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Winter Cycling Don't let snow and ice discourage you this winter. The key element to year-round cycling is proper attire! Check out this winter cycling forum to chat with other ice bike fanatics.

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Old 12-15-11, 06:21 AM   #1
hairytoes
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Losing studs from winter Marathon

I'm running on bare tarmac with some black ice. I 'ran-in' the tyres doing about 40 gentle miles before faster riding.

I had a puncture today, and was horrified to discover that the rear tyre has lost 15 studs already. This tyre has done about 120miles. From what I've read on here, that's unusual.

Can I buy replacement studs?
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Old 12-15-11, 08:43 AM   #2
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You can buy Nokian studs and I wonder whether they would fit. They have a flat round head that dives underneath the rubber, overall ending up with a look of thumbtacks with a very thick stem. Nokian also sells an insertion tool for them but you should be able to push them in with more rudimentary means.

Well, this certainly makes me pause in thinking about getting Marathon Winters. I have been running Nokian Hakkapeliittas over many seasons now, including months of clear pavement and I might have lost maybe 3 studs in one tire that ended up treated more harshly than another.
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Old 12-15-11, 08:49 AM   #3
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I haven't put my Marathon Winters on yet this year, but I rode several hundred miles on them last year, and I don't think I lost a single stud. I also didn't even bother with a break-in period.
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Old 12-15-11, 09:08 AM   #4
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I've found a cycle blog with some very useful info on this.

replacement-studs-for-studded-tires


It also seems that Schwalbe will send out replacements in small numbers. I've written to them, as losing 15 so quickly seems extreme (then again, the roads are in really bad condition).
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Old 12-15-11, 07:02 PM   #5
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How much you weigh? Are you abusing the tire? I haven't lost a stud in 3 years.
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Old 12-15-11, 08:17 PM   #6
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I've had no issues with my winters, seems odd.
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Old 12-15-11, 08:21 PM   #7
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it could be that you are just hard on the rear tire with trying to move forward.
Which studs are falling out? the center rows or the outer rows?

are you letting your wheel slip on bare pavement or only on ice and snow?
spinning the wheel on bare pavement is more likely to rip out studs.

Either way, only the outer rows matter for keeping up right.
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Old 12-15-11, 11:52 PM   #8
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I've lost a bunch of studs from a new set of Marathon Winters too. I haven't counted but it's maybe a dozen of the center studs. I only have about 15 miles of on these tires, all on city pavement. Maybe it's a bad batch? I'll probably end up buying the Nokian studs to replace them.
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Old 12-16-11, 02:58 AM   #9
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I don't weigh much. It's the centre studs that have gone - erm, I don't think I could possibly spin the rear wheel on bare pavement, I'm an ordinary mortal, not Thor or The Hulk.

Schwalbe UK are sending me replacements. They say it's probably due to the crap state of the roads I'm riding on. They are probably right - I regularly hit debris such as lumps of wood, stones the size of plums and rough broken surfaces.
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Old 12-16-11, 03:40 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hairytoes View Post
I don't weigh much. It's the centre studs that have gone - erm, I don't think I could possibly spin the rear wheel on bare pavement, I'm an ordinary mortal, not Thor or The Hulk.
Neither is he:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYp4w_CAqy0

ARRRR!
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Old 12-16-11, 08:32 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hairytoes View Post
I don't weigh much. It's the centre studs that have gone - erm, I don't think I could possibly spin the rear wheel on bare pavement, I'm an ordinary mortal, not Thor or The Hulk.

Schwalbe UK are sending me replacements. They say it's probably due to the crap state of the roads I'm riding on. They are probably right - I regularly hit debris such as lumps of wood, stones the size of plums and rough broken surfaces.
When I had problems with some other Schwalbe tires, they were also nice to me in the US, but they also argued that the problem was with the state of the roads. In the end, I had to move to different tires. I still ride plenty of Schwalbe, but avoid those that I burnt myself on. Under the circumstances, I will presumably avoid Marathon Winters - our roads here often look like after a fresh bombardment. Out of curiosity I looked on occasion whether I could find such bad roads in Eastern Europe and actually could not.
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Old 12-16-11, 09:18 AM   #12
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Must be a bad batch. I'm not even sure how many winters I have on mine. It must be 4 or 5. Never lost a single stud, and all the studs are still in good shape.
That said, as much as I like riding these tires on ice, they are pretty much useless in snow or slush. If I was to ride much in those conditions, i'd go for a more aggressive tread like the Schwalbe Snow stud.
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Old 12-16-11, 11:08 AM   #13
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Losing 15 studs in 120 miles is way beyond the normal range of acceptable. At that rate you'll have none soon. I would return them straight away.

