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At what point does a crit racer want a more aero bike?

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At what point does a crit racer want a more aero bike?

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Old 07-25-18, 11:53 AM
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Radish_legs
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At what point does a crit racer want a more aero bike?

I'm on the 105 version of the supersix (not the hi-mod). It's been a good bike for me. But the fame is not aero. It's a bit heavy. And it has a cable housing birds nest on the front.

If you read from some of these experts, they say how aero your bike is can be a bike length in a sprint.

I've actually got my eye on the specialized allez sprint. Relatively cheap bike, cleaner, aluminum, more aero.

I brought this question up over a year ago, and I was told to keep on with the supersix and not sweat this. I've got a friend on an older supersix (he's a breakaway guy) and he does well.
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Old 07-25-18, 12:36 PM
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IMO there's a lot more things you can clean up in a crit to make things faster. The kit and positioning on the bike is probably the biggest one. The aero advantage also comes into play very little, but it does in the sprint which you will get a few inches.

The big detractor of aero bikes for me is the cost penalty. Many seem to cost a fair bit more just for being more aero. That's why a lot of crit racers don't use them, its not as practical to spend $1000 more on a frame, especially working under the assumption of destroying one in a crash. IMO the best way to go is aero bars and wheels.

I couldn't find the white paper, but this is from Cervelo after they put out the S5 which shows the aero breakdown of each part on the bike:

Seatpost: 1 percent
Rear brake: 2 percent
Front brake: 3 percent
Rear Wheel: 5 percent
Drivetrain: 9 percent
Bottle: 9 percent
Fork: 9 percent
Frame: 16 percent
Front wheel: 16 percent
Handlebar: 30 percent

Also bear in mind there isn't much opportunity to lose much watts on some of those parts. My guess is the difference between forks, seats, and bottles, are either minimal or there are reasons to not pay attention (i.e. gaining 1 watt and losing seat comfort).

If I were to buy a full on crit bike I'd probably go with an Allez Sprint 1x11 with 60mm deep wheels and aero bars.

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Old 07-25-18, 12:58 PM
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I think it matters enough to factor it in when you're looking to buy a new bike, but not so much that you should stop riding a bike you're already happy with.

I will say that I am on an aero bike and love it, and still dream about an Allez Sprint. Such a nice frame...
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Old 07-25-18, 01:09 PM
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I bought the Allez Sprint Comp because it seemed like the nicest bike (that I liked the looks of) I could afford. I have no ideas of the aero'ness of the bike but I sure do enjoy riding it. I added some aeor bars and I do like the relatively clean look on the front. I was hoping for the Blue one, but they were sold out so I had to settle for the orange-'ish yellow-ey orange tinted yellow one.

Great bike.

Again I bought the bike because I like the shape and lines of it. I'm no crit racer or a road racer although I do participate in races from time to time. The limiter in my case is and will always be ME.

I would think any reason, and I mean ANY reason is good enough to get a new bike. And go with aero, I think they look pretty cool.

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Old 07-25-18, 01:26 PM
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Originally Posted by TheKillerPenguin View Post
I think it matters enough to factor it in when you're looking to buy a new bike, but not so much that you should stop riding a bike you're already happy with.
This.

If, and this is a big IF, you are maxing out your training and potential, and you are coming up just inches short in all your races, then yes, maybe it would be worthwhile to look into improving aerodynamics of your equipment.
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Old 07-25-18, 02:29 PM
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I got an aero bike (Felt AR 5) three years ago for 1500 bucks on ebay, new. I then got aero handlebars and even an aero front brake (tririg). Then I got aero wheels last year.

I also built up a Chinese bike which is all pretty regular tubing and the like, though I put the aero wheels and an aero Zipp SL bar on it. I ended up switching back to my aero bike in May. It was just faster. Both subjectively and qualitatively with speed and power.

Now I just race on that.

I wouldn't just up and get a new bike purely for that, but if I were looking at a new bike, I'd definitely go aero if speed is your concern. (edit: what TPK said).
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Old 07-25-18, 04:09 PM
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the allez sprint lets you basically switch the shifter cables so that there's less cable housing bend in the front, because the BB portion easily lets you cross the cables back to their correct ports. however, has anyone actually seen wind tunnel data that tests the allez sprint? specialized say it's just as aero as their old venge (of course they would say something like that). where's the data? i can see the attraction though. it's a good looking frame. I'm just skeptical that all these bike manufacturers all claim their product is the best. it's BS

I don't believe my caad9 frame limited me in any way. After I totaled my bike, I went on craigslist and got a felt 3c frame, which was relatively cheap, and it does the job well enough. the next race bike will likely have disc brakes on it.

