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Intervals and what else? TSS

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Intervals and what else? TSS

Old 06-27-08, 06:49 PM
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Bnjmn
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Intervals and what else? TSS

A question for those that do intervals- what do you do in addition to intervals on your interval days?
I currently do 2 x 20min, 1 x 60min (at 95% of FTP), 6 x 4min, as well as a long ride (nearly 5 hour 250 TSS 3200kj ride). I am planning on adding 5-7 x 1min WRI intervals.
This week I obtained a healthy (20 watt) boost in my 2 x 20min intervals, so I accordingly upped my FTP in the WKO+ Performance Manager. As a result, it is tougher to build up the TSS points- after today's tough 6 x 4min intervals, all my stress/training scores actually dropped. I feel like if I keep doing what I am doing, I will not keep raising my CTL/ATL and dropping my TSB, meaning I will not be overloading myself (to the same extent) anymore.
Do you guys add tempo rides or SST rides to your interval days to build up your TSS? With positive results? Or add more intervals (like 3 x 15 instead of 2 x 20 or add a 1 x 10 to the 2 x 20)? Or both?

Thanks,
Ben
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Old 06-27-08, 07:01 PM
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I think you might be getting caught up in the whole TSS thing. What you are concerned about is adaptation, and although TSS is a useful metric for some things at the end of the day it is pretty meaningless.

That being said, if you raised your FTP, your intensity should go up to accommodate the change. If you were at 95% FTP on the 60 min ride, you should stay there and your TSS will remain the same for that ride.
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Old 06-27-08, 07:04 PM
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I really just do the intervals and easy recover between them. During the brief warmup, I usually do a couple jumps at full interval intensity for only 20% of the planned duration (so, 1m at 400W for my 5m intervals, or 5-10s at ~800W for my 1m intervals).

I think that after your intervals, if you have time, an endurance ride would be fine, maybe working up to SST if it started to feel right. I don't think that's as valuable as the intervals though. It'll help build aerobic base if you don't have several years of miles in your legs. With my history, I don't need the extra volume to compete in 2.5-3.0 hour road races. I tend to get a couple 60 mile training rides in each month, and that's plenty of endurance work for me.
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Old 06-27-08, 08:12 PM
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focus on the intervals for the day. Make those as high quality as you can.

The rest of the ride is warm up, recovery, and cool down.

If it's a hard interval workout, and you still feel like riding hard when the interval work is done, you didn't do the intervals hard enough.

At most fill the balance of the time riding at an endurance pace.
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Old 06-27-08, 08:18 PM
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When I'm in the hunt for training stress, I do the following:

2x20 days are rare, but they're always followed by 90 min of Zone1 riding, Zone3-4 on the hills. Typically my threshold days are 90-120 min @ upper Zone3/low Zone4, 30 min warm up, 30 min cool down.

VO2max days are 4-5 x 4 min intervals, 1:1 recovery. 60ish min of Zone1 riding before starting, working up to Zone3 for warming up. Do the intervals and 60ish min of cool down.

1 day per week of Zone2, Zone 4-5 on hills ~ 2 1/2 hours.

2 days 4-4 hrs, Zone1 flats, Zone3-4 hills.

1 day ZoneR 90-120 min.

If I'm feeling fresh enough, the first of my weekend 4 hr days will start with 60-90 min of SST 91-93% FTP.

That's what I do, and I love being on the bike 16ish hours per week. Fact is, once you get the intensity dialed in, volume is the only thing you can add to increase training load.
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Old 06-27-08, 09:43 PM
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Concentrate on the intensity and competing the interval at the goal wattage. After that, depending on how you feel, try to tack on 30-40 minutes of tempo to make it a solid long ride. At least that is how I do it.

I don't really have long rides planned at L2 intensity. My longest ride of the week starts out with 90 minutes or so at low L4, with high L2/ low L3 to stretch it out.

I'd also be careful about bumping up your FTP on the basis of 2X20. Though it sounds as if a 20 watt increase would warrant a bump.
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Old 06-28-08, 10:50 AM
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I'm not sure WTF all these darn acronyms mean (like TSS). But it looks like you're doing a lot of threshold work and I'm curious where the high intensity stuff is in your training, as well as when the resting happens?

As for my training.. I typically ride 4 days a week. One day a week I'll do ladders (1m/2m/3m/4m/5m/4m/3m/2m/1m). One day a week I'll do speed work (sprints and "crit" intervals 15s on/15s off).

OR I'll do the twice weekly group hammerfest and try to ride off the front every chance I get and still do easier rides on the weekends.

As for 20 minute or longer intervals, every month our cycling club holds a 10 mile TT and I'll go do that. Actually, it was this morning..

Race weeks = off monday, hard tuesday, easy wednesday, off thursday, openers friday, race weekend.

I'm only riding 8-10 hours a week. I don't have much in the way of results this year (a top 10, a bunch of top-20s, and I won a prime), but I'm having fun and at the end of the day that's all that matters.

Last edited by kensuf; 06-28-08 at 10:58 AM.
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Old 06-28-08, 05:57 PM
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Thanks for all the replies. I ended up going by feel and doing about 30 minutes at "tempo" pacing (for all of 27 TSS points) in addition to 5 x 1min, WRI style. I still didn't break 100 TSS overall though. I guess that is not surprising. But, tomorrow is a big day (short race + long ride) so I need to be somewhat rested.

Regarding days off/rest days:
I tend to do blocks to 2 or 3 long/intense days at a time, and take a rest day - either off the bike or a super easy 15 or so mile ride. So, 1 or 2 days off per week, and about 11-12 hours on the bike (with about 4.5 hours coming from the weekly long ride).
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Old 06-28-08, 06:41 PM
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Corners.
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Old 06-28-08, 11:10 PM
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are u cat 1 or 2?
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Old 06-30-08, 11:18 AM
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Originally Posted by Geoff326 View Post
are u cat 1 or 2?
Only on the famous e-wang chart, otherwise I am a cat 5 with 3 races under my belt.

I could get by without the long weekend ride since my races are short (17 miles), but I am really training for a solo 40 day/5000 mile trip from LA to Philadelphia that I will be starting in the beginning of August. That also means I could forego the WRI-style 1min intervals, but it really helps set the bar for what "pain" feels like, which helps for all the other intervals. As an example, a bit of Emmanuel Sella-style 58rpm big ring climbing up 8% grades yesterday wasn't so bad, compared to the stress of 1min intervals.

After I get back from my cross-country adventure (which is my post-bar exam vacation), I start my "real job" and I'll get a coach as well.
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