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Lance's War. Best cycling book I've read

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Lance's War. Best cycling book I've read

Old 03-13-06, 05:15 PM
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Amazing. Great read. Really paints a more complete/complex picture of Lance. And of how bicycle racing is a middle/upper class sport here - and a lower class blue collar sport to a large extent in Europe. Absolutely fascinating. One of the best sports books I've read - perhaps THE best.

The most interesting thing about 'Lance's War' is that Lance lovers - OR Lance haters - might agree with and enjoy the way Lance is portrayed in this book. What a character. It may be a while before you see another athlete like him come down the pike.

Is Lance still my hero? Sure. Was he knocked off the ridiculous pedestal his PR machine has built for him? Yeah, OK. And now I like him even MORE. And if he doped and didn't get caught. F'em. Those Euro cycling officials are utter boneheads in so many different ways that it would take a novella to get into all of it. What I'll NEVER get is how Europeans say 'Bike racing has always been full of dopers' - and then they get upset at the notion that some Texan may have come along and successfully played the same game European cycling heroes have been playing for DECADES. Get a grip. IF Lance doped, he pulled it off, didn't he? And THAT's what pisses them off the most. 'Cheating?' Please. If doping is all half of Europe cracks it up to be showing up at the Tour de France without EPO in 1999 would have been like coming to LeMans with a diesel (which Audi is doing this year by the way). The truth surely lies somewhere smack in the middle. And as long as the blood tests are negative you can take all that other stuff and wipe your ass with it - starting with 'L.A. Confidential'. That's like me saying Pam Anderson has breast implants. Even if we all think we KNOW it what's the point?

What struck me the most was the utter disconnect between American's upper middle class cycling fans/weenies - and the beer swilling/chain smoking crowd in Europe. No WONDER they hate Lance so much. Good God, the cycling fans there sound like soccer hooligans. Maybe THOSE were the gavones hocking loogies on Lance on the L'Alp TT. Yeah, that worked. Piss off a Texas guy like Lance. Brilliant. Like he needs MORE incentive to Kick the World's Ass.

The only way I could like Lance more is if he was from NY or NJ. It's amazing how similar some of the personalities are in NY and Texas. Hey, just like Americans are JUST like the French. I'll bet that drives some of you out there completely crazy, doesn't it. I love it.

Take that Euro, you insufferable weenie. Are you one of the 'best 1000 racers in England' yet? You idiot.

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Old 03-13-06, 06:08 PM
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I agree, I just finished the book yesterday. What an incredible read - doesn't matter if you are a Lance fan or a Lance hater. I really thought it was interesting just how much Lance knew about his opponents - damn near everything.

Amazing insight in the Tour that many people, even cyclists, don't know about. I strongly suggest it.
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Old 03-13-06, 06:17 PM
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I read some of that book the other day and really loved the chapter on Vino and Ullrich. I can't wait to see Vinokurov at this year's tour.

Not to change the subject; but here he is in a photo with his new team. Does his seatpost look a little high? Come to think of it, HE looks a little high.

Judging by that tan, it looks like he trains on the sun.
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Old 03-13-06, 06:38 PM
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I really like the glare of his teammate in the front row, partially hidden by the official. I bet he's thinking to himself, "Gee, I wonder how many times Vino will chase me down in a break this season?"
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Old 03-13-06, 06:41 PM
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I'm really enjoying it as well. I still have about 100 pages to go but so far it is great. I couldn't believe it when I found it for $8.99 at a bookstore the other day for a hardback. Couldn't pass it up.

I'm enjoying it much more than the other book I have been reading, 23 Days in July. I'm having a tough time getting through that one.
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Old 03-13-06, 07:39 PM
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Originally Posted by LowCel
I'm really enjoying it as well. I still have about 100 pages to go but so far it is great. I couldn't believe it when I found it for $8.99 at a bookstore the other day for a hardback. Couldn't pass it up.

I'm enjoying it much more than the other book I have been reading, 23 Days in July. I'm having a tough time getting through that one.
I got mine 'used' on Amazon for like $8 with shipping included. It arrived. PERFECT condition.

My books are NEVER in good shape when I'm done with them. Soda/spaghetti sauce stains. But I do enjoy them. I buy ALL my hard cover books used. They're going to look MUCH worse when I'm done with them anyway. I'm careful with my coffee table picture books.

Man, what a great read. The **** That Will Kill Them. You gotta love it. The most impressive thing about Lance is that he's a hard boy harder than all those Euro hard boys. And those Euro cyclist dudes are friggin TOUGH dudes. So they can take all that "Lance EPO" crap and shove it straight up their Euro friggin asses. Hey, just like Lance shoved SEVEN Tdf wins up there. God, how great is that? Take THAT away you Euro Weenies. Good luck.

Now let's all sing Kum Bay Ya around the campfire for World Peace. F that.

You know what? I was going to root for Jan (Nicest Guy in Cycling) this year, but not now. Floyd Landis is another Pissed off American Who Wants to Kick the World's Ass. And I like that. In cycling you jerks, not in world politics (don't start with the George Bush analogies already).