4 years on my Nokian 106s not one lost stud. I would expect that from Schwalbe as well. I agree with the others, it must be a bad batch or even (gasp) fakes?
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Old 12-17-11, 07:46 AM   #14
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I haven't lost any studs yet and commuted all last winter on them. I am using them now as well. After a snow I have plowed streets but lots of melted slush and old frozen car tracks to deal with. I also run on a small bit of unpaved road and a patch of turf.
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Old 12-17-11, 04:45 PM   #15
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Just finished a gentle 40km on a new set of Marathon winter studs and lost 5 in the front and 19 in the rear. Running the front at 60 and the rear at 80 psi.
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Old 12-17-11, 05:28 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hairytoes View Post
I don't weigh much. It's the centre studs that have gone - erm, I don't think I could possibly spin the rear wheel on bare pavement, I'm an ordinary mortal, not Thor or The Hulk.

Schwalbe UK are sending me replacements. They say it's probably due to the crap state of the roads I'm riding on. They are probably right - I regularly hit debris such as lumps of wood, stones the size of plums and rough broken surfaces.
Hitting stuff like wood shouldn't be that bad. But if you are on trails and trying to climb some small bumps with roots, that's
where you can pull out studs. If you loose traction a little on the roots and the stud catches the root it can easily pull out.
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Old 12-17-11, 05:45 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryRanson View Post
Just finished a gentle 40km on a new set of Marathon winter studs and lost 5 in the front and 19 in the rear. Running the front at 60 and the rear at 80 psi.
I thought the psi was

Schwalbe marathon winter
26" version: ETRTO, 47-559, 200 studs 30 psi to 70 psi, our part number SWL11136448.
If that's your tire?
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Old 12-18-11, 08:10 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GaryRanson View Post
Just finished a gentle 40km on a new set of Marathon winter studs and lost 5 in the front and 19 in the rear. Running the front at 60 and the rear at 80 psi.
That's appalling and doesn't tally with other people's experiences in the past. I wonder if Schwalbe have changed manufacturers or something?
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Old 12-18-11, 12:24 PM   #19
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Just checked mine, 1 25 mile commute on them. 1 lost in front, 5 in back. My commute is on recently paved bike trails, so poor roads aren't a factor. I do climb hills (~400 ft) on each end of the ride, would that tear studs out?

Also, I bought mine this October. For people who are losing studs, were yours also purchased this year?

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Old 12-18-11, 07:07 PM   #20
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Man, I was a little peeved when I lost 1 stud in the back of my Nokian mount and grounds. That was in the first week of riding.
I haven't lost any since then and that was 3 years ago. And that was supporting 275-300lbs of bike and rider.
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Old 12-19-11, 07:52 AM   #21
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On my 700 x 35 the max psi is 85.


Quote:
Originally Posted by gbg View Post
I thought the psi was

Schwalbe marathon winter
26" version: ETRTO, 47-559, 200 studs 30 psi to 70 psi, our part number SWL11136448.
If that's your tire?
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Old 12-19-11, 07:54 AM   #22
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When I went back to the dealer who I bought them from, thinking that they would assist me as the Schwalbe rep is local, they told me to get replacements from an auto store. Meanwhile, I have emailed the manufacturer directly.


Quote:
Originally Posted by hairytoes View Post
That's appalling and doesn't tally with other people's experiences in the past. I wonder if Schwalbe have changed manufacturers or something?
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Old 12-19-11, 12:59 PM   #23
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Also, I bought mine this October. For people who are losing studs, were yours also purchased this year?
I got mine this August. For the record, I've lost 9 studs up front and 6 in the rear. All but one were from the two center rows. I'm running 60 or 65 PSI on the 26" tires.
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Old 12-19-11, 03:13 PM   #24
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Over 100 miles on the Nokian Extreme 294s. Not a single stud missing.
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Old 12-19-11, 05:22 PM   #25
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I bought my tyres this year. I've never had studded tyres before, so have no idea if this is unusual in these conditions. I've only be riding on dry (no snow yet) tarmac with these tyres.
Schwalbe UK have sent about 50 replacement studs.
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