I never was able to test an aero bike vs a non-aero bike, all other things constant. it's very difficult.. the most important thing is probably the geometry and fit. you'd get a bigger aero gain going from 44 cm bars to 40 or 38, than spending $1.5k on a pair of zipps. that's the sad thing I see people do. They roll around in wheels that cost more than all my bikes combined, and they're wearing non aero helmets, with upright bike fits.
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Old 07-25-18, 05:20 PM
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probably right around 24mph
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Old 07-25-18, 05:27 PM
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if you like to be OTF... then yeah aero will help.
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Old 07-25-18, 08:05 PM
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duh. Trick question. The answer is immediately after you're beaten by someone on one.
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Old 07-25-18, 09:24 PM
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Originally Posted by furiousferret View Post
IMO there's a lot more things you can clean up in a crit to make things faster. The kit and positioning on the bike is probably the biggest one. The aero advantage also comes into play very little, but it does in the sprint which you will get a few inches.
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Old 07-26-18, 10:15 AM
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Is there a certain # of miles on a carbon frame that you start to consider selling the bike, or otherwise getting a new bike?
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Old 07-26-18, 10:26 AM
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Originally Posted by furiousferret View Post
...
I couldn't find the white paper, but this is from Cervelo after they put out the S5 which shows the aero breakdown of each part on the bike:

...
Handlebar: 30 percent

...
That's news to me
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Old 07-26-18, 10:26 AM
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41,000
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Old 07-26-18, 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted by topflightpro View Post
41,000
nice
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Old 07-26-18, 01:41 PM
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Originally Posted by akdmx View Post
That's news to me
they are the widest part of the frame
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Old 07-26-18, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by spectastic View Post
. you'd get a bigger aero gain going from 44 cm bars to 40 or 38, than spending $1.5k on a pair of zipps. that's the sad thing I see people do. They roll around in wheels that cost more than all my bikes combined, and they're wearing non aero helmets, with upright bike fits.
That's why I roll with 38cm bars.

Nah, the saddest thing people do is get those $2000 Zipps or $3000 Enves and then put gatorskins on them. Eureka!
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Old 07-26-18, 04:09 PM
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Originally Posted by rubiksoval View Post
That's why I roll with 38cm bars.

Nah, the saddest thing people do is get those $2000 Zipps or $3000 Enves and then put gatorskins on them. Eureka!
I totally saw that in Montreal last week
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Old 07-28-18, 06:24 PM
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Get a bike that fits for a crit. Make it feel like an extension of your body. You should feel free to throw it around and know how it will react. That is more important than being aero.
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Old 07-28-18, 06:40 PM
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Originally Posted by rubiksoval View Post
That's why I roll with 38cm bars.

Nah, the saddest thing people do is get those $2000 Zipps or $3000 Enves and then put gatorskins on them. Eureka!
I have a pair of 65mm Edge (now Enve) tubular wheels that I haven't ridden since I stopped racing and I only bought them because I was racing on a team sponsored by them and I got them at cost.

I have to say they are really nice wheels.

Great wheels to ride on, probably helped a bit in time trials, but never made any difference to me in a crit or a road race compared to the other wheels I raced.

I should probably sell them.
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Old 07-29-18, 04:37 AM
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Originally Posted by mollusk View Post
I have a pair of 65mm Edge (now Enve) tubular wheels that I haven't ridden since I stopped racing and I only bought them because I was racing on a team sponsored by them and I got them at cost.

I have to say they are really nice wheels.

Great wheels to ride on, probably helped a bit in time trials, but never made any difference to me in a crit or a road race compared to the other wheels I raced.

I should probably sell them.
I'm in the same boat with some Zipp 404s. They are still in great shape, but the price of 404 tubulars has fallen so much, I'm not sure it's worth my effort to sell them, especially cause I could use them again in the future. I think.
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Old 08-01-18, 11:12 AM
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Originally Posted by topflightpro View Post
41,000
dang

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