Developing Fearlessness/Bike Handling Skills
03-13-17, 03:09 PM
#26
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,182
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 243 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
Truth may be stranger than fiction. I'm not convinced the issue here isn't fictional. Wktmeow's issue.
I'd say there is a good chance he is transposing. Showing up with something in the back of his mind having nothing to do with racing. We are complex organisms prone to deep examination only when trouble looms. Chances are he never figures it out and best case scenario plays out. Everything has cycles and he might just be going through a necessary maturing of his mental state that's slowing him down temporarily.
I'd say there is a good chance he is transposing. Showing up with something in the back of his mind having nothing to do with racing. We are complex organisms prone to deep examination only when trouble looms. Chances are he never figures it out and best case scenario plays out. Everything has cycles and he might just be going through a necessary maturing of his mental state that's slowing him down temporarily.
03-13-17, 04:03 PM
#27
Nonsense
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Vagabond
Posts: 13,918
Bikes: Affirmative
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 880 Post(s)
Liked 541 Times
in
237 Posts
I don't think it's unreasonable to find cornering while wearing next to no safety equipment while being in oxygen debt while surrounded by 50 other bros equally oxygen deprived and tunnel visioned a bit scary.
Maybe his problem is he's too reasonable. Unleash the inner caveman.
Maybe his problem is he's too reasonable. Unleash the inner caveman.
03-13-17, 04:42 PM
#28
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Folsom, CA
Posts: 3,888
Mentioned: 32 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 417 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times
in
3 Posts
You don't have to believe it, but I know CDR and I do believe it. Gimbels is a high profile, aggro race-like ride, I'm sure you have rides like that out there. Overlapping wheels in some situation where the guy in front is highly unlikely to swerve to that side (another rider there or whatever), sure. I've seen CDR tuck himself in a guy's jersey pocket many times. And also I know him and he's not a guy who makes stuff up just because. I know you don't believe his old-timey stories about 40 mph sprints or whatever, I can't speak to that, except to say that it was a time before GPS so who knows what any given speed sensor might say.
Having said that, the truth of the story is neither here nor there with respect to the OP's question. Everybody has their own risk aversion threshold and that's fine. I've seen guys (and girls) who are not naturally risk takers really feel like they need to be riskier in order to succeed and I don't think it's healthy, both in terms of being comfortable with who you are, and in terms of outcomes. So it's valid to respond to "how can I accept more risk" with both CDR's answer of "train yourself to be comfortable in risky-seeming situations" and with your answer of "don't accept more risk."
Having said that, the truth of the story is neither here nor there with respect to the OP's question. Everybody has their own risk aversion threshold and that's fine. I've seen guys (and girls) who are not naturally risk takers really feel like they need to be riskier in order to succeed and I don't think it's healthy, both in terms of being comfortable with who you are, and in terms of outcomes. So it's valid to respond to "how can I accept more risk" with both CDR's answer of "train yourself to be comfortable in risky-seeming situations" and with your answer of "don't accept more risk."
Pics?
03-13-17, 06:25 PM
#30
Senior Member
I don't see anything wrong with that picture.. looks "normal" racing to me. Hell last week on a stupid mandane group ride, I got my front wheel in between someone RD and wheel. My spokes came out alright, his RD might need an adjust but other then that A ok. I did have to instruct him to stop braking and stay straight, while I slowly worked my way out at ~20mph. Then remind that no one in their right mind stops at this T intersection when we are the top of the T..."he thought he heard someone say stop".. ah no.
Last edited by spdntrxi; 03-13-17 at 06:58 PM.
03-13-17, 06:56 PM
#31
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Southern California, USA
Posts: 10,474
Bikes: 1979 Raleigh Team 753
Mentioned: 153 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3374 Post(s)
Liked 371 Times
in
253 Posts
@Ygduf, I know you are/were not the big risk taker/not a sprinter, so question may be moot, but do you feel any different about risk after the twins?
03-13-17, 07:20 PM
#32
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Redwood City, CA
Posts: 10,978
Bikes: aggressive agreement is what I ride.
Mentioned: 109 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 967 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
4 Posts
that pic from perpendicular isn't even overlapped. I'm saying it's bull**** because it's clearly made-up ****. Irrespective of OPs post, which I've addressed in other posts with seriousness.
03-13-17, 07:21 PM
#33
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Redwood City, CA
Posts: 10,978
Bikes: aggressive agreement is what I ride.
Mentioned: 109 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 967 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 4 Times
in
4 Posts
@Ygduf, I know you are/were not the big risk taker/not a sprinter, so question may be moot, but do you feel any different about risk after the twins?
03-14-17, 06:19 AM
#35
Senior Member
i've raced and ridden with CDR a number of times and I can assure you he's not full of ****. he is an exceptionally skilled bike handler.
03-14-17, 07:28 AM
#36
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 2,182
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 243 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 0 Times
in
0 Posts
There are no old, bold, race promoters. Maybe ygduf could install his best set of bib overalls and ensure the future of Velo Promo.
