    I'm pretty sure I'd crush him, he's not a very good skiier (although way better than me). He'd crush me if we were both on bikes though.

    I think alot would depend on how firm the snow is. If the Pugsley starts to break through at all, it's game over.
    I think with skate skis specifically, the track has to be groomed pretty well, and would be fine to ride on with a bike. From what I could subjectively tell when I went skiing, i wouldn't break through on my winter bike which only has 70x35C tires.

    I'm pretty sure you get lots of crossover with cyclists and skaters. I remember seeing them show one vancouver resident (woman's long track) showing up to the olympic stadium on her bike.

  5. #5
    Que CERA, CERA jefferee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Kitchener, ON
    Posts
    873
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by AngrySaki View Post
    I'm pretty sure you get lots of crossover with cyclists and skaters. I remember seeing them show one vancouver resident (woman's long track) showing up to the olympic stadium on her bike.
    I remember that there was a good TV shot of Clara Hughes pulling up to the oval on her bike Looked like a pretty sweet rig.

    Hughes, incidentally, has won medals in both winter and summer Olympics. She was originally a speed skater, switched to cycling, won two Olympic medals in Atlanta, competed at Sydney, then switched back to speed skating, winning four medals in long-track speed skating over the last three winter Olympics.
    Quote Originally Posted by MajorMantra View Post
    Cycling (taken to the typical roadie extreme) causes you to cough up your own soul as every fibre of your worthless being sings in choral agony. Once you embrace the pain everything is dandy.

  6. #6
    Soma Lover
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Logan, UT
    My Bikes
    one bike for every day of the week
    Posts
    765
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I do both and when the closest groomed trail is packed enough to be rideable without ruining it for the skiers, I'm faster on the bike.

    My best time going up on the bike in the winter is 3.9 miles in 41 minutes. My best time on classic skis is 56 minutes. On skate skis it's probably about 50 minutes but I don't recall ever actually keeping track. Once I turn around and go back down the difference is more pronounced but I don't push it. There's too much traffic. One skier in the wrong place at the wrong time with me bombing it at a 16-18 minute pace is bad news.

    I've been xc skiing for over 10 years. I'm more of a backcountry guy instead of a skate skier though. Given some refinement in my technique I might be able to threaten the bike going up but I don't see how I could average 15 mph in more than a few sections coming down.

  7. #7
    yak
    yak is offline
    Zircon Encrusted Tweezer yak's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Marshfield, MA
    My Bikes
    SantaCruz Tallboy Surley Pugsley Fuji Reveal 2.0 Kestrel RT 700 Lemond Zurich Cannondale Team Comp
    Posts
    1,003
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Groomed or not, a skier would be no match for a Pugsley riding cyclist.


  8. #8
    yak
    yak is offline
    Zircon Encrusted Tweezer yak's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Marshfield, MA
    My Bikes
    SantaCruz Tallboy Surley Pugsley Fuji Reveal 2.0 Kestrel RT 700 Lemond Zurich Cannondale Team Comp
    Posts
    1,003
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    dub post

  9. #9
    Soma Lover
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Logan, UT
    My Bikes
    one bike for every day of the week
    Posts
    765
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by cachehiker View Post
    3.9 miles in 41 minutes
    That's also comparing 2.1" studded tires to classic skis that glide like a greased hockey puck.

    I happen to be obsessive enough to hot wax the tips and tails of my supposedly waxless classic skis. The performance improvement is worth it. Passing skate skiers on what looks like waxless classics to them is like passing someone on a Trek Madone with your Surly LHT.

  10. #10
    Single-serving poster electrik's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Location
    Toronto, Canada
    Posts
    5,097
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by AngrySaki View Post
    I wondered if a pro cyclist would beat the skiiers if he was riding with them on the same trail.
    Totally... there is even a post in here somewhere about XC skier trying to chase down a cyclist who was riding on his track! The cyclist got away.

  11. #11
    Tawp Dawg GriddleCakes's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Anchorage, AK
    My Bikes
    Surly Pugsley, Surly Straggler, Kuwahara Xtracycle, Motobecane Outcast 29er, Surly Cross Check, Trek 4500, Windsor Oxford 3-speed
    Posts
    1,214
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by tjspiel View Post
    I think alot would depend on how firm the snow is. If the Pugsley starts to break through at all, it's game over.
    This is your answer. I regularly ride on groomed ski trails, and ski the very same trails, and it depends upon snow firmness.

    When it's firm enough that my 2.1 inch tires leave no rut, then I'm the fastest beast out there, no contest. I'll blow by skate skiers, classic skiers, and Pugsley riders every time.

    When is soft enough that I sink in about 1-2 inches with the bike then everyone blows by me, Pugs, skate, and even a few classic skiers.

    Softer than that, I don't take the bike onto the trail. But when I'm out skate skiing in it, Pugsley riders are left in the dust. Their floatation advantage seems to only extend over 1-3 inches of soft snow. After that, it's a skier's game.

