I might be guilty of this as I don't 'commute' on my 'commuter' (Valencia), I like to ride on trails and on the roads in between the trails, since I have two nice short trails I can ride to from my house, soon to be joined by some other ones when a new trail is done soon. The Valencia seemed like the most roady upright bike but it works very well on crushed limestone trails and has durable tires std. I replaced a Trek 7100 w/ it. I took the 7100 on a rougher trail a couple of times but generally prefer to ride faster and not to go hurtling through the woods too much. I read some of the hybrid vs. road bike threads and it appears that there is some debate on the subject? What forum should I hang around?