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Bethel 4/6: Second race easier?

Old 04-06-08, 03:08 PM
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isuffer
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Bethel 4/6: Second race easier?

Night before race: Had dinner with friends, drank a few beers and went to bed at 12am.
Race day: woke up 6:30am, felt tired and weak

First race: Raced 4's, cool temps but not freezing. 21mph average, stop & go and jittery group. Felt weak and not full on. Back of pack during final sprint.

Second race: Master's 40+, after an hour break after the first race. Had some PB&J and hot tea during break. Mild warm up before going to line. 23mph average, good steady group. Objective was to stay with the group and finish.

Outcome: I felt much better and stronger during the second race. I had expected to be suffering to stay with the group but ended up finishing with front 1/3 of group during the sprint.

Question: Was my first race more of a warm up, thus my second race being the better race? Three weeks prior, I had done the same two races and the second race was much harder. Perhaps improved fitness?

Or did I sweat out the beers during the first race, making the second race easier?
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Old 04-06-08, 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by isuffer View Post
Night before race: Had dinner with friends, drank a few beers and went to bed at 12am.
Race day: woke up 6:30am, felt tired and weak

First race: Raced 4's, cool temps but not freezing. 21mph average, stop & go and jittery group. Felt weak and not full on. Back of pack during final sprint.

Second race: Master's 40+, after an hour break after the first race. Had some PB&J and hot tea during break. Mild warm up before going to line. 23mph average, good steady group. Objective was to stay with the group and finish.

Outcome: I felt much better and stronger during the second race. I had expected to be suffering to stay with the group but ended up finishing with front 1/3 of group during the sprint.

Question: Was my first race more of a warm up, thus my second race being the better race? Three weeks prior, I had done the same two races and the second race was much harder. Perhaps improved fitness?

Or did I sweat out the beers during the first race, making the second race easier?
considering the low avg speed of the 1st race, probably.
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Old 04-06-08, 03:16 PM
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God if the 4's were slow, I don't even want to know what my average was for the races...
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Old 04-07-08, 07:21 AM
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I was in that race. It wasn't super quick but then I suppose that the little climb x22 brings down the average speed a bit. I didn't think the 4s were that sketchy though there was a bit of lawn surfing on the bell lap.
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Old 04-07-08, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by 92degrees View Post
lawn surfing on the bell lap.
? where

Headwind on the hill, kind of unusual, made for very slow climbing - 12 mph at times for the 3-4 race. Hence bunching up at base of hill (when the wind hit).

cdr
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Old 04-07-08, 08:25 AM
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Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
? where

Headwind on the hill, kind of unusual, made for very slow climbing - 12 mph at times for the 3-4 race. Hence bunching up at base of hill (when the wind hit).

cdr

Maybe 100yds before the course turns right for the climb? I can't remember who it was. He handled it nicely. He was near the front, went onto the grass, and came back on the course without really losing much position. A few of use had to brake but it wasn't dramatic. I was further back than I would have liked for the sprint but the right side opened up pretty wide and I got a few people on the hill.
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Old 04-07-08, 08:49 AM
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Originally Posted by 92degrees View Post
I was in that race. It wasn't super quick but then I suppose that the little climb x22 brings down the average speed a bit. I didn't think the 4s were that sketchy though there was a bit of lawn surfing on the bell lap.
I guess compared to M40's the 4's had a lot of stop and go. One rider bounces on his seat when he pedals and swings side to side. I couldn't get away from him.
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Old 04-07-08, 08:53 AM
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Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
? where

Headwind on the hill, kind of unusual, made for very slow climbing - 12 mph at times for the 3-4 race. Hence bunching up at base of hill (when the wind hit).

cdr
One of the Danny's Cycle guys was trying to give a leadout but got choked at the curb as the group was bending to the right, just before the glass building, and was forced to hop onto the grass. Nice recovery
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Old 04-07-08, 10:29 AM
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Originally Posted by isuffer View Post
I guess compared to M40's the 4's had a lot of stop and go. One rider bounces on his seat when he pedals and swings side to side. I couldn't get away from him.
The dark-skinned guy in the dark blue patterned outfit in the 4's ?? I told him 2 weeks ago he should ride rollers to smooth him out .... made me nervous
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Old 04-07-08, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by isuffer View Post
One of the Danny's Cycle guys was trying to give a leadout but got choked at the curb as the group was bending to the right, just before the glass building, and was forced to hop onto the grass. Nice recovery
I was wondering how a rider would get on the grass because there's basically curb all the way around, and bunny hopping up the curb would be somewhat tricky if it wasn't planned. There's that one bend at the end of the back stretch where the curb is gone, but that's about it.

cdr
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Old 04-07-08, 11:19 AM
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Originally Posted by isuffer View Post
Question: Was my first race more of a warm up, thus my second race being the better race?
I have a different theory. Well, I think the first race did warm you up a bit. But I think what's more significant is that the Masters goes up the hill faster. In the 4s you slow more before the hill then accelerate up it. Accelerating uphill is much, much harder than accelerating on the flat, so if you go into the hill fast, it's easier than if you go into the hill slow.

With the 4s, everyone's a 4. You roll into the hill at 24 mph, slow to maybe 14-16 mph as the front bogs down, then accelerate back up to 24 mph to get to Turn One with the field.

In the M40+, there are a bunch of Cat 2s, some 1s, and lots of semi-sandbagging 3s. So you get the same guys who could probably win a P123 race driving the pace at the bottom of the hill. Sitting in, you coast into the hill at 28-30 mph, roll up it while slowing to 24, then cruise through Turn One at 26 mph. Much easier.

I find that the P123 race is easier on the hill than the 3-4 race due to the more consistent pace. But my legs start going away after 2 hours of racing so I sit up (last week we had 7 to go).

cdr
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Old 04-07-08, 11:36 AM
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the 2nd cat 5 race averaged i think 23 mph. it was pretty fast paced
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Old 04-07-08, 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Homebrew01 View Post
The dark-skinned guy in the dark blue patterned outfit in the 4's ?? I told him 2 weeks ago he should ride rollers to smooth him out .... made me nervous
Bingo. He's the one. Scary.
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Old 04-07-08, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by isuffer View Post
Bingo. He's the one. Scary.
Can someone point him out to me if he's at the next Bethel?

cdr
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Old 04-07-08, 01:34 PM
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Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
Can someone point him out to me if he's at the next Bethel?

cdr
Will do.
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Old 04-07-08, 01:52 PM
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Originally Posted by grafsk8er View Post
the 2nd cat 5 race averaged i think 23 mph. it was pretty fast paced
Really???

SWEET! I was near the front for most of that race, and at/off the front for a good bit. That average makes me happy.

I'm not sure I want to put a computer on my bike. I think seeing speed/cadence numbers will be distracting. I guess I could just choose not to look...
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Old 04-07-08, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by ridethecliche View Post
SWEET! I was near the front for most of that race, and at/off the front for a good bit. That average makes me happy.
grafsk8er WON that race, if I'm not mistaken.
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Old 04-07-08, 02:12 PM
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Originally Posted by carpediemracing View Post
? where

Headwind on the hill, kind of unusual, made for very slow climbing - 12 mph at times for the 3-4 race. Hence bunching up at base of hill (when the wind hit).

cdr
First off, congrats on your win!

Second, did the wind pick up after the 5's race? I felt everyone was going up the hill ridiculously slow and it tired me out to slow down and stay with them, so I just sped up it anyway. Everyone would slow down towards the hill and I'd get faster. I found myself in the front a few times after that hill and I was really hoping that it wouldn't have happened that way. Maybe I'll actually try to stay at the front next time...
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Old 04-07-08, 02:43 PM
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The dark-skinned guy in the dark blue patterned outfit in the 4's ?? I told him 2 weeks ago he should ride rollers to smooth him out .... made me nervous
Was that the guy with the Ti Triple triangle GT? Yeah, he almost went down by himself but somehow managed to save it.

I did those same two races as well, the 4s and then the Masters/Juniors and the second one did seem easier. I felt way better, however the wind really picked up between the first and second which made it much harder to move up. I finished with the field as I couldn't get around, but still got 2nd in the juniors (out of 2, oh well) and walked away with $15. The other junior was first in the field sprint behind the break.
I also felt way better at the end of the 2nd race, as in the 1st one I felt like I was going to almost throw up.
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Old 04-07-08, 04:00 PM
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Congrats on the win Graf!

Come say hi this weekend if you're going to be around! I'll be at plainville and bethel. I'm going to be racing a purple Trek 760 with red/yellow splash bar tape with Neuvation wheels. I haven't taken the Neuvation decals off yet so you'll know that it's me. I'll also be wearing a Wesleyan University Kit. See ya around hopefully!
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Old 04-07-08, 08:37 PM
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Originally Posted by ridethecliche View Post
Second, did the wind pick up after the 5's race? I felt everyone was going up the hill ridiculously slow and it tired me out to slow down and stay with them, so I just sped up it anyway. Everyone would slow down towards the hill and I'd get faster. I found myself in the front a few times after that hill and I was really hoping that it wouldn't have happened that way. Maybe I'll actually try to stay at the front next time...
Yeah, I think so. It seemed unusual to have a head wind going up the hill. It's usually hitting us from the left or from behind. Between 4's and M40+, the wind picked up going towards the hill and got much colder than the morning.
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Old 04-08-08, 08:17 PM
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i would definitely be there on sunday, but i'm going away for spring break, and i leave saturday morning so i can't make it. i'm sure we'll meet some time, i plan on doing a couple more crits and road races throughout the year in ny and ct.
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