You're spot on, Dfrost, my bars are about an inch below saddle height. The Berthoud is just about horizontal, maybe even tilted nose down a degree or so. I have heard they work best when horizontal. By contrast, the Brooks pro that it replaced, on my Shogun, is tilted nose up a couple of degrees (bars on this bike are also about an inch lower, and the saddle to bar distance is the same as the Rawland:
