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Training Status??? (IV)

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Training Status??? (IV)

Old 11-06-16, 09:12 AM
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The ego likes to think it's because I'm an aerobic rockstar, realistically it probably means I need a bit more rest before races. My numbers are at their best when I've been laying low for a few days and can push hard enough to have to breathe as hard as everyone else. I may be aerobically talented, but honestly, I'm racing 1's and 2's and it'd be silly to pretend they're not also on the level.
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Old 11-06-16, 10:22 AM
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I don't really buy the legs vs. lungs thing. It's all aerobic, for the most part, just on different ends of the pathway. Yes, that's oversimplifying the physiology, but anyway.

Went to try and do a power test yesterday. It didn't go well. Seems I'm having a similar problem as I did in the spring, I got sick and seemed to recover but it's sticking around in the form of deep fatigue. No sniffling, sneezing, coughing or headaches, but I go to pedal hard and the tank is empty. I knew things were looking bad when I did the 5' blowout effort and a) it felt awful, and b) I only managed 265 watts i.e. a good 7 watts under my best 20' from this summer. Sure enough, trying to do 20' was miserable and I bailed after two minutes and headed home. An hour of riding, and I was smoked for the rest of the day. Guess this explains why I've felt so uninterested in training this past week, as well as why I've been so tired. So I'm resting. Again. Can't believe I did two cross races in this condition.

I just want my legs back!
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Old 11-06-16, 11:39 AM
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It is aerobic, but if your legs aren't fully recovered you simply can't push as hard as when you are fresh. I use how many watts I am pushing along with what it is doing to my breathing to gauge that stuff along with perceived exertion. When I feel flat it is because my legs are meh, which is because I struggle with recovering properly, because I love riding my bike and often ride it a bit harder than my coach tells me to. :-|
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Old 11-06-16, 04:36 PM
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Did an impromptu FTP test when some guy passed me and did one of those Italian hand gestures because he went between me and the curb just as I had to evade a pothole. Kinda ticked me off, even though I may have done the same . After about 35 minutes, the guy finally fell off. The good thing is my 20m power is about 50 watts higher than I expected, and that was on tired legs (still slo tho).

I've been trying to get my left leg to catch up with my right power wise; goes back to all that glute stuff and it just not being strong enough and not trained to fire off when it should. When it does, riding the bike feels much smoother and easier.
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Old 11-06-16, 06:24 PM
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I'm half dead now. Went out for 4:45, mostly tempo with a sweet spot 40 minutes in the middle. At about 3:45 I was struggling to even do low tempo and finally gave in to zone 2.
280 TSS

Think next week will be recovery before riding with my new team (Matt's team) next Sunday.
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Old 11-06-16, 06:48 PM
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Did the usually hilly hammer ride yesterday and a few local climbs today. Legs felt pretty beat up.

So, I figured it'd be ideal to jump into my first cross race ever. Did not go well. Seemed technical to me and it was rather slick (the more seasoned cross guys disagreed on that). I got destroyed.

Wasn't sure what the rule of thumb was, but after 25 minutes or so I started getting lapped and pulled out of the race. Apparently you just keep going and try to stay out the way of guys that have a clue how to ride a bike.

800 TSS on 10.5 hours.
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Old 11-06-16, 07:14 PM
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There was a cross race in a park and I stopped by for a few. I've always been intimidated by them but some of those guys were really out of shape. One guy went over the barriers with his bike and just decided to keep walking. I knew a lot of the guys on the course and the beginner races is loaded with a ton of guys that shouldn't be in beginner races.

If you ever want to imagine a cross race in SoCal, just ride in a park in August.

One thing we do better in Cross than any other place in the world is own very clean bikes! Half of them have never seen mud.
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Old 11-06-16, 08:21 PM
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Originally Posted by hack
Did the usually hilly hammer ride yesterday and a few local climbs today. Legs felt pretty beat up.

So, I figured it'd be ideal to jump into my first cross race ever. Did not go well. Seemed technical to me and it was rather slick (the more seasoned cross guys disagreed on that). I got destroyed.

Wasn't sure what the rule of thumb was, but after 25 minutes or so I started getting lapped and pulled out of the race. Apparently you just keep going and try to stay out the way of guys that have a clue how to ride a bike.

800 TSS on 10.5 hours.
Depends on the race, but usually being lapped in a local race means you can keep racing. You finish on lead lap, like a crit.

Thing about cross is, I know [MENTION=74778]mattm[/MENTION] likes to snark about how easy it is, but it really depends. Some people can jump into their first races and have it go pretty well. Dealing with the corners and traction comes more naturally. To be honest, this was my experience. Other people have a harder time adapting to how different it is from road despite the similar bikes.

No matter who you are, though, jumping into a cross race when you've already done 700+ TSS that week probably isn't going to go well. It's not like jumping into a road race or a crit when you're tired. You can't just sit on the wheels and chill to nearly the same extent. Chilling out in a cross race requires deep experience and awesome fitness.

What category did you race? Did you use your road category to start as a 4 or 3?
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Old 11-06-16, 08:49 PM
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Originally Posted by grolby
Depends on the race, but usually being lapped in a local race means you can keep racing. You finish on lead lap, like a crit.

Thing about cross is, I know @mattm likes to snark about how easy it is, but it really depends. Some people can jump into their first races and have it go pretty well. Dealing with the corners and traction comes more naturally. To be honest, this was my experience. Other people have a harder time adapting to how different it is from road despite the similar bikes.

No matter who you are, though, jumping into a cross race when you've already done 700+ TSS that week probably isn't going to go well. It's not like jumping into a road race or a crit when you're tired. You can't just sit on the wheels and chill to nearly the same extent. Chilling out in a cross race requires deep experience and awesome fitness.

What category did you race? Did you use your road category to start as a 4 or 3?
I think the course last week would have been better. Less technical and more open stretches to put in longer efforts. My legs were pretty cooked today, but I was struggling with the off camber stuff and slick surfaces. I'd have had issues even if I was fresh. The guys in the later races were impressive. I'll give it another go and try not to doubly handicap myself.

We don't do a lot of USAC cross events out here, but with nats coming out to Reno next year (2018?) there have been efforts to help guys get points. So, morning races are non-USAC and afternoon races are USAC. I just did the "B" race which is 3,4,5. The "A" race is 1,2,3.

Fellow road guys that do a lot of cross got a laugh out of it at the very least.
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Old 11-06-16, 09:02 PM
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403mi/34.5k ft/22h45m this week, 1254 TSS. still a little short of my all time biggest week load wise (1309), but 128 CTL is a PR. total time this week was bigger than i did all of April, but i think that just speaks to how i only seem to be able to bike between May/June-November. pretty tired today, 4hr in the morning to the coast with Ygduf where we got rained on again and then 2 hours EZ only a couple hours later after lunch (teaching an injured runner from my track team about bikes - the poor guy didn't even have bib shorts until i gave him an old pair).

i'm thinking the next 1-2 days will be pretty easy, maybe trying to glass crank around the block a couple times tomorrow or something similar
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Old 11-06-16, 11:06 PM
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TKP I hear what you're saying about legs vs lungs and think similar types of things to myself.

I can usually tell whether "leg" or "lung" related governors will ultimately dictate my performance, and when I'm carrying so fatigue it's usually the former. Your legs just hurt too much to shred the gnar like that and you never get those puke-y or blood tasting sensations that you can when your training balance is higher.
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Old 11-06-16, 11:18 PM
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Just got back from three days off the bike, visting gf's family in DFW. I'm feeling antsy to start trainin', which begins in about 9 hours from now. I'm feeling more motivation than usual and riding more too. If I can manage to avoid getting sick or injured I should be pretty good next year.
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Old 11-06-16, 11:22 PM
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Originally Posted by scheibo
...2 hours EZ only a couple hours later after lunch (teaching an injured runner from my track team about bikes - the poor guy didn't even have bib shorts until i gave him an old pair).
nice, I like these kinds of introductory rides. I took a lot of joy in mentoring during collegiate cycling.