Show off those race handling skills!
Show off those race handling skills!
03-14-17, 07:52 AM
#37
Senior Member
I was thinking a camera would speak volumes so if I ever get riding outside again maybe I'll set up an "overlap" cam.
I do remember you not believing sitting a few inches off a wheel. I pretty much remember every time I'm in a pinch and look down and notice I'm a few inches off a wheel.
The thing is that if you do these slow speed drills and get used to touching wheels regularly then you'd think nothing of it.
I'm not even a great balancer on the bike. I can't do Sagan things. I don't do well on balance beams. But on the bike I've practiced and I'm comfortable being in close quarters to other riders.
I still stand by my thoughts on how to develop bike handling skills, specifically those required for close quarters cornering and pack riding. I turned a corner after doing that semester of bike handling drills and I think every racer should have to do something like that.
__________________
"...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson
"...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson
03-14-17, 08:11 AM
#38
Senior Member
I look at my old speeds and stuff and it's hard for me to believe I did that stuff. So I'm okay with skepticism.
The speedometers were calibrated on tire circumference in mm so they were pretty accurate, as accurate as they are now. The thing is that I couldn't preserve them, i.e. no downloads, so no objective records. I wrote down stuff etc but that's not as objective as downloaded data.
I struggle to hit 40 mph nowadays. 37 mph is pretty straightforward, even at the end of a race into wind etc - it's usually enough to gap off the field for a bit (like soft pedal for the last 20 seconds and still win the sprint or, in another case, having the second place rider roll up to me about 300-400m later). My fastest sprint in the last 10 or so years was a wind assisted 44 mph with less than ideal wheels while not fit. I haven't had a proper sprint in a while.
The speedometers were calibrated on tire circumference in mm so they were pretty accurate, as accurate as they are now. The thing is that I couldn't preserve them, i.e. no downloads, so no objective records. I wrote down stuff etc but that's not as objective as downloaded data.
I struggle to hit 40 mph nowadays. 37 mph is pretty straightforward, even at the end of a race into wind etc - it's usually enough to gap off the field for a bit (like soft pedal for the last 20 seconds and still win the sprint or, in another case, having the second place rider roll up to me about 300-400m later). My fastest sprint in the last 10 or so years was a wind assisted 44 mph with less than ideal wheels while not fit. I haven't had a proper sprint in a while.
__________________
"...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson
"...during the Lance years, being fit became the No. 1 thing. Totally the only thing. It’s a big part of what we do, but fitness is not the only thing. There’s skills, there’s tactics … there’s all kinds of stuff..." Tim Johnson
03-14-17, 08:45 AM
#39
Nonsense
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Vagabond
Posts: 13,918
Bikes: Affirmative
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 880 Post(s)
Liked 541 Times
in
237 Posts
CDR is able to place himself basically anywhere he wants inside a pack and it is ridiculous watching him move around through gaps that really aren't even there. He's the real deal, and there is a reason he can survive and place/win races on low watts.
03-14-17, 11:20 AM
#41
**** that
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: CALI
Posts: 15,402
Mentioned: 151 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1099 Post(s)
Liked 104 Times
in
30 Posts
a) you ignored my response, in which I pointed out this is mostly about fear/risk, has little to do with actual bike handling skills! /thread
b) this thread has devolved into discussion of cdr's sprint speed and bike handling ability (who cares)
03-14-17, 11:34 AM
#45
Senior Member
Thread Starter
@wktmeow I'm offended that:
a) you ignored my response, in which I pointed out this is mostly about fear/risk, has little to do with actual bike handling skills! /thread
b) this thread has devolved into discussion of cdr's sprint speed and bike handling ability (who cares)
a) you ignored my response, in which I pointed out this is mostly about fear/risk, has little to do with actual bike handling skills! /thread
b) this thread has devolved into discussion of cdr's sprint speed and bike handling ability (who cares)
It took me over a year to try dropping into a half pipe for the first time. I'm just going to have to keep at it, I suppose. Maybe I'll try doing something that scares me every ride. E.g. my road bike feels sorta twitchy riding no handed on the road, and this frightens me so I try to do as much as I can one handed. I can practice riding no handed for a few minutes at the end of every ride, working up to maybe grabbing stuff from pockets or opening a gel, etc. I can start diving into corners hotter on my commute, just a bit outside my usual comfort zone, etc. I can ride in the gutter once in a while and cross over the seam that usually freaks me out a little bit, etc.
03-14-17, 11:35 AM
#46
Senior Member
Thread Starter
03-14-17, 11:55 AM
#49
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Folsom, CA
Posts: 3,888
Mentioned: 32 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 417 Post(s)
Likes: 0
Liked 3 Times
in
3 Posts
I will say ... at Land Park, Carling was moving through the field like a panther. Dude was fitting through gaps that were laughably tight. Wish I had video of it because it was a "wtf did he just do" kind of thing. I'm used to seeing riders move others out of the way, but Carling just noodled his way through.