    I've only ever been passed by a classic skier once while I was skate skiing.

  12. #12
    Formerly Known as Newbie Juha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Helsinki, Finland
    Posts
    5,738
    Mentioned
    3 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by yak View Post
    Groomed or not, a skier would be no match for a Pugsley riding cyclist.
    Please. I don't see much snow in that pic. Getting stuck in deep snow is quite common even for snowmobiles, the ski resort rescue units carry snowshoes for backup for example. A Pugsley would reach maybe 5-10 meters from the cabin door there, depending on how far you can throw it.

    Elite skating skiers finish a demanding 50km track in about 2 hours. Elite classic skiers take maybe 15-20 minutes longer. Like GriddleCakes said, track can still be soft enough to make it difficult to bike. In ideal conditions, biking would probably be faster. Anything less than ideal, and either style skiers would be faster. Also depends on who's skiing and who's biking.

    We also have "nature tracks" that are prepared for classic skiing style only. They're just wide enough for one or two classic tracks plus enough prepared width so the poles won't sink in. Narrow tracks are better in thick or delicate forest, or in difficult terrain, where it's impossible to draw the flat "highway" that two classic tracks and a wide skating lane require. On the narrow track, classic skiers pwn everyone, including Chuck Norris.

    Then of course there's the truly classic deep snow xc skiing, no prepared tracks at all, just wide and long forest skis. There's not much competition there as the only viable alternative in those conditions is snowshoeing.

    --J

    [edit] Just came to think of it, a Nordic triathlon of sorts might be interesting: winter swimming, a stretch of winter biking and a xc ski leg. [/edit]
    Last edited by Juha; 03-18-10 at 03:33 AM.
    To err is human. To moo is bovine.

    Who is this General Failure anyway, and why is he reading my drive?


    Become a Registered Member in Bike Forums
    Community guidelines

  13. #13
    Soma Lover
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Logan, UT
    My Bikes
    one bike for every day of the week
    Posts
    765
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Chuck Norris would take out the skiers with a roundhouse kick and keep riding.

    When Chuck Norris pedals his bike, it doesn't move. It's the Earth that rotates beneath it.
    Last edited by cachehiker; 03-18-10 at 09:51 AM.

  14. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Location
    Norway
    Posts
    1,242
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Balland did the Engadin Ski marathon in 1.16.10 in 1994. On really hard ice and hardpack you probably could ride it a bit faster on a bike.

  15. #15
    totally louche Bekologist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    A land that time forgot
    My Bikes
    the ever shifting stable loaded with comfortable road bikes and city and winter bikes
    Posts
    18,026
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    skis win the race as conditions will not be likely to be consistently solid for bicycling. that said, the iditabike sprang from an earlier race, didn't it, that was open to skiiers, bicyclists, and snowshoers/runners, right? and the bicyclists consistently won?

    that being said, I still think skiing is much more appropriate -much more graceful and possible over ALL snow, not just hardpacked trails- for travelling over snow; bicycling over it is a novelty. i still suggest everyone go ride their local ski hill and forest trails with snow on them.

    here's a little video of me- skiing AND bicycling ,simultaneously. so to speak.

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=NMknRyKYLUE
    Last edited by Bekologist; 03-18-10 at 01:48 PM.
    "Evidence, anecdote and methodology all support planning for roadway bike traffic."

  16. #16
    Biscuit Boy Cosmoline's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Location
    Speeenard 'laska
    Posts
    1,358
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Skiers and cyclists compete in the Invitational every year here. The bikes are considerably faster in the long haul, though the dog teams beat both very easily and the snowmachines beat everybody easily.

    Powerful Anchorage biker Pete Basinger pulled away from his competitors on Tuesday in the grueling 350-mile Iditarod Trail Invitational that pits winter bikers against skiers and runners.
    http://www.adn.com/2010/03/02/116490...-iditarod.html
    ''On a bicycle you're not insulated. You're in contact with the landscape and all manner of people you'd never meet if you were in a car. A fat man on a bicycle is nobody's enemy.''

    Tom Vernon.

  17. #17
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Helsinki, Finland
    Posts
    69
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Juha View Post
    Just came to think of it, a Nordic triathlon of sorts might be interesting: winter swimming, a stretch of winter biking and a xc ski leg.
    I did that once. Except I biked first, then swam when the ice broke, and couldn't run as the ice was so slippery I could only walk. Great sport!

  18. #18
    totally louche Bekologist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    A land that time forgot
    My Bikes
    the ever shifting stable loaded with comfortable road bikes and city and winter bikes
    Posts
    18,026
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    yeah, in all seriousness, falling thru the ice blows. been there several times.

    and falling thru with skis on would be the worst - a thought that has crossed my mind while skihauling a sled on large frozen water ways and spotting open water near.

    THAT gives one pause in ones adventuring. Who saw the National Geographic with a radical photoshoot of a team of two winter adventurers hauling kayaks and skis up and over the patagonian Icecap? Absolute madmen. the photos were incredible.
    "Evidence, anecdote and methodology all support planning for roadway bike traffic."