also, nice mileage! that's huge, I'll probably never hit that much riding.
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Old 11-06-16, 11:27 PM
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this is actually the 4th injured runner ive taken out for rides like this (running is a high attrition sport). the first 3 all ended up buying bikes - i need to work out a referral deal with a local shop or something. and yeah, its generally fun to pass on the knowledge, even though i havent been riding that long myself, especially important stuff like correct sock length and what not
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Old 11-07-16, 08:36 AM
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Ha! I think you've been riding enough to impart more than a few tips for beginners, esp. with the same running background like you. I'm also a failed runner myself - started running a lot in college and couldn't run as much as I wanted to without knee or foot problems.
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Old 11-07-16, 10:23 AM
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3 hrs group ride sat..think i did too much, knee hurts, 3 days off just work on legs
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Old 11-07-16, 10:57 AM
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Originally Posted by scheibo
this is actually the 4th injured runner ive taken out for rides like this (running is a high attrition sport).
and you got mad when i pointed that out a while back...

running is SUCH a great sport, but it is so, so cruel.

(i'm someone who can't run much any more due to various knee ops and no cartilage left in one knee -- but sometimes i miss the simplicity and efficiency of it.)
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Old 11-07-16, 11:28 AM
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Originally Posted by scheibo
this is actually the 4th injured runner ive taken out for rides like this (running is a high attrition sport). the first 3 all ended up buying bikes - i need to work out a referral deal with a local shop or something. and yeah, its generally fun to pass on the knowledge, even though i havent been riding that long myself, especially important stuff like correct sock length and what not
you should tell me their size and let mattm and I find them used bikes. the race teams all have people who want to upgrade (needlessly, mostly) every year and there are bargains to be had.
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Old 11-07-16, 12:01 PM
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Did one of those rides yesterday where it feels like "holy **** this is epic", but it was only 200 TSS & 72 miles.

At multiple points I wanted to cut it short but kept on chugging. Htfu!
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Old 11-07-16, 12:15 PM
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I woke up yesterday and thought, I need a lazy Sunday. So I ate a crumb cake - I did share one piece with my wife - watched TV and hung out with my dog.

It was fantastic.
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Old 11-07-16, 02:24 PM
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Originally Posted by grolby
Depends on the race, but usually being lapped in a local race means you can keep racing. You finish on lead lap, like a crit.

Thing about cross is, I know [MENTION=74778]mattm[/MENTION] likes to snark about how easy it is, but it really depends. Some people can jump into their first races and have it go pretty well. Dealing with the corners and traction comes more naturally. To be honest, this was my experience. Other people have a harder time adapting to how different it is from road despite the similar bikes.
Ha.

Actually I never said it was easy - more like hard to get pulled.
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Old 11-07-16, 03:26 PM
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finally some sweet sweet validation.

Did my recovery ride on my TT bike today. This is my new plan. All clean-road recovery rides will be on the tt bike. familiarizes me with handling, with the short cranks, and gets the upper-body adaptation along the way.

100mi-tt in Feb, like last year. I will be more prepared and will take the 5 minutes off my 100-mi time to take the series solo record. also I'll have some rocking delts by then.
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Old 11-07-16, 03:27 PM
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I was really bad at cross the two times I tried it. I still have my cross bike, but I enjoy riding it at my own pace much more than trying to go fast.
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Old 11-07-16, 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Ygduf


finally some sweet sweet validation.

Did my recovery ride on my TT bike today. This is my new plan. All clean-road recovery rides will be on the tt bike. familiarizes me with handling, with the short cranks, and gets the upper-body adaptation along the way.

100mi-tt in Feb, like last year. I will be more prepared and will take the 5 minutes off my 100-mi time to take the series solo record. also I'll have some rocking delts by then.
My coach has been trying to get me to do cx because he thinks it suits my "go hard all the time" mentality, but I made a deal with him that I'll focus on not sucking at ITTs instead. May start doing what you're doing...
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Old 11-07-16, 03:53 PM
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Originally Posted by TheKillerPenguin
May start doing what you're doing...
this is a good plan for everyone, tbh
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