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How common is 300w for an hour?

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How common is 300w for an hour?

Old 03-09-21, 01:47 PM
  #251  
jfmckenna
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This guy held 318 watts for 5 hours and finished off with 1300+

https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/ana...ng-power-data/
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Old 03-09-21, 03:54 PM
  #252  
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Originally Posted by gsteinb View Post
Not having any idea what that is, it sounds kind of not too PC.
Might sound that way, and that is OK with me, but they were a bit of a thing in SoCal late 80's early 90s. Through my excellent talent identification I managed first mixed tandem in Mexicali San Felipe ins '88 - 5,000 riders, maybe 500 tandems. First tandem in Tecate Ensenada in '92 with some 2,000 and maybe a course record. And 1st out of 10,000 in Rosarito Ensinada on '95. Longer story, but we broke 2 hours and I doubt that has ever been done before or since.
That was good for a few newspaper write-ups and free beer. Below a typical Mexican Fondo start with another couple thousand in front, 5,000 - 8,000 behind.
There were some 100 or so serious racers in the group and a good 5-10 (of maybe 500) powerful male tandem teams. At one time there was money that was significantly better than USCF purses.


My Mexican Fondo self and my secret monster engine (and Nat tandem champ) on the rear.

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Old 03-09-21, 04:05 PM
  #253  
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Originally Posted by Doge View Post
It is funny when a rider in an age group pretty much shuts it down for a generation or two. I was never at that level but the Mark Hoffenberg and Thurlow Rogers being local and somewhat in my age group made the whole thing rather a non-issue. I saw no point in competing outside of a RAAM or Mexican Fondo.
Thurlow Rogers...That's a name I haven't heard in a while. When I was at my peak ('00-'04), "Turbo" would occasionally show up to some of the local go-fast training rides in my area and proceed to make everyone suffer more than usual. He was already racing Masters at the time.
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Old 03-09-21, 04:07 PM
  #254  
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Let’s soak up this rare pic of Doge on a bike racing.

My wife and I rode Tecate Ensenada and Rosarito Ensenada on the tandem and on individual road bikes. Pretty fun events.
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Old 03-09-21, 04:48 PM
  #255  
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Originally Posted by Hermes View Post
Lets soak up this rare pic of Doge on a bike racing.

My wife and I rode Tecate Ensenada and Rosarito Ensenada on the tandem and on individual road bikes. Pretty fun events.
When it hurts, I know how to make it stop, and I do.
When I have a partner depending on me, I both train harder and ride harder. I was not made to be a solo bike racer. I believe I understand well what it takes and that is not what I have.

What was interesting is we (same for the mixed) were faster than teams of better single riders. The tandem used to be a big track event. Like many cycling events new things replace old things. Had it stayed I would likely have stayed involved. I've had 4-5 tandems and as an engineer in the 80s did early 3D Finite Element designs of frames. That was a special frame. Burn (his name) at Phil Wood made an ovalized TT for me. I had Dwan at Co-Motion run the rear laterals past the seat tube. It was a joy to sprint on and with moose on the back we could ride off the front of Como up or down the hill. Mostly due to moose. Those wer some of my wheels. Running 32 hole bladed tied and soldered. I had tubulars that were lighter, but we thought in Mexico we should go with clinchers for spares. I ran those at 140 PSI.
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Old 03-09-21, 05:51 PM
  #256  
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Its a fun ride, you're supposed to be waving and smiling at the camera!
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Old 03-10-21, 08:35 AM
  #257  
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I have found a local route that's used a lot by roadie groups and safe and flat enough long enough I'm giving a 50 a try this spring. It's out by Butner where grandpa Madhoff is in prison. It's also normally neutral cross wind, meaning a plus for a disc rear wheel.

I'll give it a go. If my 25 pace was over 25mph, it's going to be really really close for a sub 2-hr. In training now I'm within 7w of that 25mi pace from 2020 for 90min rides on the TT bike of challenging hills/corners. Stands to reason if I can meter the effort better on flatter terrain I'd gain a watt or two.

Realistic goal is 125min. Good training opportunity. Needs to warmup though in the mornings as I would be doing it at sunup for no traffic.
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Old 03-10-21, 07:24 PM
  #258  
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Originally Posted by burnthesheep View Post
I have found a local route that's used a lot by roadie groups and safe and flat enough long enough I'm giving a 50 a try this spring. It's out by Butner where grandpa Madhoff is in prison. It's also normally neutral cross wind, meaning a plus for a disc rear wheel.

I'll give it a go. If my 25 pace was over 25mph, it's going to be really really close for a sub 2-hr. In training now I'm within 7w of that 25mi pace from 2020 for 90min rides on the TT bike of challenging hills/corners. Stands to reason if I can meter the effort better on flatter terrain I'd gain a watt or two.

Realistic goal is 125min. Good training opportunity. Needs to warmup though in the mornings as I would be doing it at sunup for no traffic.
To change the subject a wee bit, a good aero position and some head tucking and helmet can easily get you that 7w. You could likely drop 20W and be faster. If you can hold 25MPH now, it is rare that there is not significant - more significant improvements lowering both Crr and power. The goal should be to lower both - and go faster. Just my bias, but outside of the VR world speed is still the 2nd best measure vs winning.
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Old 03-15-21, 07:45 AM
  #259  
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Originally Posted by Doge View Post
Would his initials be LN?
Slightly off topic, but I feel like I need to point out that Larry Nolan does his pursuit and team pursuits (and for a number of years also his mass start races) on a stock Specialized Shiv. He has also never been to the wind tunnel and doesn't wear $400 skin suits when he races.

You don't need to spend a gazillion dollars to go fast. It certainly doesn't hurt and will make you go marginally faster, but at the masters level you can win national and world championships on pretty normal stuff.

I set my hour record on a stripped down BMC TT bike and later used an aluminum Langster to win the scratch race and a Shiv to win the Team Pursuit and Worlds.
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Old 03-15-21, 10:11 AM
  #260  
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Originally Posted by Eric F View Post
Thurlow Rogers...That's a name I haven't heard in a while. When I was at my peak ('00-'04), "Turbo" would occasionally show up to some of the local go-fast training rides in my area and proceed to make everyone suffer more than usual. He was already racing Masters at the time.
I've had a hard time coming around him at the Swami's ride before, he's got some power
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Old 03-15-21, 10:19 AM
  #261  
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Originally Posted by nslckevin View Post
Slightly off topic, but I feel like I need to point out that Larry Nolan does his pursuit and team pursuits (and for a number of years also his mass start races) on a stock Specialized Shiv. He has also never been to the wind tunnel and doesn't wear $400 skin suits when he races.

You don't need to spend a gazillion dollars to go fast. It certainly doesn't hurt and will make you go marginally faster, but at the masters level you can win national and world championships on pretty normal stuff.

I set my hour record on a stripped down BMC TT bike and later used an aluminum Langster to win the scratch race and a Shiv to win the Team Pursuit and Worlds.
I think before that he used a Specialized Transition

I used to ride with Team Fremont, who he would come out and coach Thursday nights for. I was still a noobly cat 4, but I remember he was super strong. One time we were having a scratch race and it was me against a cat 3 off the front going what I thought was a hard pace to the line, and he just pulls up next to us and casually starts coaching me through the sprint.

Btw - are you not doing the 2x20's every weekday during the off-season anymore? I remember I tried doing a bunch of those on the trainer after seeing your results from it, I burned out real fast lol
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Old 03-15-21, 06:02 PM
  #262  
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Originally Posted by nslckevin View Post
Slightly off topic, but I feel like I need to point out that Larry Nolan does his pursuit and team pursuits (and for a number of years also his mass start races) on a stock Specialized Shiv. He has also never been to the wind tunnel and doesn't wear $400 skin suits when he races.

You don't need to spend a gazillion dollars to go fast. It certainly doesn't hurt and will make you go marginally faster, but at the masters level you can win national and world championships on pretty normal stuff.

I set my hour record on a stripped down BMC TT bike and later used an aluminum Langster to win the scratch race and a Shiv to win the Team Pursuit and Worlds.
When my kid was going to do the pursuit I was going to convert his FELT TT bike. I got some grief for that in the track forum. It was just a cheaper way to start. I bought the good wheel.
That plan never happened, but I saw photos of LN's bike and figured it would do fine. Because of locations and timing building for ITT, then track was just too difficult. I would have just bought a track bike had he continued.
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Old 03-15-21, 10:21 PM
  #263  
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Originally Posted by wktmeow View Post
I think before that he used a Specialized Transition

I used to ride with Team Fremont, who he would come out and coach Thursday nights for. I was still a noobly cat 4, but I remember he was super strong. One time we were having a scratch race and it was me against a cat 3 off the front going what I thought was a hard pace to the line, and he just pulls up next to us and casually starts coaching me through the sprint.

Btw - are you not doing the 2x20's every weekday during the off-season anymore? I remember I tried doing a bunch of those on the trainer after seeing your results from it, I burned out real fast lol
The Transition is not UCI legal so he's been using the Shiv for a number of years now.

I retired (from working) in 2019 and no longer have a problem getting out when it's light during the winter. So now I ride a lot more than I used to, but with less intensity. Still now sure how that's working due to the pandemic. :-)
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Old 03-18-21, 07:40 PM
  #264  
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Originally Posted by topflightpro View Post
Typically, indoor power numbers are 10-15% lower than outdoor numbers.
I see this all the time but I can't hold power outside like I can inside unless it's cool outside, like in the 50s. As long as I have a fan I'm almost always better inside than outside.

As to the initial question - I looked up my best power numbers on Strava and got this:
20 min-304 Watts
30 min-289 Watts
45 min-275 Watts
60 min-269 Watts
90 min-238 Watts

None of the efforts past 20 minutes were the hardest I could go for that exact time nor were they all done when my FTP was actually at its max, which would be 289. That 90 minute effort, for example, was day two of the Haute Route on Zwift after a really hard day one. The ride was 1:53 there was only a 6 Watt drop off in average power from the 45 minute average (244) to the cumulative average (238) and that ride was done at an FTP of 274 (tested only a week or two prior).

My max FTP of 289 was done when I was 195 lbs or so (88.6kg). I'm less than that now but I'm sure after a bit more work to get my FTP up I can get back to 289 and at my current weight 175. The 20 pounds difference is just fat, anyway.

I think many people are correct that if you're only kinda trained that there would be a huge drop in power for most people past 30 minutes or so. Putting out power, recovering at speed, and then putting out power again is REALLY HARD. I'm not a racer and just a mid-level Cat B on Zwift but that's certainly the most enjoyable part of the few races I do. How long can I hold on until I crack and what will my sprint look like at the end (sprint is always bad)?

I'm a 47-year old nobody and on Zwift I regularly get easily beaten by people in their 40s and 50s. I'm also in the Navy and we can ride an exercise bike (12-minute test) for the aerobic portion of the fitness test. The test is entirely a power/weight test and last time I took it, pre-COVID, I was the best out of the 700 or so Sailors that tested. It wasn't even a close contest. I crushed Sailors half my age.

So I guess it depends on your comparison. Hardcore cyclists on Zwift? Yeah, 300W is easy to find. Your local Navy base or cycling club of enthusiasts? Probably not. There are only two people in my local bike store Strava club out of about 150 who a) have power meter on their bike or trainer and b) have an FTP over 300.

Last edited by guachi; 03-18-21 at 08:47 PM.
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Old 03-19-21, 06:15 AM
  #265  
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Originally Posted by guachi View Post
guachi's post
Even at 289 though, that's 11w shy and your closest ever actually doing it at 270 is a whole 30w shy.

It's easy to find folks doing it for 20min, totally agreed. But the hour is still rarer.

I'm similar for the taper as yours. Almost identical. My best actual hour is a hair lower and best actual 90min a hair higher.

I just think the preparation and "cost" to do an actual all our hour is also a severely limiting factor. Folks could, but they'd have to do a couple weeks of preparatory workouts and a proper preparatory taper. Then actually have the mental fortitude to do 100% for a whole hour.

I've done some Strava TT training at 100% on the TT bike longer than 20min for like 25, 30, 35min and that still isn't the same as a full hour. The prep, cost, mental, is just soooooo out there. Which is why the hour record is fascinating to me. Lots of kudos always goes to the cool aero tech and prep, or the huge watts, but not necessarily the technical physiological and mental preparation for such a thing. The aero tech sells stuff, the mental stuff people find boring or exhausting.
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Old 03-19-21, 06:57 AM
  #266  
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I know of someone locally who did 3hrs averaging 300w this past week on the trainer, but that dude is elite, TheKillerPenguin you know who I'm talking about
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Old 03-19-21, 12:41 PM
  #267  
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I do indeed. I've done 300 for 3, but the rider in question weighs like 15-20lbs less than I do. Did you see his workout yesterday? Absolutely nuts!
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Old 03-19-21, 01:26 PM
  #268  
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Originally Posted by TheKillerPenguin View Post
I do indeed. I've done 300 for 3, but the rider in question weighs like 15-20lbs less than I do. Did you see his workout yesterday? Absolutely nuts!
totally, his 35min power is the same as my best 90sec power in recent history lol
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Old 03-21-21, 04:54 PM
  #269  
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Originally Posted by guachi View Post
...47-year old ....in the Navy...(12-minute test)... Sailors
So much parsing I could be a news reporter. Anyway, Thank you for your service.
AND
12 min is very different than an hour.
A Sailor is pretty close to the water. Airmen - esp. those at school are not which is why in collegiate aerobic sports the high academy dominates .
300W for an hour is not so much a strength test as a aerobic one. 12 min - is that mostly aerobic, but not the same as 1 hour which is all aerobic.
Those sleeping high will have a significant advantage for that power and that time.
Your doing that at age 47 is pretty cool, but just tells me you are talented and I don't think the age matters so much. Boston marathon runners in their 50s do better times than Lance did (running) .
It is max power that decreases faster with age, not so much hour power. That hour power will still go down, but is much less related to muscle mass which is more correlated to age. I would guess you would not be best at 20 second power over those 700 Sailors. But then, you just might be a beast.
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Old 03-23-21, 09:50 PM
  #270  
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Originally Posted by Doge View Post
I would guess you would not be best at 20 second power over those 700 Sailors. But then, you just might be a beast.
I'd be willing to bet most of the best Sailors that run for their fitness test could beat my 20 second sprint on the bike. I used to run hurdles in high school but my anaerobic sprint speed is mostly shot now. I just set a new best hour (59:58 to be exact) of 276W but I still haven't cracked 1000W for even 1s since I got a power meter two years ago.

As far as the Navy goes I don't *need* a sprint speed as the bikes top out at about 500-525W and you aren't allowed to come out of the saddle when you ride for the fitness test. The Navy gives us awesome Concept 2 rowers for those who choose to row and mediocre gym-level exercise bikes to ride on. Discrimination!
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Old 03-24-21, 02:29 PM
  #271  
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https://www.strava.com/activities/4891293526
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Old 03-29-21, 08:41 AM
  #272  
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Originally Posted by wktmeow View Post
Geez.

Now, this is off topic for the original stuff, but if you apply the % of ftp they likely rode that at.......could we hold our number that long? I would assume someone like that could do in the 90's for % of ftp for that long. I couldn't. I have done almost 90% for 90min before. But that's still not like this dude or the Paris Roubaix breakaway numbers. That stuff is just unreal.
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Old 03-29-21, 08:54 AM
  #273  
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Originally Posted by wktmeow View Post
I raced a crit against this guy when he was starting out, I didn't make the break with him lol
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Old 03-29-21, 10:03 AM
  #274  
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Originally Posted by burnthesheep View Post
Geez.

Now, this is off topic for the original stuff, but if you apply the % of ftp they likely rode that at.......could we hold our number that long? I would assume someone like that could do in the 90's for % of ftp for that long. I couldn't. I have done almost 90% for 90min before. But that's still not like this dude or the Paris Roubaix breakaway numbers. That stuff is just unreal.
I think it varies between riders, different TTE for different power outputs. It may be something worth training depending on what your target events look like.
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Old 03-29-21, 10:06 AM
  #275  
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Originally Posted by hubcyclist View Post
I raced a crit against this guy when he was starting out, I didn't make the break with him lol
Yea he holds multiple lightweight rowing records, not someone I would want to go toe to toe with - https://www.thecrimson.com/article/2...marathon-2018/

And oh hey would you look at that, he's my racing category and lives in SoCal too

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