And Floyd has God on his side. The way I look at it if Floyd wins, I'll be ecstatic. And if Jan wins, I'll be very happy too (my family is German, I really love Jan). If Basso wins - well My Guy has won the Tour for 7 years straight and 10 out of the last 20. So you can't win 'em all. Even Lance can't. I hear Sheryl dumped HIM : ).
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Old 03-13-06, 08:19 PM
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Originally Posted by patentcad
Man, what a great read. The **** That Will Kill Them. You gotta love it. The most impressive thing about Lance is that he's a hard boy harder than all those Euro hard boys. And those Euro cyclist dudes are friggin TOUGH dudes. So they can take all that "Lance EPO" crap and shove it straight up their Euro friggin asses. Hey, just like Lance shoved SEVEN Tdf wins up there. God, how great is that? Take THAT away you Euro Weenies. Good luck.

Now let's all sing Kum Bay Ya around the campfire for World Peace. F that.

You know what? I was going to root for Jan (Nicest Guy in Cycling) this year, but not now. Floyd Landis is another Pissed off American Who Wants to Kick the World's Ass. And I like that. In cycling you jerks, not in world politics (don't start with the George Bush analogies already).
You a Lancer 99er?

Calm down, buddie. Your hatred of Euro "weenies" is misplaced. The fact is that they are the riders who have made racing what it is and have given us 95% of this cycling history we love. The also still dominate racing.

On the bike Lance is not harder than your average Euro rider. He doesn't ride well in cold weather and only races two months of the season. Guys like Boonen and Zabel are the hard me in the peloton.

Floyd is not a "pissed off American" out to show up a bunch of Euros. Knock off the dramatics. He's just a talented rider doing what he loves and winning the occasional race.
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Old 03-13-06, 08:42 PM
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It's a good book, but it's not the best cycling book I've ever read. David Walsh's 'Kelly' and the book he ghost wrote for Roche were better.
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Old 03-13-06, 10:00 PM
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Excellent book. Picked it up about a week ago and tore through it in two sittings. One thing I liked was that the author is not a Lance-worshipper. He set out to tell the tale of an undeniably complex character, and he did it well. Another was all the little bits... the fragments of information about other characters and situations that pop up through the book. The chapter on Floyd Landis ("The Book of Floyd") is damn good reading no matter how you cut it. Highly recommended.
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Old 03-13-06, 10:18 PM
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yes. definitely a great read with snippets of other riders. better than "chasing lance". that one was boring.
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Old 03-13-06, 11:28 PM
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Currently reading "Its not about the Bike," and although the writing isn't top notch the story is pretty captivating. I tried to get through 23 days in July but it's barely bathroom reading material.
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Old 03-14-06, 06:13 AM
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Originally Posted by PenguinDeD
Currently reading "Its not about the Bike," and although the writing isn't top notch the story is pretty captivating. I tried to get through 23 days in July but it's barely bathroom reading material.
Lance's books are fine, but they're like PR releases compared to 'Lance's War', which seems far more balanced and objective. The man is a BIT of a nut job in some ways - great ways to be sure - and that comes out more in the 'War' book. I actually found the real Lance more compelling than the Official Version Lance has put out there.
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Old 03-14-06, 07:29 AM
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Grow up patentcad.
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Old 03-14-06, 08:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Artmo
Grow up patentcad.
What's the point of that? And if I did that how could I ever participate in this unbelievable weeniefest with boneheads like you?
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Old 03-14-06, 10:12 AM
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Originally Posted by teetopkram
I really like the glare of his teammate in the front row, partially hidden by the official. I bet he's thinking to himself, "Gee, I wonder how many times Vino will chase me down in a break this season?"
Read Stephen Roche's remarks re T-Mobile and der Jan at Pez. Concise assessment. Jan isn't mentally tough enough to win this (or any?) year. Team isn't constructed to help him. Basso is his favorite.

Like Vino's aggressiveness. Don't blame him for attacking at the Tour -- his team was busy squeezing pimples on their collective backsides waiting for the Kaiser to decide whether or not he was a champion...
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Old 03-14-06, 10:19 AM
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Lance's War was a good book. Objectively portrays Lance as well or better than anything else for the last 5-6 years. So much butt-kissing and hero-worship out there that when someone implies that the guy might be a little bit of a pric_, it's like a cool breeze. Whatever Lance did and whoever he was or wasn't, he certainly raised the bar previously set by Greg L. Now a wave of Americans can step up and continue to elevate the intelligent, scientific, athletic approach to a beautiful sport. If the continentals (French) don't want to play their own game like it has to be played in order to win it, oh, well. Leipheimer, Landis, and perhaps Zabriskie and Danielson will carry things forward.
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Old 03-14-06, 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Veloduo
Lance's War was a good book. Objectively portrays Lance as well or better than anything else for the last 5-6 years. So much butt-kissing and hero-worship out there that when someone implies that the guy might be a little bit of a pric_, it's like a cool breeze. Whatever Lance did and whoever he was or wasn't, he certainly raised the bar previously set by Greg L. Now a wave of Americans can step up and continue to elevate the intelligent, scientific, athletic approach to a beautiful sport. If the continentals (French) don't want to play their own game like it has to be played in order to win it, oh, well. Leipheimer, Landis, and perhaps Zabriskie and Danielson will carry things forward.
Lance was no boy scout in certain respects - and in other ways he kind of showed all the Euro mopes How It's Done. And they appear to have learned a thing or two from all of this (maybe they noticed this American dude pissing on their Tour de France plans season after season). Jan and the Telekom boys reconnoitering the Tour mtn stages in June? Duh. How the hell did all these idiots EVER ride a Tour de France without knowing EVERY big climb? Any Cat IV Racer knows how essential THAT is. You kind of need to know where the killer interminable climb ENDS, particularly in a bike race. Was that so complicated it took 100 years for some kid from Texas to figure it out? Or are all those Euro bike weenies just that dense?

I don't care who likes Lance. He reminds me of myself in some ways (and if you hadn't noticed I don't particularly care who likes ME either). The fact that much of Europe can't stand him makes me like him so much BETTER. You can wring your Euro hands all you want and Texas will STILL be bigger'n France. The fact that all his opponents bought into Lance's sophmoric head games makes THEM the chumps, not him.
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Old 03-14-06, 03:16 PM
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You said it. What the Italians always called "polemica" just seems like so much playground name-calling. Another thread has a debate brewing over who's the bigger a-hole, Lance or Robbie Mc. Doesn't much matter, when you ask yourself about who's been getting results. Love it that non-Euros are schooling those guys repeatedly, event after event, year after year. Thanks, Lance. Thanks, Robbie, you little pric_.

Fear the BARBER!
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Old 03-14-06, 03:22 PM
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Originally Posted by patentcad
What's the point of that? And if I did that how could I ever participate in this unbelievable weeniefest with boneheads like you?
Weeniefest? How many threads have you started about this book? I realize its bathroom reading for you, but your amorous comments about Lance are leading me to understand why you read it in the bathroom.
This is one person's perspective, from a person who is very PR and marketting savvy.
 
Old 03-14-06, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by patentcad

I don't care who likes Lance. He reminds me of myself in some ways
LOL...either increase your dosage, or halve it.
I prefered your posts about slimy foreigners stealing american jobs.
 
Old 03-14-06, 06:03 PM
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Originally Posted by DocRay
LOL...either increase your dosage, or halve it.
I prefered your posts about slimy foreigners stealing american jobs.
Hey *******, you've called me xenophobic (based on NOTHING) and now there's this bull**** about 'foreigners stealing American jobs'. Where did THAT come from you moron? A comment about the RAMPANT outsourcing that's going on in the world right now? Maybe that eluded you because you're media-challenged.

Why don't you READ the book? I believe there's a large type middle school version that might work for you. If not you can work up to it.

Good grief you Fred from Hell, if you spent 1/10 the energy RIDING YOUR BIKE as you do PERSONALLY ATTACKING ME every chance you get, you might actually have something to post about here. Did you ride today? No? I did. And yesterday. And the day before, and the 14 straight days before that. That's why I'm here. What's your excuse?

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Old 03-14-06, 09:06 PM
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^thanks for the PM.

I seriously suggest you consult a mental health professional.
 
Old 03-15-06, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by DocRay
^thanks for the PM.

I seriously suggest you consult a mental health professional.
If I were in Canada I could put my name on the list. I'd see somebody in 2007.
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Old 03-15-06, 01:44 PM
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I've read it, I personally liked a few others better 'A Signifigant Other' is a good one. I did learn a few things from it like:

-Lance is probably not a very good friend to have
-Lance has a huge ego (which isn't a bad thing)
-Lance is a control freak (which isn't a bad thing)
-Floyd Landis is an interesting talent (but not an angry american)

I've always found that great athletes dont make good personalities. This transcends across cycling. I dont worship the like some do (I've always seen that as a weakness).
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Old 03-15-06, 02:50 PM
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Patentcad - As has been said/written many times before, Lance is the greatest TdF rider ever, but he's still not the best racer ever and now never will be. Outside of Le Tour, Lance did bugger all relative to many Euro riders, e.g. Merckx, Hinault, Indurain etc and most of them succeeded without radios, wind tunnel prep and millions spent on equipment and training. Just imagine what they could have done with all that stuff which Lance has had. They rode and won hundreds if not thousands of races/stages!! The honor of best all-round rider ever goes, IMHO, to Eddie Merckx (he's a European, BTW). As for the Euros not liking Lance, that is mostly from the press, not the run of the mill population. Well, actually, I don't think he's a very likeable type of person, but that is beside the point. People in Europe respect what he has done and are frankly amazed by his achievements, especially after his illness.

Sorry, I haven't read the book, so I don't know exactly what you are waffling on about, except that you seem a bit immature. All this talk about p*****g on Europeans etc is soooooooo childish.

"It's not about the bike" was good and certainly helped a good friend (European) of mine in his battle with cancer.
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