  19. #19
    Superfly asuperstar103's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Location
    WV
    My Bikes
    GT
    Posts
    40
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by irclean View Post
    Only one way to find out - go buy a Pugsley and challenge your brother to a race!
    LOL!! I totally agree. Let us know the results. LOL
    High Quality Sunglasses, Reading Glasses and Headgear! Eyewear for men, women and children. Headgear includes motley tubes, flydannas, balaclavas, face mask and more!
    http://www.superflysunglasses.com

  20. #20
    Formerly Known as Newbie Juha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Helsinki, Finland
    Posts
    5,738
    Mentioned
    3 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Bekologist View Post
    and falling thru with skis on would be the worst - a thought that has crossed my mind while skihauling a sled on large frozen water ways and spotting open water near.
    I was just talking about this the other day with a friend. Modern XC ski bindings are difficult enough to open even on level ground. There's absolutely no way I could open one with no firm footing and while trying to stay afloat. I'd either climb out with the skis, or not climb out. Being harnessed to a sled would greatly increase the odds for the latter.

    --J
    To err is human. To moo is bovine.

    Who is this General Failure anyway, and why is he reading my drive?


    Become a Registered Member in Bike Forums
    Community guidelines

  21. #21
    Primate Metzinger's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    gone
    My Bikes
    Concorde Columbus SL, Rocky Mountain Edge, Sparta stadfiets
    Posts
    2,582
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    ^I've been there. I took a header into a barely frozen over pond when I failed to negotiated a sharp corner after a downhill. I was braced for impact, but was then shocked to be swimming. Or at least until I stood up. It was only 1.5m or so deep. It took me a few seconds to scramble out. Luckily it was not a cold day, and I was less than 10km from the warm hut.

    A note on the speed issue: As Juha noted, skate skiers can go pretty fast. Some races are pushing 30km/hr average. Pro MTB XCs are usually closer to half that (though usually on more technical terrain).

  22. #22
    totally louche Bekologist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    A land that time forgot
    My Bikes
    the ever shifting stable loaded with comfortable road bikes and city and winter bikes
    Posts
    18,026
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Juha View Post
    I was just talking about this the other day with a friend. Modern XC ski bindings are difficult enough to open even on level ground. There's absolutely no way I could open one with no firm footing and while trying to stay afloat. I'd either climb out with the skis, or not climb out. Being harnessed to a sled would greatly increase the odds for the latter.

    --J
    yeah, no doubt, eH?

    Savvy ski adventurers to the north pole have systems figured out. That Norwegian fella has taken to wearing drysuits and hauls sleds that double as kayaks and vice versa. He simply swims with his skis on until the next solid bit.

    who's ever packed an ice dagger?

    Sure wouldn't wear a drysuit for a week long tour on the taiga. and sometimes, lakes and rivers are the only efficient passage thru impenetrable swamp.

    Whatever you do, don't let the skis go to the bottom!
    Last edited by Bekologist; 03-23-10 at 09:42 AM.
    "Evidence, anecdote and methodology all support planning for roadway bike traffic."

  23. #23
    Formerly Known as Newbie Juha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Helsinki, Finland
    Posts
    5,738
    Mentioned
    3 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    I've heard the kayak/sled combo is pretty much a given in "real" ice adventure crossings where you have no tracks to follow and frequent openings in the ice. The good part about wearing a drysuit for a week is, the rescue team will smell you miles away. The bad part is, they're not paid well enough to come anywhere closer to you.

    Regarding ice daggers, I do carry a pair if I'm crossing over ice. Rivers, lakes and sea make for great skiing, but I'm only confident in skiing over areas where I have knowledge of local ice conditions and/or see recent tracks in snow. Another problem when falling in: even if you do get out, you'll spend some time scraping all the ice off the ski surfaces. Frozen skis = miserable skiing.

    Keep the gliding side down!

    --J
    To err is human. To moo is bovine.

    Who is this General Failure anyway, and why is he reading my drive?


    Become a Registered Member in Bike Forums
    Community guidelines

  24. #24
    Senior Member Nick Bain's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    MINNESNOWTA!
    My Bikes
    raliegh pursuit, Caad8, Tarmac comp, Raleigh R700, Raliegh M80, Schwinn prostockIII, Sawnwa Mixte custom Chopper
    Posts
    1,665
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by toddles View Post
    Nick, I don't necessarily like agreeing with you -- but your spot on.

  25. #25
    totally louche Bekologist's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    A land that time forgot
    My Bikes
    the ever shifting stable loaded with comfortable road bikes and city and winter bikes
    Posts
    18,026
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    As a little side note an only a little off topic, here's a video of me combining skiing AND bicycling on a recent bike ride.

    Juha, you may like this, probably common in Finland?





    "Evidence, anecdote and methodology all support planning for roadway bike traffic."

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •